Datnoid stability mystery

strollo22

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This idea was brought to my attention by Koltsixx so here we go. I want to try and compile a list of opinions, experiments and methods you all have used in the past that may or may not have worked. I have opinions of my own on what makes Indos stable or not. Let's see if maybe collectively we can figure out this mystery. One way I've recently found that seemed to have worked for me was to take an unstable one and put it into a tank with other fish, but only the one Datnoid. I did this with several different unstable ones for approx. one month each and they were all 100% stable. As soon as they went back in with the other Dats, they went black. My other theory that I've not been able to try yet is a natural habitat replication. Very low light, blackwater extract/driftwood and lots of tall standing vertical plants. My theory is that since Datnoids are natural ambush/stalking predators, they use the cover of the plants to "blend" in, thus forcing them to show their bars to match the vertical plant. If we keep them in an empty tank with a black background(Guilty), they blend in by being unstable. Black on black. I believe they are camouflage predators and will match their surroundings. Please throw some thoughts and critiques out there and maybe we can piece this puzzle together.
 

koltsixx

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The majority of threads compiled thus far have been people asking how to get their unstable Indo's stable, most of the responses being it's hit or miss or some other theorized reason and most of the responses interestingly come from those who have problems keeping their Indo's stable. In this thread Strollo and I would like to hear from those who've got stable Indo's and why they believe their Indo maintains stability in their care.

I for one had been keeping Indo's way before I joined MFK and since joining have kept 4 more between joining and now. When I used to go to the LFS in the past(Dats used to be more easily found in LFS's back in the day) the Dats where all unstable but they where also very skittish in bare tanks huddled in a corner obviously stressed by their trip and or tank. How ever when I brought them home I found that their color stabilized as their comfort and confidence level increased anywhere between 3 days to a week or so. I also never had a problem breaking them off live. As a matter of fact it wasn't until recently when my interest in Dats was rekindled and I started browsing the Dat section that I even became aware that so many Dat owners had problems with these 2 issues.

Now why have I had such success getting stable Indo's? Why I can only guess but I can tell you what makes sense to me logically as well as the conditions that each where kept in.

-I've never kept more then one Indo Dat per tank. I have mixed species such as Silvers and Indo's but never kept two Indo's together.

-I've always been an avid supporter of hides especially plants and all my tanks have had plenty of places for the Dat to retreat to.

-My tanks are maintained at around 7.4 ph, 4-8 dGH of course other parameters are at acceptable levels and a temperature of 80 or better.

-My tanks flow is pretty significant as I run 3 large powerheads as well as 2 canisters on every tank. I do this to increase surface agitation and gas transfer to compensate for keeping the fish in higher temps.

-I do water changes twice a week on average.

-Once the fish reach 4-5 inches in size I decrease feeding to every other day generally.

Dominance-Now one might assume dominance affects stability which it does but I've kept Indo's most frequently with fairly aggressive and larger fish. One such comm. included a 14 inch Lei and Silver Aro, 10 inch Green Terror, 10-12 inch Vulture Cat and TSN/ACHARA hybrid. The Dat was trounced often by the Terror and maintained stability for one year despite this as he grew from 4-8 inches. Another Comm. had the 3 Silver Tigers who where more rambunctious then my Indo and whooped on him quite often. Despite this and him being moved to 3 different tanks with different heirachrchies and different fish he maintained his stability from 1 1/2 inches till the 6 inch mark. So while I do believe dominance can help a Dat maintain his stable coloration I don't believe it's necessary.

Natural Cues-I believe above all else this is probably the greatest influence on Indo's. Most fishes coloration is affected by tank decor and contrast from light colored tanks creating a whitening of a fishes to dark colored tanks creating darkening of fish. Remember a fishes primary instincts are survival and fitting in with their surroundings either to avoid predation or be a more efficient predator. So why don't more people believe this tank decor to be the primary reason behind Dat coloration? Honestly you got me. Dats are ambush predators who adopt a sit and wait approach for the most part in predation, as such we can assume logically that camouflage plays a significant role in their survival both at avoiding predation as well as preying. We might also logically assume that the black coloration is meant to represent the shadows and the light coloration surrounding substrate perhaps vertical growing vegetation or root systems of water growing trees. So with both those logical assumption we might also assume that in order to elicit a stable coloration in Indo's the decor of the tank should be high contrast(with dark and light) have plants so they can act more naturally by adapting to a coloration pattern similar to their habitat, your tank. This set up could also logically work on even subordinate Dats as in such a tank in order to avoid predators or aggressive tankmates it would still behoove the Dat to remain stable to better camouflage with his habitat and avoid detection.




Now this is just my 2 cents on the matter but I'd like to hear more from others. If you've had a stable Dat please feel free to share what you think made the Dat stable along with some pics. Perhaps if we can find the commonality between our set ups and experiences we might actually arrive at a reasonable conclusion about what causes Dat coloration stability and please don't worry if your post is no where near as long winded as mine, every little bit of experience will help in our understanding.

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UnstoppableJayD

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Honestly, Ive had a few.

My current 3/3 is always stable, he was stable when i bought him and Ive never seen him black . He is about 8 inches now was 6 or so when i got him. When he was in the 210 he got beat on pretty good by some cichlids. now in the 500 he has no issues. always stable. There are no other indos in the tank just a small NGT.

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My last 2 I had together got them at about 3 and 4 inches. 4/4 was smaller 3/3 bigger and dominate. 4/4 was always stable . 3/3 which strollo bought at around 7 inches btw was hit or miss... Never constant either way. They lived in the same 210 my current one did with the same tankmates. He would actually get more stable when other fish would stress , wc etc. He never got stable for strollo either i believe.

4/4 I wound up trading into LFS at 7 inches or so , even in the lfs in a ten on a system he was stable till the day they sold him.

My tanks are not bare as i believe fish need to feel safe to thrive... they are usually busy with other fish moving etc.

I truly do not believe there is a way to manipulate... I do believe if you get a stable one it is likely to stay stable....


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strollo22

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Good information guys. I've always leaned towards the environmental factor as a key to stability but never tried it. I'm going to go buy some fake plants tomorrow maybe and start to work on it and see what happens. And Fyi Jay- that 3/3 has been 1000% stable by himself in Lorenzo's tank. Further proving my theory that an indo by itself will always be stable.


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UnstoppableJayD

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Good information guys. I've always leaned towards the environmental factor as a key to stability but never tried it. I'm going to go buy some fake plants tomorrow maybe and start to work on it and see what happens. And Fyi Jay- that 3/3 has been 1000% stable by himself in Lorenzo's tank. Further proving my theory that an indo by itself will always be stable.


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Thats rally interesting... get him to post pics here
 

FunWow!

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All the ones I've seen say that there is no answer. I haven't seen one that has many opinions or facts on the subject. I could be wrong though since I searched on my phone


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There really isn't a answer. Way to many things cause them to stable up or to become unstable. Stable to doesn't always mean it's a good thing even though it's what we like to see.


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MyGiants

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My opinion is the fish is not comfortable in its tank. I know they can get bullied by other Dats. I have owned a few Dats all the ones I have ever had never showed what you all call unstable stripes. I think a lot of you keep them in bare tanks. I know mine always liked to hide they liked hiding places made them feel secure. I know when they got scared or when I netted them to move them there stripe went pale. But once settled there stripes went back solid.
 

strollo22

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There really isn't a answer. Way to many things cause them to stable up or to become unstable. Stable to doesn't always mean it's a good thing even though it's what we like to see.


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I understand what you're saying but I'm no longer content with the answer, "there is no answer". There's an answer to everything and I'd like to figure it out.


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