View Full Version : Let ME know
iheartfishies
07-18-2005, 7:40 PM
So I started working at a LFS, and the dude that owns it is 21.
He's bi-polar and is very stubborn.
He can't keep Saltwater fish and is always throwing tons of copper...(Copper something made my seachem) in the system, same with the freshwater system, but all it does it kill MY SNAILS.
He's convinced that by dosing the SW system with tons of copper whatever will fix the few spots of ich the Sailfin tang has in one of the tanks....(cause his QUAR system is not up to par to him.) Then what happens?...AYellow tang, yellow striped/maroon/ Perc clowns all die. All the perfectly healthy fish. Then he goes on to tell me that if a DOSE of copper killed them they weren't actually healthy anyway....
NOw, I don't know Much about Saltwater fish, but is this a reasonable way to cure a saltwater fish, by taking out all the healthy looking ones that we had for months? or is it possible that THOSE OTHER fish we had for months actually had something DEEP down inside and they where just waiting to die like he tells me constantly?...
DeLgAdO
07-18-2005, 8:22 PM
i think the copper overdose killed em.
saltwater fishes have a lower tollerance of copper than freshwater fish, he should have used melafix and or pimafix.
cenecker
07-19-2005, 1:47 AM
I'm not much of a saltwater guy - in fact I barely know anything about it - BUT working at an LFS I got a chance to talk to a lot of real serious SW guys. Pretty much NONE OF THEM will EVER MEDICATE thier fish with copper or even malacite green (sp?) because the effect that medications in general have on water quality is generally worse for the fish and system in general than whatever disease it's supposed to prevent.
Sounds like the owner of your LFS is the worst kind of idiot - the kind with enough knowledge to think he knows everything. I really can't stand those people and there are WAY too many of them in the pet trade in general....ugh...
Okay off my soap box......
sleepyflight
07-19-2005, 5:45 AM
KILL HIM, COPPER/strawberry bananna milkshake :devil: :angryfire
Copper is really bad for inverts, esp. Start dosing Him with copper, or at least lithium.
WOW!!! :rofl:
That guy should not be running a fish store.
What's the #? I want to call him so I can express my feelings.. I dont think they have an appropriate place here.
BTW, Copper kills inverts and destroy biological filtration, as well as Live Rock and basically anything else living. It also kills scale-less fish. It ALSO leaches into plastics, and silicons and becomes a very permanent thing. So, in other words, good luck keeping Inverts on a system that has been copperized.
Also, when using copper or malachite green.. If it kills off your biological filtration, you are screwed.. Especially in a Saltwater System. Ammonia is more toxic the higher the pH is, and if the pH is at 8.5+, than even the smallest amount of ammonia will eradicate those fish quite rapidly. This is why people have such a hard time 'establishing' a Saltwater tank, they don't understand how toxic ammonia is in saltwater.
He needs to get a Quarnatine tank so he can pull the fish, and use the hypersalinity method for SW Ich.. Or atleast a QT Tank that you don't mind throwing copper into. If he knows so much, he should know this..
Maybe next time his fish get sick, he should try feeding them pennies.
Cenecker couldn't of said it better.
Wow, I am still amazed. What a Dolt.
CAMERON
07-19-2005, 4:25 PM
ARE YOU STILL ON LINE RIGHT NOW.
CAMERON
07-19-2005, 4:27 PM
I NEED HELP. I'M KNEW WHERE AND REALLY DONT KNOW HOW TO WORK THIS
bluedempsey
07-19-2005, 4:27 PM
i own a saltwater fish store...
in my own experience... copper cures ick..
but i use it as a last resort
i'm going to tell u a story about copper
one of my best customers.... really into sw
had a very established tank
well he went on vacation for 5 days ..
and when he returned every single thing was
dead!!!! i tested all the water, everything was fine
amon. nitrite, nitrate. everything within range.there where
spikes in the levels but normal considering everything was dead
so i tested copper..... it was sky high... but he never added copper.
he decided to start from scratch, took out everything, rocks,sand everything
well a day later he comes and tells me he found 2 pennys in there.
copper!
pretty deadly :headshake
I NEED HELP. I'M KNEW WHERE AND REALLY DONT KNOW HOW TO WORK THIS
Cameron, this is a post forum not a chatline, find a thread that intersts you. post an on topic message, wait. Sometimes you don't get a direct response, sometimes you do but maybe not for days. Just check the threads regularaly and relax. Bluedempsey, sounds about right, in my case it was nicotine, some .... I can't think of anything bad enough, dropped a cigarrette butt in a 55g tank one night, by morning total die off.
iheartfishies
07-19-2005, 5:09 PM
WOW!!! :rofl:
That guy should not be running a fish store.
