Filtration for my breeding project.....

[Rare_Cichlids]

ok so i want to breed some fish, I'm talking about small cichlids and tetras and mollies and other small to medium fish. i plan to use 20-Gallon tanks, one 30-gallon tank, and one 10-gallon tank........

now...i know how to breed the fish but i was wondering what was the best way to filter the tank????? i don't want to wast a-lot of money so i was thinking.... maybe a W/D sump as a filter, and a big heater in the sump so all the tanks can be filtered from one sump and all tanks can be the same temperature with 1 heater....... this is just the start of my project...because i plan to have my own fish store in the future so i want to start breeding fish first and study them. ( I'm only 15 Years old now)

but mostly my question is.... how would i go about building a sump and installing the stem pipes on the drilled tanks?? is there a website that tells me exactly how with pictures???? also can i buy already drilled tanks??? and any other comments or suggestions that can help me out??? this will take place in my basement BTW.



Any help is greatly appreciated.


thank you.

[Wolf3101]

The most successful, inexpencive.and safest system for breeding set up's IMO have always been air driven foam filters. A central W/D system is difficult to ballance and still dangerious to fry.

[AnDr3w]

Idk what foam filters are, but sponge filters are good.

[sma]

Idk what foam filters are, but sponge filters are good.

i think they are the same thing

[Wolf3101]

The filters have been made out of foam for over 20 years now but people still refur to them as 'sponge' filters for some reason.

[Rare_Cichlids]

That is another idea i had.... but which kind???

are you guys talking about this sponge filter....1
http://image.ecplaza.net/offer/c/capson/4228112_s.jpg

Or are you guys talking about this sponge filter....2.
http://www.pet-dog-cat-supply-store.com/shop/shop_image/product/e8031a9f661b6d05a166d078525fa82d.jpg



thanks

[Wolf3101]

the upper picture is a foam (sponge) filter and the lower one is a corner filter. I use hydros in all my tanks but there are very few differances between brands.

[sicxspeed]

Sponger filter from what I've been reading is the way to go like the guys above mentioned. They won't suck the babies up or kill them by having them stick to the foam itself.

[Wolf3101]

An old time fish breeder I knew many years ago was also about the most penny pinching miser on earth. He use to buy clear tubing and natural cleaning sponges and make his own by drilling holes in the lower part of a section of thin tubing...using the rough cut ends to drill a hole in the sponge... sealing the end with an old milk bottle lid and then dropping an air stone in the bottom...worked very well but looked like it could have been featured on the Mickey Mouse club....

[Rare_Cichlids]

well i have decided to build a sump!!!!!!!!!!!

it will be MUCH LESS money and it will be easier to maintain for me.

with a sponge filter i will have to buy an air pump and i would have to buy a filter for each tank, but with a sump all i need to buy are PVC tubes, 1 Water PUMP, and one big heater!!!!

i heard some of you said its dangerous for the fry.... but i will cover the intake tube with a fine net......also if a few fry slip by they will end up in the sump and i can net them back easily.


any ideas??? comments??


thanks

[WyldFya]

A W/D is still more expenive. You won't be able to save many of the fry in a w/d as most will get stuck on media, or sucked into the pump and made into fertilizer. Foam/sponge filters are the best and cheapest method for breeding IMO. Hydros are what I use as well. Putting a mesh over the overflows will be a lot of work for cleaning. It is not easy to remove mesh netting once it is in place, and it will get plugged up.

[Dr Joe]

How many tanks are you going to have to start with?

Under ten and you would be better off with sponge filters and separate heaters (especially if your fish require different breeding temps and water conditions).

There is a diy for making sponge filers too.

If your dead set on a sump and multiple tanks, dearch the DIY section on here, there are some very good systems and use a course sponge on the intakes.

Just remember if one tank gets sick all the tanks get sick.

Dr Joe

.

[Rare_Cichlids]

im going to go with the hydro spong filters because i already have 1 and i like it...

are these heaters reliable and strong???..... i don't need them to be submersable....
http://www.bigalsonline.com/BigAlsUS/ctl3684/cp18532/si1381840/cl0/bigals100wattaquariumheater





thanks

[Tainted Glory]

Junk from what I've seen. Stick with Ebo Jager or Visitherm. I've had both for years and never had a problem.

[Rare_Cichlids]

ok so which is better Ebo Jager... or marineland Visitherm?????

also do you recoomend 100-watts heater for a 10-gallon tank??(my basement is cold most of the time)



thanks

[Tainted Glory]

I'd prefer the Visitherm over the Ebo based on the sole reason that its about 2/3 the length of the Jager. Sure the Ebos are great heaters, but they are massive. I've got a 100w Jager in my 10g with no complaints though. I had to bury the bottom of the heater in the substrate and have it sticking above the water like to make it work how I wanted. This wouldn't have been a problem with the Visitherm.

