Water testing questions - Advice needed

catfishacr

Gambusia
MFK Member
Jun 3, 2014
355
18
18
Iowa City, IA
Hi, so I’ve been having some issues with my fish acting weird lately and trying to get a grasp on my water parameters. I have several questions and instead of making several threads I’m going to post it all at once. Water parameters are as followed: 0 Ammonia, 0 Nitrite, 8.2-8.3 ph, temp 82. The tests that I’m having trouble with are Nitrate, GH, and KH. I’m having difficult with these, I get different test results from different testing methods. The two methods I use are API liquid tests and API test strips.

1) I’ll start with the Nitrate. I’m an idiot and have been testing the nitrates with the liquid test incorrectly. Once I followed the correct instructions my liquid nitrate test showed the results were 40-80 ppm. Hard to tell on the chart but I think closer to 80 than 40. So I did the following cleaned my filter, waited a week then started to perform water changes (cleaned gravel) every other day for a week. The nitrate liquid test still showed a 40ppm to 80ppm result. I went and bought the API test strips to confirm but the API test strips show my nitrates are 0-20 ppm. I know that the liquid tests are usually more accurate but have trouble thinking that 3 30% water changes in a week and cleaning of filter (filter was really dirty) the prior week would do nothing to lower the levels. Anyone else ever had this issue? I’m leaning toward thinking that in this case the test strips might be more accurate but what do you guys think? Any other testing methods I should use? Ps- Tap water level of nitrates is 5ppm.

2) Now I’ll talk KH and GH. I don’t know the exact levels of my KH as it’s hard to tell but KH is at least 214PPM using the API liquid test. (214.8 is highest reading on the chart) KH using the API test strips is closest to the 240ppm. GH is the one I have most questions about. Using liquid test results your spose to add one drop at a time and keep adding drops till the water in the tube turns from orange to green. After two or three drop it turns a light green and gets darker as you add more drops. Does anyone know are you spouse to stop once you see even a tint of green or do you keep adding until its dark? If you stop once it’s a light green results show 35-53ppm. My API test strip results show 0-30ppm.

So my question about KH/GH are, is it odd for my KH to be really high and GH low? I live in Iowa and water here is really hard, I’m also on well water. So it seems odd to me that my GH is low. I’m calling my landlord tomorrow to see if there is a water softener in my apartment building that I don’t know about but other than that I guess is it normal for High KH, high PH, and Low GH. Ps- tap water KH/GH is same as tank water.

Any input, info, or advice on any of the following questions would be extremely helpful. Thanks in advance.
 

ccp2007

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Apr 29, 2014
212
1
0
united states
I have never used the strips. Only the liquid. We recently had a nitrate issue too. We did daily-every other day wc, cleaned filters, gravel vac half with each wc, cleaned all caves and ornaments, and got rid of 3 fish and nitrate still tested 80. My husband took all the fish out, put them in totes, drained 95% of the water, let the aquarium run for a day and returned the fish and tested again. Results after 95% was between 20 & 40...very frustrating. We decided to keep up with wc and not to test nitrates unless they seem unhappy. The fish were fine and healthy looking until we started messing with the tank so much. They got super stressed and it took them awhile to become comfortable again...I'll be following this post

Faulty API test? Idk, but with as many people as I've seen mention nitrate reading being unusual, it could be.

Happily married Mommy of 3 babies, 2 fur babies and 15 gilled babies
 

Pharaoh

Administrator
Staff member
Administrator
MFK Member
Feb 18, 2008
17,566
171
1,097
Indianapolis
1. Test the water coming out of the tap with the test kit. This will let you know if there is an incoming water concern.

2. Not 100% on the testing requirements, so I will refrain.

How old is your test kit? Just something to note, but they do have an expiration date.
 

duanes

MFK Moderators
Staff member
Moderator
MFK Member
Jun 7, 2007
20,883
26,058
2,910
Isla Taboga Panama via Milwaukee
Because GH is the general hardness of water which encompasses all mineral components of the water, and KH is the total carbonate (calcium) hardness, yes you can have a high KH, and low GH.
The aquifer where your water comes from may be calcium rich but low in other minerals such as iron and other minerals.
Being a former chemist, I can get a bit anal about these things, so bear with me.
Each time you do a liquid test, a residual of whatever you test for is left in the tube, unless you rinse thoroughly with DI water. In the lab, our test tubes were rinsed a minimum or 3 times with DI to remove residual after each test was done, and then acid washed at the end of the day.
Because you have hard water, you need to get some DI water from the supermarket just to rinse testware, in order to get accurate results, if using wet tests.
If the testing tubes are plastic, this is even more important, because plastic holds onto minerals better than glass.
You do not say if you are in a rural area, but as Pharaoh mentioned, you will want to test the tap water for nitrates, as they may be higher than the norm in agricultural areas.
However, depending on the amount of bio material in filters and in substrate, stocking levels, and other metabolism creating components, having nitrates soar after a water change is not unusual. And if the alkalinity is not high enough to buffer the nitrate producers.
Here I go ramblin agin....
 

ccp2007

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Apr 29, 2014
212
1
0
united states
Duanes, I know you know your stuff when it comes to water chemistry and I'm sure other as well. I know you have a great reputation for this topic.

