Ill RTC I think he might be dieing

[UncleNos]

My RTC has developed a problem around his gills mainly on the right hand side , he's lost his appetite and is really lethargic sitting at the bottom of the tank with his dorsal fin clamped, also the top of his head has gone prune like as if he's dehydrated????? help please.

[UncleNos]

I've done a quick water check with the following readings

NO3 40-80 ppm
NO2 0 ppm
pH 6-6.5
KH 0 ppm
GH 0-30 ppm

From what I can tell these are not way off the mark but I may be wrong.

Any Help Please.

[jconley]

I've done a quick water check with the following readings

NO3 40-80 ppm
NO2 0 ppm
pH 6-6.5
KH 0 ppm
GH 0-30 ppm

From what I can tell these are not way off the mark but I may be wrong.

Any Help Please.

How about ammonia?

[UncleNos]

Not got the test for it :-(

[jconley]

Just to be on the safe side you may want to add some sort of ammonia de-tox like Seachem's Prime or something similar.
You might want to consult with necrocanis, but I would add some salt and a broad spectrum bacterial med like Maracyn plus or Melafix.
I would REALLY like to see an ammonia test to be safe though.

[UncleNos]

I won't get a chance tonight but first thing tomorrow I'll go to my local shop to get a test and some ammonia de-tox and post the result. added Melafix too 65ml of it.

[jconley]

Cool. Best of luck, RTCs are my favs.

[Red Devil]

i hope he will be okay.. he is awesome..

[roybryan]

looks like gill flair it is usually because of poor water quality a pet shop in alabama has one with that. I would do a good water change raise the salt level and throw in melafix. also if you have a big aquarium go to the pond chemicals and they have a pond melafix that treats 1600 gallons for about the same price as regular melafix

[UncleNos]

I hope so too.
We took him on as a 'rescue fish' the usual someone bought him at a few inches and it ate their
tank.........

[UncleNos]

only a 500L / 130USG for just now ;-)

[Red Devil]

I hope so too.
We took him on as a 'rescue fish' the usual someone bought him at a few inches and it ate their
tank.........

He is sooooo beautiful.. i really hope you :( save that guy..

[necrocanis]

The pitting on the head is actually the skull. They have this shape naturally, and the skin just covers it. It's always like that. The gills are probably gill curl and as others say it can be poor water quality and possibly diet. I have a rtc that had it when I bought it, but now it's cured. I did heavy daily water changes, and added salt. I have learned that salt over periods of time can shut down the urinary tract of freshwater fish and should only be used in the short term. Hope this helps.

[UncleNos]

The pitting on the head is actually the skull. They have this shape naturally, and the skin just covers it. It's always like that. The gills are probably gill curl and as others say it can be poor water quality and possibly diet. I have a rtc that had it when I bought it, but now it's cured. I did heavy daily water changes, and added salt. I have learned that salt over periods of time can shut down the urinary tract of freshwater fish and should only be used in the short term. Hope this helps.

Realize that the head bit is the skull after looking at some more examples on here just my last RTC was a lot smother and had almost a sand dollar patten on his head.
What amounts of salt are you recommending? I'll try varying the diet too but he's quite picky likes cray fish :nilly:and shrimp/prawn.
thanks for the advice...

[victor448]

If the ammonia is zero.You may want to consider Prazipro a non toxic antiparasitic agent that may do the job and will not effect the biological filter. Assuming its parasitic in origin. Very hard to tell with internal parasites. These fish can live with certain parasites for long periods without becoming symptomatic until they are stressed. Foster and Smith have the best price. If the Melafix can be obtained locally use it until the Prazipro arrives if it is not helpful try the Prazipro. Be careful using antibiotics if you go that route that can disrupt the biological filter most do.

[necrocanis]

Salt should only be used as a last resort and for short periods of time less than two weeks as you can cause kidney, and liver failure in freshwater fish if they are subject to it for too long. If you do go this route I suggest no more than 1 tablespoon per 5 gals. The amount that is non-harmful to freshwater fish over long periods is 1 tablespoon per 300 gals. Keep that in mind before you go this route. If your fish is eating I would suggest melafix, and maybe an antibiotic, along with heat, aeriation, and daily water changes of no more than 25%. Feed good quality clean foods. Should help some, but it may never go away. Have seen 3+ footers with gill curl. One 4' fish in NC had a really bad case for at least 14 years.

[TLkmDN]

wow dude is that dirt at the bottom of ure tank? u might wana clean it up. :s

[UncleNos]

Right,
Picking up an ammonia test today, so I'll let you know the result of that.
Thanks for the tip on the salt necro, the melafix seems to be working the edge of his gills have lost the pinky white edge? So I'll keep up the treatment.
No it's not dirt it's coral sand which he likes to push up at either end of his tank.

[TLkmDN]

remove the sand. RTCS dont have scales to protect them from rough surfaces. the sand rubbing against his gill cant be helping the recovery process....good luck :)

[UncleNos]

Will do with the next couple of water changes.