What's the #? I want to call him so I can express my feelings.. I dont think they have an appropriate place here.
BTW, Copper kills inverts and destroy biological filtration, as well as Live Rock and basically anything else living. It also kills scale-less fish. It ALSO leaches into plastics, and silicons and becomes a very permanent thing. So, in other words, good luck keeping Inverts on a system that has been copperized.
Also, when using copper or malachite green.. If it kills off your biological filtration, you are screwed.. Especially in a Saltwater System. Ammonia is more toxic the higher the pH is, and if the pH is at 8.5+, than even the smallest amount of ammonia will eradicate those fish quite rapidly. This is why people have such a hard time 'establishing' a Saltwater tank, they don't understand how toxic ammonia is in saltwater.
He needs to get a Quarnatine tank so he can pull the fish, and use the hypersalinity method for SW Ich.. Or atleast a QT Tank that you don't mind throwing copper into. If he knows so much, he should know this..
Maybe next time his fish get sick, he should try feeding them pennies.
Cenecker couldn't of said it better.
Wow, I am still amazed. What a Dolt.
I would love someone to call this guy and give him a piece of their mind.
He was handed this store about a year ago, and knew nothing about S/W.
Now he thinks he's the master because he's read soooo many books.
He's even had customers, who've kept s/w for years, give him advice, and he sticks his nose up in the air like he's hot ****, and tells me they don't know WHAT their talking about. All he does is talk talk talk and use REALLY big words that half the time I don't even think he knows. Even customers are just kinda like..."Wow, ok, he knows HUGE words that I don't know, HE MUST know what he's talking about!" :shakehead
Now the Freshwater side is mine.. and I want snails.....and he's DOSED it in copper like 5 times.
WTF do I do about it?!? :cry:
Try and find a state or university site on effects of copper on invertabrates, make him read it. Explain the term invertabrate. See if that works. If it doesn't wait until no one is looking and toss him a stone fish. Wait until he dies, call 911. deal with new owner. Repeat as needed.
iheartfishies
07-19-2005, 6:46 PM
Try and find a state or university site on effects of copper on invertabrates, make him read it. Explain the term invertabrate. See if that works. If it doesn't wait until no one is looking and toss him a stone fish. Wait until he dies, call 911. deal with new owner. Repeat as needed.
IT would probably be me!
I don't need THAT kind of responsibility!
But how do I remove the already present Copper from my tanks?...
I've tried 2 consecutive weeks, and the coppers still there, even with lots of water changes!
rayman45
07-19-2005, 7:22 PM
umm
i dono
more carbon alot more is my guess
snails blow hairy ones
i got one like a baseball if you want
IT would probably be me!
I don't need THAT kind of responsibility!
But how do I remove the already present Copper from my tanks?...
I've tried 2 consecutive weeks, and the coppers still there, even with lots of water changes!
It is a pain, copper binds to gravel, silicone, and plastics inc. acrylics. I had to scrub some salmon egg hatching trays. Drain and dry everything, scrub with white vinegar and rinse clean. should work.
iheartfishies
07-19-2005, 8:17 PM
So I have DRAIN ALL 30 tanks and scrub out all my sumps and EVERYTHING?
The Bio Balls are encased in it too?!...
iheartfishies
07-19-2005, 11:55 PM
KILL HIM, COPPER/strawberry bananna milkshake :devil: :angryfire
:hitting: I just saw that....Maybe I will try it.
So I have DRAIN ALL 30 tanks and scrub out all my sumps and EVERYTHING?
The Bio Balls are encased in it too?!...
Yep, we lost some 500 trays of hatchlings, had to clean trays, tubes, pumps, filters and screens. lots of water changes will help if you can make your water more acid first, the acidity frees up the acid so you can flush it. depending on your copper levels now just try replcing substrates and partial filter media change, then recheck. Egg sack fry salmon are really sensitive to metals.
Don't let your fish smoke it will give them gill cancer!
AlaskaJammin
08-06-2005, 10:18 AM
What I do at my LFS is run one salt water tank with a light dose of copper in it. Whenver I get a sick fish I simply dump him in the quarunteen tank and usually it either clears up or the fish dies. Either way I am free to have live rock and healthy fish in all the other tanks. Your boss seems like a moron, tell him to call pet zoo in alaska if he needs any advice. :)