View Full Version : payara
pufferfish123
11-13-2005, 12:52 PM
Hey, what do you guys know about how to get a hold of a juv. payara or legality issues in california. I've always wanted to get a hold of one.
FormulatedFire
11-13-2005, 1:01 PM
in maryland where i live they are expensive like 100 bucks a pop for 2-3"....i dont kno if they are expensive or not but i believe aquascapeonline.com has them
pufferfish123
11-13-2005, 1:15 PM
Do you know anything about their water requirements/growth rates?
rumblesushi
11-13-2005, 1:45 PM
no you don;t have to feed them pirhanas.
oh my god!! they are $15 right now!!
but it's impossible to get them off feeder fish...
that's why payaras "mysterioudly" die when they are around 1'
they seriously need piranhas...
but they can get up to 4' in the wild
and payaras are "tetras", they like to be kept in a school.
temperature should be around 75 to 80
ph 7.0-8.0.
BUT DON'T GET ONE!!!
you're just going to kill it.
you gotta be like a payara biologist to keep them...it's too hard.
have you ever owned one or is this just hearsay.
they do get big in the wild and like atf's will need a large tank with lots of filtration and good current.
i am sure others who have owned or still own one will fill you in on the rest.
dixon
Payaras are not on Ca.'s forbidden list and at least one of our sellers usually has them.
rybapsych
11-14-2005, 12:19 AM
The Rainbow Pet Store almost always has them. They are located in the San Fernando Valley on Woodman and Nordhoff.
Payara is the Hydrolycus Scomberoides, also know as "Vampire Tetra" or Sabertooth Characin. The other, Piraya, si Pygocentrus Piraya, or orange belly, or yellow belly. This should lessen the confusion.
Pirayas, just like any in the piranha family is restricted in California. Permits could be obtained from Fish and Wildlife, and might even be able to get a permit from California Dept. of Fish and Game.
Now, payaras are not restricted, but if DFG or the scientists of F&W discovers how voracious this fish is, might even make it so. But I am not sure how it can survive in the waters of California. Too cold.
Payara is the Hydrolycus Scomberoides, also know as "Vampire Tetra" or Sabertooth Characin. The other, Piraya, si Pygocentrus Piraya, or orange belly, or yellow belly. This should lessen the confusion.
Pirayas, just like any in the piranha family is restricted in California. Permits could be obtained from Fish and Wildlife, and might even be able to get a permit from California Dept. of Fish and Game.
Now, payaras are not restricted, but if DFG or the scientists of F&W discovers how voracious this fish is, might even make it so. But I am not sure how it can survive in the waters of California. Too cold.
Yes, it's good to clarify. I've seen too many payara/piraya confusion threads. It's almost like the old "Who's on first?" routine. :(
The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (USFWS) does not regulate piranha in California or in any other state. Regulation of piranha differs from state to state. In California, piranha are solely regulated by the California Dept. of Fish and Game (CDFG) pursuant to the Fish and Game Code and Fish and Game Commission regulations. A permit is required from the CDFG to possess piranha in California, although such permits are typically only issued to public aquariums or educational institutions.
Payara (Hydrolycus spp.) are neither federally regulated by USFWS nor state regulated by CDFG. However, they are illegal in some other states, such as Texas, for example.
rumblesushi
11-14-2005, 2:59 AM
oh my god!! they are $15 right now!!
but it's impossible to get them off feeder fish...
that's why payaras "mysterioudly" die when they are around 1'
they seriously need piranhas...
but they can get up to 4' in the wild
and payaras are "tetras", they like to be kept in a school.
temperature should be around 75 to 80
ph 7.0-8.0.
BUT DON'T GET ONE!!!
you're just going to kill it.
you gotta be like a payara biologist to keep them...it's too hard.
That's ridiculous - who told you that? They may be a strict piscivore but they don't need piranhas.
The guy from Taiwan who recently posted the biggest payara most of us have seen in captivity, 18 inches, feeds his loaches. Pond loaches he says. Not piranhas.
I also know someone around here with a payara and his is doing fine on a variety of fish, cichlids, mollies, guppies, tinfoil barbs etc.
Yes, it's good to clarify. I've seen too many payara/piraya confusion threads. It's almost like the old "Who's on first?" routine. :(
The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (USFWS) does not regulate piranha in California or in any other state. Regulation of piranha differs from state to state. In California, piranha are solely regulated by the California Dept. of Fish and Game (CDFG) pursuant to the Fish and Game Code and Fish and Game Commission regulations. A permit is required from the CDFG to possess piranha in California, although such permits are typically only issued to public aquariums or educational institutions.