This may be a really dumb question but, how do you test kh and gh? Should the city know this info? I have not seen a test for either of these when I looked.

Happily married Mommy of 3 babies, 2 fur babies and 15 gilled babies
 

catfishacr

Gambusia
MFK Member
Jun 3, 2014
355
18
18
Iowa City, IA
Because GH is the general hardness of water which encompasses all mineral components of the water, and KH is the total carbonate (calcium) hardness, yes you can have a high KH, and low GH.
The aquifer where your water comes from may be calcium rich but low in other minerals such as iron and other minerals.
Being a former chemist, I can get a bit anal about these things, so bear with me.
Each time you do a liquid test, a residual of whatever you test for is left in the tube, unless you rinse thoroughly with DI water. In the lab, our test tubes were rinsed a minimum or 3 times with DI to remove residual after each test was done, and then acid washed at the end of the day.
Because you have hard water, you need to get some DI water from the supermarket just to rinse testware, in order to get accurate results, if using wet tests.
If the testing tubes are plastic, this is even more important, because plastic holds onto minerals better than glass.
You do not say if you are in a rural area, but as Pharaoh mentioned, you will want to test the tap water for nitrates, as they may be higher than the norm in agricultural areas.
However, depending on the amount of bio material in filters and in substrate, stocking levels, and other metabolism creating components, having nitrates soar after a water change is not unusual. And if the alkalinity is not high enough to buffer the nitrate producers.
Here I go ramblin agin....
Okay thanks for the info. I will get some DI water to clean the glass tubes with. I do indeed live in an rural area. Nitrates from the tap are 5ppm. KH/GH tap water levels are same as tank water. Also test kits aren't expired. So I guess the question with GH is, if its low is my tank water lacking important minerals? should I be adding anything? Other than my high nitrates are all my water parameters okay? I'am I okay to keep south american fish in these water parameters? ( Silver dollars, Catfish, Arowana) Thanks everyone for the help.

By the way please ramble on I like to learn as much as possible!!
 

catfishacr

Gambusia
MFK Member
Jun 3, 2014
355
18
18
Iowa City, IA
Duanes, I know you know your stuff when it comes to water chemistry and I'm sure other as well. I know you have a great reputation for this topic.

This may be a really dumb question but, how do you test kh and gh? Should the city know this info? I have not seen a test for either of these when I looked.

Happily married Mommy of 3 babies, 2 fur babies and 15 gilled babies
Hey if your just wanting to test KH/GH, Api makes a test kit for this.

http://www.apifishcare.com/product.php?id=587#.U6G9wvldUpU
 

duanes

MFK Moderators
Staff member
Moderator
MFK Member
Jun 7, 2007
20,883
26,058
2,910
Isla Taboga Panama via Milwaukee
Yes the city will have that info, all water depts test for these and many other parameters regularly, in fact it may be part of the info provided with, or on your water bill. You can either call the water dept directly and ask, or you can go to the city website and type in "water quality report". Everything you want or need to know should be on the annual report.
The easiest way to test for hardness is to get test strips that may be available at big box hardware stores, or companies that sell water softeners or pool supplies.
Sometimes the companies use "grains of hardness" as opposed to ppm/ml/L.
Using grains, the scale is very similar to the pH scale where 7 grains is medium (neutral) hardness and as the scale goes up, water is harder (more minerals) the lower the number less mineral content, 2 or 3 grains, soft.
I'm of the opinion, that we as fish keepers should acquire fish that fit our tap water, unless willing to make water science, a total encompassing life long persuit.
I would love to keep Uaru fernandezyepizi, but my water is not soft enough.
Because I have hard water, it allows me to keep Central Americans, rift lake Africans, and many others, but restricts me (especially from breeding) Amazonian, Asian and some other sensitive soft water species.
Trying to alter ones water can be expensive, time consuming and in the end prevent us from doing what I consider the most important part of keeping fish, water changes.
Duanes, I know you know your stuff when it comes to water chemistry and I'm sure other as well. I know you have a great reputation for this topic.

This may be a really dumb question but, how do you test kh and gh? Should the city know this info? I have not seen a test for either of these when I looked.

Happily married Mommy of 3 babies, 2 fur babies and 15 gilled babies
 

ccp2007

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Apr 29, 2014
212
1
0
united states
I have stuck with fish that fit with our tap Ph requirements because as you said, the cost of leveling gets expensive. Our Ph is 7.8

Happily married Mommy of 3 babies, 2 fur babies and 15 gilled babies
 
zoomed.com
hikariusa.com
aqaimports.com
Store