albino turtle collection

[albinosunlimited]

here is some of my collection

[Gr8KarmaSF]

that last picture is sooooo cute!!!

[albinosunlimited]

more

[neoprodigy]

cool collection

[Gr8KarmaSF]

no albino frt?:D

[albinosunlimited]

:lipsseale

[neoprodigy]

no albino frt?:D
or albino chinese big headed turtle....

[albinosunlimited]

the last albino big head i know of died
there are a few albino frt floating around
i have a few other albino turtles and torts iwill get pictures of tomarrow

[albinosunlimited]

i just started collection again
i use to have albino softshells
albino malay box
albino snail eaters
albino maps
and a few others

[MicropterusSalmoides]

where do you keep them all?? pics of there set ups?

[albinosunlimited]

sorry i dont show any pictures of my rooms
but the are housed in all diffent sized glass tanks with plumbing

[Gr8KarmaSF]

the last albino big head i know of died


http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68749

:headbang2

Representing da MFK!!!!

[vicedretard]

thats an awesome collection...why dont you want to show pics of your setups...if you dont mind me asking.

[TheBloodyIrish]

The albinos are cute. Where did you get them from?

[albinosunlimited]

i get the albinos any where i can

if i showed pictures of the setups it would not be hard to figure out where they are. never know who looks on the forum. i have a huge snake collection and am worried about theft.

[Lan]

there are bunch of cuteness!!!! nice!

[dougefresh]

Nice turtles.......you said you got a large snake collection......That's what you need to post pics of!!!!

[paul112]

Hey, I know you from TT :headbang2

VERY nice collection,
Paul

[davo]

Thats an awesome collection, congrats.

[b-man]

i get the albinos any where i can

if i showed pictures of the setups it would not be hard to figure out where they are. never know who looks on the forum. i have a huge snake collection and am worried about theft.

how do you figure that? are they outdoors?

anywho, it nice to find another turt-fantic. got any cuora species? i'm keeping a colony of 2.3 trifasciatas at the moment.

p.s. i know of only 2 albino chinese bighead.

[Nic]

very nice collection of turtles

[me_wee_todded]

where did you get the double header from?
ive always wanted one.

[MicropterusSalmoides]

i saw a 2headed turtle for sale a while back but i think it was like 4000$, and i heard they dont live long usually

[dovii88]

man nice collection were can i get some albino snappers.

[Jessica Dring]

i saw a 2headed turtle for sale a while back but i think it was like 4000$, and i heard they dont live long usually

Yeah turtles like that have 'faulty' genes. I'm just wondering if you know that albino turtles often come ridden with health problems? Eg: Blindness etc and god forbid they should breed..
Im not having a go at you, they're cute in any case, I honestly just wondered if you were aware and were going to refrain them from breeding because of the suffering the babies would undergo? Cute turtles though. xx :)

[davo]

it's unusual when two headed anything survives for long periods, but as its not too uncommon for the two head mutation to occur, eventually theres going to be animals that survive just fine. Take a look at http://www.turtlesale.com/rare-turtles1.html

[Bsixxx]

nice collection:D

[albinosunlimited]

how are my albino turtles any different than your albino king or snow ?

[Bogwoodbruce]

Super cool!

[Miguel]

awesome collection..seems that before the little snappers there is a small Staurotypus Salvinii, am I right?

[David Tobler]

Is that an albino P. hilarii?

[Jessica Dring]

how are my albino turtles any different than your albino king or snow ?


They are different because as far as I am aware, albino snakes don't suffer from blindness, especially seeing as they have been bred for so long. Albino turtles haven't yet been bred on high levels to get past this? Though if anybody can prove me wrong on this, feel free, as I will definately not be supporting the pet trade for them again if it hinders their health. Also tortoises need to be able to see to eat.. so it can cause death in this way too.. snakes rely on scent. Anywhoo I wasn't having a go, I was trying to help incase you didn't know this and were going to breed them, but by the sounds of it you already knew.