Payara (Hydrolycus spp.) are neither federally regulated by USFWS nor state regulated by CDFG. However, they are illegal in some other states, such as Texas, for example.
Wow, that's even more clarity! Sometimes I get so excited replying to post that I just typed so fast, that I think I just missed out on what I am trying to explain. I think it is almost a tiny spark of adrenaline when I reply to a post that I have some idea on. :lol2:
Thanks for the info!
I've never heard of Payara's (not piraya) being fed piranhas. But payaras are very cool to watch when they have a chance to get to the food. They can't compete for food against peacock bass, datnoids, and fast eating predators. The way I used to feed my payara was dump 10 dollars worth of feeders (that's about 100 medium size feeders, at 10 for a dolla). That was the only way it could get food is when every fish in the tank (Peacock bass, and datnoids, ATF) have their fill. I'd probably keep them with rays, bichirs, but not with the fast ones.
IoStrisciare
11-14-2005, 9:11 AM
payaras are known to be piranha eaters in the wild...
but that doesnt mean they are solely eaters of piranhas.
rumblesushi
11-14-2005, 9:38 AM
wolf fish are known to be piranha eaters in the wild, that doesn't mean you have to feed them piranhas :)
wolf fish are known to be piranha eaters in the wild, that doesn't mean you have to feed them piranhas :)
:lol2:
My H. Mal that was about 12 inch was always looking up. Above his tank is where the S. Rhom was. And that rhom was always scared.
IoStrisciare
11-14-2005, 9:50 AM
like... lets get back to topic and not derail too far?
no offense :grinyes:
rumblesushi
11-14-2005, 10:22 AM
oke so to stick to the topic at hand - payaras are pretty cool and you DON'T need to feed them piranhas :D
Vince
11-14-2005, 11:44 AM
:lol2: Sorry, I just get carried away like a dry leaf in the wind! So we are talking about Payara. Mine got eaten by my redline SH. Chomped it in half.
IoStrisciare
11-14-2005, 12:04 PM
:lol2: Sorry, I just get carried away like a dry leaf in the wind! So we are talking about Payara. Mine got eaten by my redline SH. Chomped it in half.
no worries...
i'm looking to get mine in a few weeks to try out if i can get it to a monster size like woody sun.
SimonL
11-14-2005, 12:56 PM
I had a 13"er in my 135 (lungfish decapitated it). The problem with their care over a foot is that people don't provide the proper environment; tons of water flow, long tank, very well oxygenated, no obstructions, temp not over 78.
So to raise really big ones do you think raceway type tank would work. Long, comparatively narrow, all the inflow at one end and the out flow at the other?
IoStrisciare
11-14-2005, 6:14 PM
So to raise really big ones do you think raceway type tank would work. Long, comparatively narrow, all the inflow at one end and the out flow at the other?
narrow wont do as they need a good clearance for turning space. Their bodies arent v flexible.
Does anyone have some pics of theirs at 12"+? I have only seen pics of about 6"ers...
IoStrisciare
11-14-2005, 8:22 PM
Does anyone have some pics of theirs at 12"+? I have only seen pics of about 6"ers...
woody-sun has a pic of his 16" payara.
jelly
11-15-2005, 12:32 PM
On the feeding front, My LFS has them eating frozon foods.
guppy
11-15-2005, 12:55 PM
I was thinking 12'l x 4'w x 2't, 700g+, with one of those 4250gph pond pumps returning through a high flow spray bar at one end. Maybe use a 300g bubble up gravel bed and plant trough alongside for the filter. I am not planning on building it but I wonder if it would work until they got around 3'.
rumblesushi
11-29-2005, 3:46 AM
why the temp not over 78?
MANGCH1
01-03-2006, 3:47 AM
wes has some nice payara. couple different sizes. i believe he said he was trying to get a couple HUGE. i prefer the ATF but if you want a payara. wes has some. give him a call or go to his store. nice store by the way.
Charney
01-03-2006, 5:00 PM
If you were to keep these guys to they do better in a group or on their own?
thanks
MrHarris
02-22-2006, 4:52 PM
i would like to know this to
Princley
02-22-2006, 4:54 PM
hi here they r 39.95
http://www.aquariumfish.net/catalog_pages/wild/wild_imported_fish.htm
If you were to keep these guys to they do better in a group or on their own?
thanks
Yeah, I am curious about this too. Most the pic's I have seen have been of solo fish. Perhaps keeping a school in the right conditions will lower stress levels and help the longevity of these fish. It'd be SWEEEET to see a school of 30"ers