carbon useless?

[wright4lfe]

on a different fish forum they keep saying there is no reason to keep carbon in my filters and that it is only good for removing medication and really only affective for a week or two and then it loses its effectiveness.

what say you my monsterfishkeeper friends?

[elevatethis]

They're right. After a few days and the carbon is exhausted, it becomes nothing more than a bed for your nitrifying bacteria - which isn't a bad thing per se - but its not removing any chemicals and whatnot anymore.

[AquataHolic420]

Carbon = Good.

[GJC]

I have not used carbon in any of my filters for several years now.

[amesbien]

Carbon works for a little while clearing your water and such, but after that it is just mainly used as bio-media. I have heard though that after the carbon has been exhausted, it may start to break down and release harmfull stuff, chemicals I think.(some one will know). Just use the carbon till you get the clear water, then remove it and use the space for extra bio-media.

[USMC Sniper]

Carbon works for a little while clearing your water and such, but after that it is just mainly used as bio-media. I have heard though that after the carbon has been exhausted, it may start to break down and release harmfull stuff, chemicals I think.(some one will know). Just use the carbon till you get the clear water, then remove it and use the space for extra bio-media.

No, not true. There is no leeching of the toxins from the carbon. If there was, carbon would be essentially "rechargeable" just by soaking it in water for x-period of time. All the toxins would then simply leech out until it was basically usable again. The adsorption does render carbon useless pretty quickly, but as stated above, it does then become a very good home for the nitrifying bacteria. So if you're aware of that and wish to utilize it as such, you might as well just leave it in so it can continue doing at least that job.

Chuck

[johnptc]

i find my large tanks get yellow without carbon.... yes i change alot of water on a 24/7 basis.....( about 10% a day to control nitrates)

i run 7 pounds of carbon on the 2400 gallon and it seems to keep the water clear for 8 to 12 weeks.

when the water starts to yellow. i change carbon and in 24-48 hours its clear again....... cycle reapeats



on a different fish forum they keep saying there is no reason to keep carbon in my filters and that it is only good for removing medication and really only affective for a week or two and then it loses its effectiveness.

what say you my monsterfishkeeper friends?

[Connor0729]

i leave the carbon in my filter because it just adds a little more filtering power to your filter, but, although it wears out over time, it is definetly not useless.

[wright4lfe]

interesting, thanks for the opinions.

[prophets]

No, not true. There is no leeching of the toxins from the carbon. If there was, carbon would be essentially "rechargeable" just by soaking it in water for x-period of time. All the toxins would then simply leech out until it was basically usable again. The adsorption does render carbon useless pretty quickly, but as stated above, it does then become a very good home for the nitrifying bacteria. So if you're aware of that and wish to utilize it as such, you might as well just leave it in so it can continue doing at least that job.

Chuck

Er...carbon breaks down over time, therefore the absorbed chemicals will be leached back, but the difference is, the chemicals absorbed will be altered as carbon is chemically active. Just because it releases back chemicals doesn't mean its "rechargeable" as ammo chips or purigen. Carbon breaks down naturally over time which will re-release a byproduct into your water.

I haven't used carbon at all, only time is to remove any meds I put in or if I notice the water is getting yellowed, which is rare. As someone had stated, your best bet is to remove the carbon after its done its job, and replace with higher quality bio-media. :grinno:

[mostlycichlids]

The facts of using carbon...FYI

One of the most commonly used chemical filtration methods is Activated Carbon.

There are a variety of pollutants dissolved in any aquatic environment containing biological life. Dissolved ORGANIC compounds (DOC's) include proteins, amino acids, phenolic compounds, pheromones and other metabolic byproducts which are continuously being exhausted into the aquarium water by the fish or other aquatic animals.

If these organic substances are allowed to become concentrated, they will negatively impact fish feeding rates, growth rates and reproduction rates, they will lower immune system activity and promote blooms of pathogenic bacteria in the water.

These DOC's can be controlled by water changes, however a pretty rigorous maintainance schedule is required. I recommend maintaining your nitrate levels at less than 10 ppm since doing so will concurrently facilitate a low level of DOC's, something which you cannot test for. The problem is that a great many aquarists don't adhere to such a maintenance schedule and don't test for nitrates.