[TLkmDN]

hes a tru beauty though. how long nis he nin inches? wats the dimensions of ure tank?

[Bgonz]

looks like gill flair it is usually because of poor water quality a pet shop in alabama has one with that.


Thats not GILL CURL. I have a small RTC with bad gill curl and thats definately not it. That looks like a irritation of sorts. I'm a far cry from a fishy doc but his gills are not curling. On my guy you can see his left side gills clear as day and the flap is rolled back about a 1/2". I see NO curling in your pics, just some red irritation ???? Stick with the meds and see what happens. Good luck he looks like a cutie.


JMO of course.......




bob

[victor448]

I agree with Bgonz this does not appear to be gill curl it looks like an external bacterial infection that may have started as an irritation from the sand in the tank as suggested by TLkmDN. On the other hand many internal infections in fish can appear with external symptoms so if the Melafix and frequent water changes as suggested by Necrocanis does not work you may want to consider the following. Freshwater water fish poorly absorb antibiotics from the water so treatment by wrapping the antibiotic in food is the best approach assuming the fish is eating. In my experiece it takes quite alot for an RTC in an established system with good water quality to stop eating. Unless there is an internal infection or a more substantial looking ext infection bacterial or parasitic. I am sure there maybe exceptions. If this ends up being a suspected parasitic infection by process of elimination and response to other medications Prazipro is a great choice this works quickly on parasitic infections even if the fish is not eating. Hopefully the Melafix will cure it and that will be the end of it. If not the above comments are just my opinion based on whats worked for me in the past. Sometimes despite our best efforts in caring for these regal fish they get ill like everything else alive.

[ElJefe]

:iagree: :iagree:

[UncleNos]

Latest readings are

PH 6
GH 60
KH 0
NH3 NH4 More than 7.3 mg/L :eek:
NO2 0
NO3 160

Using the Melafix and he's perked up and done a 20% water change but this still hasn't brought the Ammonia levels into check.
Heading down to the local shop in a few minutes to try and a solution for the ammonia problem.

According to the charts the NH3 NH4 level is still "Safe" because of the Ph level??

[sunga]

may be do a 25% water change

[UncleNos]

TLkmDN He's about 18.5 - 19 inch long in a 72x24x24 at the moment his next tank will be hopefully an 84x30x42 problems sourcing a good manufacturer at a reasonable price though.

[madwhitehat]

Latest readings are

PH 6
GH 60
KH 0
NH3 NH4 More than 7.3 mg/L :eek:
NO2 0
NO3 160

Using the Melafix and he's perked up and done a 20% water change but this still hasn't brought the Ammonia levels into check.
Heading down to the local shop in a few minutes to try and a solution for the ammonia problem.

According to the charts the NH3 NH4 level is still "Safe" because of the Ph level??
Your "solution" for the ammonia problem should be to get that tank cycled properly. The presence of NO3 (nitrate) means that possibly the tank was cycled before, but that now it is "recycling" due to extreme ammounts of ammonia being introduced to the system after the addition of the RTC. If you have another established filter from another tank I would suggest moving it to this one. What kind of filtration are you using?

BTW, if there are any detectable levels of ammonia in a system, it is not "safe." That chart is bull****. Ammonia can be less toxic at certain pH levels, but it is always a toxic substance.

[madwhitehat]

Thats not GILL CURL.
Correct. It's gill irritation. THIS (http://aquaticfreakshow.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=27&sid=9b77fa05a0d43ccef05806c68e7b3089) is gill curl.

[necrocanis]

Your "solution" for the ammonia problem should be to get that tank cycled properly. The presence of NO3 (nitrate) means that possibly the tank was cycled before, but that now it is "recycling" due to extreme ammounts of ammonia being introduced to the system after the addition of the RTC. If you have another established filter from another tank I would suggest moving it to this one. What kind of filtration are you using?

BTW, if there are any detectable levels of ammonia in a system, it is not "safe." That chart is bull****. Ammonia can be less toxic at certain pH levels, but it is always a toxic substance.


I recently expirienced this problem when my big hybrid fasted for unknown reasons. Everything checked out but about 3 weeks later when he started to eat again the ammonia and everything else spiked and I was afraid I was going to lose him. I seeded his tank from my other pond every water change and now it's cycled again. I was really scared though. Now he's eating like a champ again. I think he had an intestinal block because my old roomated tried to feed him too many shrimp with the tails on, and it's hard for them to digest and if they don't pass them they can pack in their intestines until digested or thrown up.

[UncleNos]

Mad white hat that's nasty did he survive?

Filtration is via one Eheim professional 2224 and a Eheim professional 2229 (the large wet/dry, that never runs properly always wet)
Both of these were running on my smaller tank for a few months before transferring to the 72"

Thinking about trying to source a 2250 to see if that sorts out the problem or maybe a sump system but I've not a clue about setting one up..........