The Holy Trinity...FINALLY.

[Superlaz]

In the Angelfish world…the “holy Trinity” all three species of Pterophyllum…and all F0 
ALtums F0
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00121-1.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00124-1.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00044-3.jpg
Pterophyllum Leopold F0
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00009-3.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00010-3.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00011-3.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00032-3.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00033-5.jpg
Pterophllum Scalare (Peruvian) F0
The one on the left ;)
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00056-4.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00059-2.jpg
In the middle:
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y271/Superlaz/DSC00062.jpg

[JuanTamad]

Got back from my vacation, last week, Laz.

As far as I know they are all wild caught. The importer told me the Altums were from Colombia, The Leos were from Brazil, and the Scalares were from Peru.

How much if I buy them back?

I Also have some from Guiana with my remaining Altums and Heckels.:)

[Death Pony]

The peruvian one looks cool!!! Very nice stripes.

[DigThemLows]

Nice discus too!

[snaggle]

very nice I hipe to some day have that kind of luck.

[Greenspot]

Might have to get me some angels! I really like the discus too!

[ewok]

very cool! would you mind sharing with us your source for these?

[Bogwoodbruce]

They look amazing,

[DigThemLows]

I keep researching Altums and the more I read the more I get confused, from what I can tell yours aren't true Altums correct? Can someone explain once and for all the "altum" angel. There's only one right?

[phillausten]

Can someone explain once and for all the "altum" angel. There's only one right?
Depends on who you ask this question to!
IMHO the ornamental fish trade is happy to "muddy the water" by describing several attractive Scalare variants as "Altum", "Peruvian Altum", "Altum peruensis" etc.
The other P. Altum (the real one!) was originally collected (and described) from the Orinoco drainage. This is a larger fish than the Scalares having a tall body, accentuated by tall fins (especially noticeable on juveniles), wider bars (the colour of which it can vary from sepia through browns to jet black, according to mood) ochreish scribble markings and blue suffusion on the dorsal contour, a solid "comma" mood spot on the operculum (again displayed according to mood), a larger eye and mouth than the Scalare, and a horrendous mortality when newly imported.
To pile on the confusion, several people have asserted that the "true" Altum also inhabits some of the upper parts of the Rio Negro drainage. Heiko Bleher is insistant that the Rio Negro fish are a lovely Scalare similar to the Orinoco Altum (having somewhat shorter fins) but breedable in captivity, hence, he asserts the source of the line of tank bred fish from Horste Linke.
In captivity at least, the Orinoco type Altum shows a lesser fin to body ratio when adult, the body tends to bulk up, but the fins do not appear to increase in proportion, so the adults do not exhibit the extremely elegant proportions of the juveniles.
to add a bit more confusion, all the characteristics of the Orinoco fish with the possible exception of the large eye, mouth and solid mood spot, appear to occur in individual Scalare variants. Still confused? you should be, working out the lineage and source of these lovely fish is very much a work in progress.

[JuanTamad]

Laz,

Don't let anybody convince you that the Altums you show in the top pics are not true Altums. They are as Mr. Austen described as true Altums when they were juveniles and had their long flowing ventrals. They are Colombian Orinoco Altums and cured from the disease that inflicts most Altums that come from Colombia or Venezuela. I got them about 4 years ago. Their size alone should be good proof of what they are. The Peruvian one you show in the last pic which show similar shape and other features will never grow as big as the ones in the first pic.

However, I'll be more than glad to give back all your money if you return the Altums together with everything else you got for it minus the tanks. Call or e-mail me for arrangements. I don't visit here much to see or address your concerns in a timely fashion.

[TrikkyMakk]

Nice fish.

[phillausten]

Here is a link to some photos comparing adult Altum with juveniles, the adult fish is a bit knocked about, presumably from catching and transportation but it gives some idea of the differences. www.mikofish.com/altum.html the photos I am talking about are at the bottom of the page.

[riiz]

The peruvians namesake is confusing atm, as I wouldnt really call your wild scalare, peruvians.

There are 3 possibilities of their lineage. The first one is that they are altum and scalare cross, which is technically impossible. Second idea is that they are a totally different species from scalare. And third, they might be tank spawned and raised altums, that were released into peru by dealers. Also scalare do inhabit the same waters as the peruvian as well.

[phillausten]

Why is a Scalare / Altum cross technically impossible?

[riiz]

Cause they wont crossbreed naturally. It might be possible if someone combined the eggs and sperm they collected separately, like the controversial yoyo/clown loach mix.

And again, the peruvian and altum strains live in different bodies of water.