If you are not managing your nitrates and thus your DOC levels, chemical filtration is perhaps the best method for you. Carbon filtering removes DOC's via adsorption. As the aquarium water flows through the carbon medium, the Dissolved Organic Compounds come into contact with the surfaces of the carbon granules where they become attached. this is ADsorption --- not ABsorption. Some DOC's are adsorbed directly, whereas others combine chemically with already-captured substances. When the surfaces of the carbon become saturated, it stops working and needs to be replaced with new carbon.

Thus, carbon does exhaust over time and needs to be replaced regularly. The effectiveness of activated carbon includes:

1. Adsorption: static forces that attract particles to the carbon which allows the particles to be consumed by Bacteria that settle on the carbons surface.

2. Diffusion of gases: This process includes particles absorbed into the carbon that are turned into gases and detoxified (02 into 03).

3. Chemosorption: Particles are irreversibly bound to the carbon it self.

So how much carbon should be used? Research suggests that generally, there needs to be 4 to 10 grams of granular activated carbon (GAC) for every gallon of water depending on stocking density.

Look for activated carbon which is phosphate free. A great many carbon grades are washed with phosphoric acid in an effort to support the adsorption sites since this is cheaper than degassing. This phosphate will leach into your aquarium water and can reult in a major algae problem.

Carbon absorbs most aquarium medications, especially antibiotics. Carbon should be removed while medicating so don't forget to put it back in when tank treatment is finished.

Carbon can deplete some trace elements needed for plants to grow. It should still be used to adsorb organics but only on a montlhy basis and only for 5-7 days.

If your filter uses prepackaged cartridges containing carbon, realize that these cartridges typically contain poor quality carbon and if quality carbon is used, only 20 percent or less of the recommended amounts of GAC is present. You can slit open the cartridge and fill them with more GAC but many pad filter types simply will not hold that much. Thus, the carbon in the vast majority of filter pads on the market simply is not functioning.

In a filter, the GAC should always be placed after the mechanical filtering medium otherwise, the particulates in the water will quickly coat the surfaces of the GAC, rendering it useless.

So what's the bottom line? If you're going to use activated carbon, you've got to use QUALITY material, you've got use ENOUGH of it to work and you've got to CHANGE IT often enough to keep it functional.

Written By: Akapaul26 and Liv2padl

[Sunpoe]

I never use it.

[USMC Sniper]

Er...carbon breaks down over time, therefore the absorbed chemicals will be leached back, but the difference is, the chemicals absorbed will be altered as carbon is chemically active. Just because it releases back chemicals doesn't mean its "rechargeable" as ammo chips or purigen. Carbon breaks down naturally over time which will re-release a byproduct into your water.

I haven't used carbon at all, only time is to remove any meds I put in or if I notice the water is getting yellowed, which is rare. As someone had stated, your best bet is to remove the carbon after its done its job, and replace with higher quality bio-media. :grinno:

Uhhh, nuh uh. First of all, we're talking ADsorption, not ABsorption. Second, define "breaks down". EVERYTHING "breaks down" naturally over time, that's basic Newtonian Physics. The ADsorption process chemically bonds the toxins to the carbon, so there won't be any leaching. I'll look for the article I learned that from, which can explain it in greater deal than I can. :grinyes:

[señor_pescados_felices]

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45694&highlight=carbon

:headbang2 :thumbsup:

[USMC Sniper]

Found it -

Advantages of running carbon include removal of unwanted colors (usually yellow), unwanted odors, and removal of other miscellaneous organic waste products. Carbon also removes chloramine (overnight), but only when the carbon is new (less than 48 hours old). Still, this can be an advantage if your tapwater contains chloramine. Carbon does have a finite life, depending on how much organic waste is in the tank's water. Carbon can adsorb only so much chemical waste, and after that it just becomes an inert surface upon which (if left in long enough), bacteria may grow. Some aquarists take advantage of this fact. Since carbon provides a relatively huge surface area for bacteria, some aquarists deliberately run the same carbon for months or years. Bacteria colonize the old carbon and provide another large surface area for biological filtration. Occasionally one runs across the argument that if left in too long, carbon eventually releases its bound-up toxins. If this were true, then that means we could rejuvenate old carbon simply by putting it in water and letting it sit for a few months, after which the carbon would be cleaned of organic wastes and ready to be put back in the tank for further chemical filtration. Obviously, this does not occur. Carbon cannot be rejuvenated (unless you happen to keep a blast furnace in your spare bedroom). If you want to run GAC, you'll need to replace it every 3-4 weeks, because it will be pretty well saturated with chemical waste material by that time.