Pic for reference.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v119/YFZ450Racer/IMG_2399.jpg

[Tainted Glory]

I'm going to sketch you something that I think you should do. It's based off a central sump, but utilizes a spill-way design that is popular. Give me a few minutes...

[Tainted Glory]

Here's a quick sketch.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v119/YFZ450Racer/ttankf.jpg

Nothing is drawn to scale other than the fact that the tanks are arranged in an ascending order. The thick lines within the tanks are PVC style overflows that essentially drop into the tank below. Water travels through the the successive tank before dropping through the other side to the other tank. By utilizing a sump you'll be able to use a single 250-300w heater and save a ton of money. A 500-750 GPH pump and you'll be set. I'd estimate the heater/filter/pump combo to set you back no more than $75 if you shop around.

[Dr Joe]

Cheap heater are what they are, cheap. I've had some last over twenty yrs. (really) and some break the same day. You have more to woory about with cheap heaters running away and boiling your fish than just dieing (the thermostat contacts weld themselves together).

.

Here's a quick sketch.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v119/YFZ450Racer/ttankf.jpg

Nothing is drawn to scale other than the fact that the tanks are arranged in an ascending order. The thick lines within the tanks are PVC style overflows that essentially drop into the tank below. Water travels through the the successive tank before dropping through the other side to the other tank. By utilizing a sump you'll be able to use a single 250-300w heater and save a ton of money. A 500-750 GPH pump and you'll be set. I'd estimate the heater/filter/pump combo to set you back no more than $75 if you shop around.


First problem here is only the top tank gets fresh water, the other's get polluted and not really dilluted leftovers.

Second problem is balancing flow, draining one into another leaves you open to overflow disasters.

Stay with the foam filters and if you can't afford better heaters, start with the cheapies but keep a constant watch on them.

Is it possible to close off part of the basement where the tanks will be, just a false wall or two (some 2x4's and a few sheets of drywall), nothing fancy, then you could heat that area and lessen the the dependancy on in-tank heaters.

Plus it keeps tank contamination to a minimum (dust, sprays etc.) (is the laundry down there too?).

And it's your own fish room :D .

Dr Joe

.

[Rare_Cichlids]

thanks for the help so far guys.... im going to order the supplies soon but i had a few more questions......

1)What if i buy the Jager for the 10-gallon and i put it in the tank sideways in the back will that work too??

2)Are 10-gallons and 20-Gallons good for breeding small fish??(the 30-gallon is for the discus Breeding Pair)

3)I'm setting up 5 tanks for breeding and i will use the hydro filters but i was just planning to use the "Tetra Air Pump 100" as a air pump, which is rated for 100-Gallons and i was wondering that if i buy a-lot of airline tubing can i just use the "Tetra 100 Air Pump" for all the tanks and divide the air out equally into all 5 tanks with just that one Air Pump????



thanks

[Dr Joe]

Yep, sideways is okay, just don't bury it.

It's not powerful enough to run those properly, two to a pump...foam filters need alot of air to filter properly.

Dr Joe

.

[WyldFya]

I personally prefer having my sponge filters ran by powerhead, but if you do use air, make sure you have enough air movement to accomplish actual filtration.

[apistomaster]

I use two sponges per tank. Each tank has one sponge cleaned on an alternating schedule. This method always ensures that the biological filtration is never compromised.

I know you are on a budget but one of the best investments your can make is to get a linear air compressor, use one inch diameter PVC pipe and drill and tap holes for screw in air valves. Even a small unit will provide you with all the air you need now, allows for expansion and remember that if you are breeding fish the fry need brine shrimp and the hatchers need air.

Foster and Smith sell Oxyen Plus sponge filters with a discount on six or more.
They come in nice range of sizes for small to large tanks. I have found that
Model #9 is perfect for ten gallon tanks or less and Model #6 is good for 20 gallon tanks and up. The more you standardize the easier it is to run a fish room. Another Hint: buy half as many spare sponges as you have filters. This allows you to rotate the sponge through a use, clean, and dry on the shelf spares cycle. When I pull half the sponges for cleaning I grab a clean one off the shelf. I wash my sponges in the washing machine. Use only bleach, warm/warm, heavy duty cycle. Then a short rinse cycle with some Prime added to neutralize any traces of bleach. The come out like new.

Recommend the Stealth Heater because of their reliability, unbreakable and compact size. I use only 100 watt Heaters. They work on everything from 4.5 gal spawning tanks to 35 gallon tanks. I increase the wattage appropriately for tanks larger than 35 gallon.