[rallysb1tch]

Wow, they are all really cool.

[Gr8KarmaSF]

any more updates?

[Bogwoodbruce]

What an awesome collection.

[Miguel]

i guess not..got to love those atomic guys, show up, atomize everything, and on they go....

[fishlvr]

Did I see an albino stinkpot?

[StingrayFanatic]

Nice collection.

[albinosunlimited]

sorry i have been busy with work

yes thats a albino stinkpot i have 3 of them now and hope to breed them next year

nope not a albino hilarii thats a albino black marsh

miguel thats is a albino stink pot posted above the snappers and a albino razorback posted below

[albinosunlimited]

captive breeding does nothing to effect the way a albino will see.
snakes us heat, smell, taste to find their pray same way as my albino turtles us smell to find there food.

and about the tortoises that is not true i have true albino sulcatas that are now 3 years old and act and live just as normal as my other torts

[albinosunlimited]

http://www.turtletimes.com/forums/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=14039

[albinosunlimited]

http://www.turtletimes.com/forums/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=8671

[albinosunlimited]

those 2 albino stink pots where from the same farm 1 is a t+ the other is t- albino

[Vicious_Fish]

I'd love to find an albino stinkpot for a mate for my normal one. How much do they go for?

[albinosunlimited]

i really dont like to talk prices but i will say the where more tha $2500 each

[Gr8KarmaSF]

:bling:

[Oni Angel-Hannya]

Do your snappers live together?Are there aggression problems with multiple snappers?

[Jessica Dring]

captive breeding does nothing to effect the way a albino will see.
snakes us heat, smell, taste to find their pray same way as my albino turtles us smell to find there food.

and about the tortoises that is not true i have true albino sulcatas that are now 3 years old and act and live just as normal as my other torts

Erm, I think you mean heat and smell.
With snakes, smell and taste is really all rolled into one, but if you want to get creative about it, the snakes then wouldn't 'taste' the food till it was in its mouth, so either that or smell and the taste is pretty much the same for them.

I did not say all albino tortoises and turtles suffer from blindness, I said many do. Tortoises do not rely on smell for food. They rely mostly on sight. Having kept many myself, I know that you could bury aload of food under the soil and a tortoise would not find it (unless already digging in that area) however once they see food they will head straight for it. Sight is the main way to find food for tortoises as smell is in snakes.

Anyway, I'm stopping with the bickering.

My point was not how animals find their food, only that I was asking whether you knew alot/many albino tortoises and turtles can and do suffer from blindness and this will hinder their natural ability to find food (with it sometimes resulting in death if care is not taken). And I was more than polite in my question, trying to help a fellow herper with advice that he may or may not already know, so how about a thanks, and whether you did or didn't already know it rather than point scoring?


Like I said. Very cute turtles.

[albinosunlimited]

i keep the snappers in there own tubs just because the get a little worked up when they eat and i dont want them missing the food and nipping each other

[Gr8KarmaSF]

Can you further explain what you mean by t+ and t-?

[albinosunlimited]

not bickering just stating what i see with my collections
the second i walk in to the room with boxes of produce for my torts the all stand up and run from one side of there pens.

[albinosunlimited]

the t- is the true albino the yellow with red eyes
the T+ is the one with the purple color and ruby eyes these are also called caramel albinos

[edotero]

Very Nice. Have you ever seen an Albino Spotted turtle??

[Vicious_Fish]

i really dont like to talk prices but i will say the where more tha $2500 each

Lol, screw that! I really like them but not that much. Good luck with yours, are you planning on breeding them?

[SimonL]

Wow! is that Pelomedusa albino or leucistic?

[Jessica Dring]

not bickering just stating what i see with my collections
the second i walk in to the room with boxes of produce for my torts the all stand up and run from one side of there pens.


And I was asking if you knew that a high percentage of albino turtles suffer from blindness, not stating yours can't see...so I don't know where you got that from. :irked:

[albinosunlimited]

i have only heard of one albino spotted never saw any pictures but i was told it did not live long

[albinosunlimited]

simon
she is a leucistic and should have hets real soon

[albinosunlimited]

high percentage of albino turtles i would be suprised (not including albino redears )if there where more than 125 albino turtles world wide.

[itzatol]

albino turtles rock!

[SimonL]

Thanks Albinosunlimited. Unfortunately I dislike albinos...I think it dates back to my childhood when I awoke in the middle of the night to find my albino hamster sitting on my face, peering at me with his beady red eyes.... ;)

[shells-n-scales]

whatever happened to the albino Florida Softshells, and the albino Podocenmis unifilis? My buddy M. Powell, told me he imported/had one of those suckers, and sold it off. Did anyone ever work with it?

[albinosunlimited]

the albino florida softshell and the unifilis that where in the us both have died.

there are 3 other unifilis alive and doing well in japan

[Jessica Dring]

high percentage of albino turtles i would be suprised (not including albino redears )if there where more than 125 albino turtles world wide.
of course, thats the reason you havent included the red ears ;)

[Jessica Dring]

still not answering my question mate. your turning this into a flaming match.
all im asking is if you knew or not.
requires a yes or no answer, not a 'this, that, i know this' from either of us. If you continue avoiding the question and twisting it,then the bickerings gonna continue..:S

oh and please just reply to the writing in bold this time which is what ive been asking from the start rather than arguing about percentages of turtles..

[davo]

Well if he didn't he certainly does now... the only way this will turn into a flaming match is your desperate need for him to answer.

Many (if not all for as much as I know...) albino animals including humans suffer vision problems as development of the retina in the back of the eye is abnormal with albinos (in fact with humans I think it is part of the classification of being albino-many are also legally blind). It means a lot of animals are vision impaired in comparison to their normal counterparts by varying degrees. Rats for example 20/600 for most rats and 20/1200 for albino rats. With snakes... It probably won't make a great deal of difference because they generally don't have the best of vision and have other far more superior ways of "seeing". I'm pretty sure if your going to be against these, you'd have to be against all albino's including humans-and should such not breed.

There are far worse traits that are being bred in different animals, which you could class as cruel...

[albinosunlimited]

i am not bickering i am saying [I will breed all my albino turtles and i do not believe they have any issues they suffer from]and i am well aware of reptile genetics and morphs
i have over 200 ball pythons pritty much every known morph.
plus albino monitors, albino salamanders, and albino frogs

i also work with other rare pythons
bolens, angolans and a few others

jon

[davo]

I'd love to see some boelens pics if you have any... love those pythons. Good luck in your breeding efforts, have you bred any currently?

[albinosunlimited]

on the boelens i just picked up a ch pair last year from a friend in florida. this is the first time i have worked with them

[davo]

I see pics of how much people cool them by... sometimes it looks worrying lol, they have to go so low in temperature to breed.

[albinosunlimited]

i was thinking the same thing. i cant believe snakes have to get that cold to breed lol
from every thing i have read on them it looks like they need to be at least 5 years old before people try to start breeding them

[Brooklynella]

still not answering my question mate. your turning this into a flaming match.
all im asking is if you knew or not.
requires a yes or no answer, not a 'this, that, i know this' from either of us. If you continue avoiding the question and twisting it,then the bickerings gonna continue..:S

oh and please just reply to the writing in bold this time which is what ive been asking from the start rather than arguing about percentages of turtles..

You have to figure breeding Albino's started somewhere. Albino snakes, for example, were very hard to find back in the 1980's. Now they are everywhere... Who knows what health problems arose during the early attempts to mass breed albino snakes?
Point is, if this guy breeds albino turtles there may or may not be collateral damage as a result- it remains to be seen. If he succedes he may be on to the next big trend and make a pile of $$.:D

[joel]

beautiful collection

[davo]

i was thinking the same thing. i cant believe snakes have to get that cold to breed lol
from every thing i have read on them it looks like they need to be at least 5 years old before people try to start breeding them

yeah, I'm not sure how low most people take them, but I saw someone on another forum had theirs down to almost 8 degrees C... he was getting mating out of them though, can't remember if he got ovulation though...

[Jessica Dring]

Well if he didn't he certainly does now... the only way this will turn into a flaming match is your desperate need for him to answer.

Many (if not all for as much as I know...) albino animals including humans suffer vision problems as development of the retina in the back of the eye is abnormal with albinos (in fact with humans I think it is part of the classification of being albino-many are also legally blind). It means a lot of animals are vision impaired in comparison to their normal counterparts by varying degrees. Rats for example 20/600 for most rats and 20/1200 for albino rats. With snakes... It probably won't make a great deal of difference because they generally don't have the best of vision and have other far more superior ways of "seeing". I'm pretty sure if your going to be against these, you'd have to be against all albino's including humans-and should such not breed.

There are far worse traits that are being bred in different animals, which you could class as cruel...


My desperate need for an answer? Davo my 'desperate need for an answer' is because I say one thing and it gets twisted into 'how is my albino turtles any different from your albino kingsnake and albino corn snake'.

My main reason for such 'desperation for an answer' was because the way ASL was replying was such as offence had been taken, and this was never my intention. So each time he twisted it and replied in a manor of point scoring (obviously because no matter how many times i put a smiley in my post or compliment his turtles he still can't quite grasp the meaning of 'Im not flaming or having ago, im just asking if you knew').

Who said I was against Albinoism? Sorry mate, but I never once stated that, and I would be a huge hipercrit (which I don't like to be) having keeping two species of albino animals.

The one thing I did say was that if albinoism however hinders snakes health and/or ability to find food like it does in albino tortoises and turtles then I would no longer keep them after my two pass away...as I won't support a trade that hinders animals health to my knowledge.

As for albino animals being bred, I know it takes somewhere to get them being bred worldwide, but as far as I know snakes haven't shared the problems that albino turtles and tortoises have - however if I am wrong, feel more than free to post proof I am wrong and I will admit my mistake more than willingly. ;)

[davo]

My desperate need for an answer? Davo my 'desperate need for an answer' is because I say one thing and it gets twisted into 'how is my albino turtles any different from your albino kingsnake and albino corn snake'.

My main reason for such 'desperation for an answer' was because the way ASL was replying was such as offence had been taken, and this was never my intention. So each time he twisted it and replied in a manor of point scoring (obviously because no matter how many times i put a smiley in my post or compliment his turtles he still can't quite grasp the meaning of 'Im not flaming or having ago, im just asking if you knew').

Who said I was against Albinoism? Sorry mate, but I never once stated that, and I would be a huge hipercrit (which I don't like to be) having keeping two species of albino animals.

The one thing I did say was that if albinoism however hinders snakes health and/or ability to find food like it does in albino tortoises and turtles then I would no longer keep them after my two pass away...as I won't support a trade that hinders animals health to my knowledge.

As for albino animals being bred, I know it takes somewhere to get them being bred worldwide, but as far as I know snakes haven't shared the problems that albino turtles and tortoises have - however if I am wrong, feel more than free to post proof I am wrong and I will admit my mistake more than willingly. ;)

You just seem to be making a big deal out of not much... so him saying what the difference between my turtle and your snake could be a legititamate question and a fair one- as he said his experience is albinism has not effected any of his turtles negatively. Also said he did not want to start a bickering match of peoples ethics in the albino vs non-albino turtles, which is the authors right... his thread.
Anyhow, like I said, if he wasn't aware, he sure is now... and he is still intent on breeding them, so I guess that's that.

Sorry mate - Never said you were. Just stating that it effects most animals if not all, and so obviously you would be either all for or all against (or at least the larger proportion).

I don't know about the snakes (agreed, not that you can compare them), but the thing about snakes is eyesight usually comes second to other techniques depending on species, so it wouldn't effect it finding food in the same way.

If finding food is then your only problem, what about hand feeding or putting food in front of it's face?

I think there was an albino gecko of some kind that when it was born it was blind, but they kept trying it and eventually like everything, there was one born that wasn't- just through trying and trying again. Can't remember the details on that one, was a long time ago I was told it.

[Brooklynella]

You just seem to be making a big deal out of not much... so him saying what the difference between my turtle and your snake could be a legititamate question and a fair one- as he said his experience is albinism has not effected any of his turtles negatively.

Sorry mate - Never said you were. Just stating that it effects most animals if not all, and so obviously you would be either all for or all against (or at least the larger proportion).

I don't know about the snakes (agreed, not that you can compare them), but the thing about snakes is eyesight usually comes second to other techniques depending on species, so it wouldn't effect it finding food in the same way.

If finding food is then your only problem, what about hand feeding or putting food in front of it's face?

I think there was an albino gecko of some kind that when it was born it was blind, but they kept trying it and eventually like everything, there was one born that wasn't- just through trying and trying again. Can't remember the details on that one, was a long time ago I was told it.



I think your last paragraph is what Jessica is referring to: How many blind Gecko's need to suffer to "Suceed"? Is this even Sucess?:confused:
I wouldn't dare try to speak for her though.
I think in the end, people breed reptiles to make money and you can't be too judgemental or "Concerned" how these animals turn out if you are among those lining up to buy them.;)

[monsternoob]

Jessica you are wrong, some albino boas are born with no eyes/ one eye, and their siblings are sold as breeders, not destroyed. The overlying theme is $$$, people will do these things if they can make money. (Not accusing you albinosunlimited). There are also websites which sell two headed and no eyed turtles.

[Kioka]

Jessie is not really asking about the right of albinos to exist, but rather the breeders' ethnics. I means most albinos are inbred nowaday and come with genetic problems, like the one-eyed albino boa that seem to plague every albino boa constrictor litter nowaday.

You can't compare them to humans, at least we can choose who to marry and who to have sex with. Captive animals, especially reptiles, don't have that choice when they are left in a small cage. I means sure the female can reject the male, but after awhile the male will stress her out in order to let him mate her.

Anyway, the only thing you can do is not buy any morphs resulting from albinism, don't breed them or eliminate albino carriers in your stock. The albino market is here to stay, and it won't go away.

[Brooklynella]

Being a bit old school, I hadn't spent much time looking for reptiles but the internet has spawned a slew of "Breeders" that are trying to pawn off everything they can as being "Special". "This one is Pastel, this one is 32% Albino." Yeah, whatever dude.:screwy:
The only thing funnier than that is the prices some of you are paying for these special specimens.:):WHOA:

[monsternoob]

Ironically enough I am picking a het albino boa up tomorrow, and breeding her this season (05 baby). Here's hoping I don't get any mutants, that would kill me. I know for sure that these snakes are unrelated for at least a few generations which is good though.

[varanio]

Ive been holding back from jumping on this, but what the hell; Im in a good mood and feel like giving my .02 cents. First off we have to remember that Albinism is a recessive trait. We have to remember that these animals wont survive in the wild due to two main reasons, over exposure to natural sun rays, which will hurt their skin and predation. Snakes can and will get away with being able to survive longer periods of time because most snake species are arboreal and nocturnal or they will be fossorial and nocturnal. Most snakes only come out to bask before feeding and after feeding, ie to generate enough energy to tackle prey and to digest prey. Lizards and turtles spend much longer periods of time basking in the sun as they have longer periods of activity throughout the day due to their much more rapid metabolism. This is only speaking about naturalistic predicatabiity, in terms an albino reptile will not breed/mate with another albino in the wild because they wont make it long enough to do so.

How does this play out in the captive sector? There were very few albinos in the 80's which is when the craze started. And when these people who got their hands on these albino$$$$$$$ then saw the huge income potential. They got greedy and I mean really greddy and decided to mess with genetics and such and started breeding albinos to albinos only, then bred offspring to mother /father and offspring f1 to f2 to f3 etc.... They held back a couple of generations to cut costs so they didnt have to buy another albino. Insted they in bred the crap out of them, which is why we have the one eyed albinos etc etc etc.... People started noticing this and decided to start breeding back to normals getting the hets and breeding them back to the albinos and then breeding 50% hets back to albinos again to get a new bloodline. Has the damage been done? Some people say so. So now alot of breeders are having to wait around for a new w/c albino to come in to re diversify the gene pool. This is like winning the lottery. I ve never been a big fan of over propagizing albinos for this being the main reason.

[Kioka]

The problem with waiting for another albino is that there are so many different kind of albinism, and they not necessarily compatible with each others. At least that is true of genetics from a human biological point of view, and I don't see why it can't be applied to reptiles. We already got two strains of albinism in boas, and several in Corn Snakes and they are not compatible with each others at all.

I really hate it when breeders are oversimplifying genetics... defects, which include morphs, are a lot more complex than they look. For instance, one guy I know got two true dwarf Colombian, and he think if he breed them, he will get dwarf babies. Alright... how many different kind of dwarfism are there in humans? Think about that... there are literally hundreds, and not all of them are related to genes. Now what the chance he will have if he breed them? Even daughter-father, sibling breeding or mother-son breeding won't be enough to isolate the dwarf gene he is looking for if I understand dwarf genetics enough, and that is without invoking the thought of non-genetic glandular defects. I need to stop before I make this whole passage irrelevant to the discussion.

However apart from that rant... albinism should be fairly easy to isolate, but there are going to be many different strains and they may not always prove out within the first few generations initially.

[monsternoob]

A lot of the time the "true" dwarf boas from tiny islands start getting bigger in captivity because they are properly fed. In their natural homes there just isn't enough food for them to get large, same as an underfed snake in captivity will be stunted. I'd feel confident saying any small BCI bred to any small BCI would make small babies, "dwarfism" as far as I know isn't simple recessive :P

[Kioka]

A lot of the time the "true" dwarf boas from tiny islands start getting bigger in captivity because they are properly fed. In their natural homes there just isn't enough food for them to get large, same as an underfed snake in captivity will be stunted. I'd feel confident saying any small BCI bred to any small BCI would make small babies, "dwarfism" as far as I know isn't simple recessive :P

They are not insular or Central American "dwarfs"... I hate that term applied to them since every BCI, which happen to be all of the locales, that is smaller than a Colombian is apparently a "dwarf." All it is is size variation within a species in a given population... So does that means every BCC that doesn't get to be the same size as a Surinam a "dwarf"? Think about it this way... a 2' full-grown Lace Monitor is a true dwarf monitor, nor does it have any existing wild population that regularly stay this size, while an Ackie is not a dwarf monitor since it is a species that happen to be small.

Anyway, the female Colombian is 4' and was fed weekly with the right size diet for the last 4 years. So that why I bolded true because Colombian boas at that size are rare, nor was it stunted. He produced the female from his own boas. I am not sure where he got the male from. But yes, it is not just simple recessive at all, and it is probably a lot more complicated.

Albinism is just as complicated as far possibilities go, however it is easy to prove out the strain if you do inbreeding.

[monsternoob]

Nah Im not saying his boas aren't "dwarfs", like I said though, small boas are small boas, just that, labelling them as dwarfs is like calling an anerythristic amelanistic corn a snow, it's just a label IMO. I do know the difference between a BCI and a BCC, I was just using BCI's as an example.

Just to note, small boas aren't only caused by underfeeding, if they are too cold their growth can also be stunted. Although in most parts of the US that wouldn't be a problem.

[dzb912]

very nice

[Gr8KarmaSF]

WE NEED AN UPDATE!!!!!