Found here - http://madhunag.tripod.com/filterchoices2.html

http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45694&highlight=carbon

:headbang2 :thumbsup:

:thumbsup::clap

[mostlycichlids]

the only thing carbon will leach is Phosphates. My article pretty much summs it up. If you are doing waterchanges weekly its not needed if you are letting your water changes go its needed bottom line..water changes will provide the same benefit to your fish as the carbon..

[hmt321]

I have heard of people using carbon in a spare HOB filter to get remnants of medications out of a tank, from what i can gather it is only good for a very short time (days)

my 2 cents

[prophets]

http://www.shallowsea.com/article.html?select-resource=10&resource-name=article

[MrFisher]

i have been using carbon for years .. i use two kinds either Chemi pure or coconut carbon...i also change it frequently , because once carbon get filled it will leach bad things back in the water..any way i never had a problem and nobody will stop me from using it :)

[mostlycichlids]

The fact is Carbon usage has been a huge dispute for many years. Some aquarists use it some dont. The fact is most carbon will leach Phosphates into your aquarium and create huge algae problems unless high quality carbon is used. Therefore carbon needs to be replaced often and if you are using high quality carbon you will be broke from buying it on a regular basis. If you change water religiously and keep nitrates under 10ppm it is essentially not necessary. I only use it to remove meds or if I go on vacation and water wont be changed for a couple of weeks. That being said ther is no wrong answer it just depends if you want to spend the money on it or not.

[johnptc]

i find it difficult to keep nitrates below 20ppm even running a continous water change system at 10 to 20 % change every 24 hours !!! so I use carbon as well..works for me :) :)



The fact is Carbon usage has been a huge dispute for many years. Some aquarists use it some dont. The fact is most carbon will leach Phosphates into your aquarium and create huge algae problems unless high quality carbon is used. Therefore carbon needs to be replaced often and if you are using high quality carbon you will be broke from buying it on a regular basis. If you change water religiously and keep nitrates under 10ppm it is essentially not necessary. I only use it to remove meds or if I go on vacation and water wont be changed for a couple of weeks. That being said ther is no wrong answer it just depends if you want to spend the money on it or not.

[mostlycichlids]

i find it difficult to keep nitrates below 20ppm even running a continous water change system at 10 to 20 % change every 24 hours !!! so I use carbon as well..works for me :) :)

really I do 50% weekly on my tanks Nitrates are always under 10ppm. If your nitrates are getting to those levels with 70-140% water changes weekly you may want to consider more filtration unless you have nitrates at the tap.or you are way overstocked

[Sunpoe]

i find it difficult to keep nitrates below 20ppm even running a continous water change system at 10 to 20 % change every 24 hours !!! so I use carbon as well..works for me :) :)

Wow your tanks must be jam packed.:nilly:

[johnptc]

really I do 50% weekly on my tanks Nitrates are always under 10ppm. If your nitrates are getting to those levels with 70-140% water changes weekly you may want to consider more filtration unless you have nitrates at the tap.

thanks for the thoughts.............no nitrates ( 3 ppm) in the tap water.........but big fish and lots of meaty food generate lots of nitrates.........the ammonia and nitrite run at 0ppm so bio is working well........also becuse the change water runs continously and the tank overflows the excess to a drain the change process is not as effective as draining and then replacing water........:D

ps the gigas by himself is at least 80 pounds !!!!

[mostlycichlids]

thanks for the thoughts.............no nitrates ( 3 ppm) in the tap water.........but big fish and lots of meaty food generate lots of nitrates.........the ammonia and nitrite run at 0ppm so bio is working well........also becuse the change water runs continously and the tank overflows the excess to a drain the change process is not as effective as draining and then replacing water........:D

aaahh I see BTW those are some impressive monster you have.

[johnptc]

aaahh I see BTW those are some impressive monster you have.


thanks !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:grinno: