Protomelas similis & A. fire fish questions

chiroken

Feeder Fish
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Nov 3, 2012
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Vancouver Island, BC Canada
So I'm in a guy's garage and he has probably several thousand fish, closed down his pet shop mid 90's. African malawi, discus, angels and guppies. Doesn't know his stuff. Argued with me that a ruby red and fire fish are the same. Argued that his fire fish weren't peacocks because they were red! lol Bottom line is I can't trust what he says.


Has some beautiful fire fish including a few awesome albino fire fish I'd love to have. I already have fire fish but some of his are close to solid orange, reminded me almost of a P. red zebra. Mine are more flecked with iridescent flecks through the body as well as the face. Don't come across mostly full coloured orange fish in peacocks or haps. Has 3 amazing albino fire fish I'd love to get my hands on too.


If I breed my female fish fish with his male albino, I will only get albino fry IF my females (I have 5) carry the albino gene, correct? And if they do I'll get 50/50 split albino, normal. I could always take a chance on guessing a female albino from him as well unless I happen to find one holding. He's asking $50 for a male, $35 for a female which I think is crazy. Regular male fire fish are $45 on "sale" for $30. Pretty much charging retail!


I then see on a lower shelf an 8' long plywood tank so I can't get a good look at the fish other than from the top and that isn't great due to surface agitation. He said he's had this colony going 25+ yrs. At first he said they were peacocks, which I told him they were too big and the wrong body shape (largest would be 7+ inches total length). Then he said they were similus which he wrote down. Then he said they were haps similus as his memory seemed to come back. A little searching comes up with Protomelas similes as the most likely fish he's talking about.


Most pics I find don't look like the top of the fish I saw, some do. The best way I can describe the fish is that they looked like a S. fryeri from the top in that they had that metallic blue coloration on the top and it appeared like they had a dark horizontal body stripe. If this is P. similis anyone with experience with this fish?


Target tank for this fish will be an 8' all male peacock/hap tank. I am growing out currently 1 male red empress and a group of Protomelas fire haps (tons of others as well but different fish). The fire haps so far appear to have the same colouring as the red empresses. The google searches seem to confirm this. Thots on adding a P. similis with red empress and fire haps? I wouldn't mind getting a younger male, who know how old the large fish are?


He will want an arm and a leg for one of these, he already said they're worth a lot more that his fire fish breeders, but he's full of you know what! A real buffoon but he does have a few fish I'd like to add so I need to be reasonably nice to him ;)


Thanks tons.
 

RD.

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Without pics it's a guessing game. IME keeping more than one male Protomelas in the same tank generally doesn't work out well long term. Even in an all male tank ......
 

chiroken

Feeder Fish
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Nov 3, 2012
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Vancouver Island, BC Canada
If only I could see the fish! All walls were plywood. I may see if he'll net one to see the body, he will probably not even do that, a bit funny he is. Any Protomelas eh? I just received a group of juvie P. spilonotus tanzania "liluli" on Thursday. Already growing out P. fire haps "ndiwe". Hoping an 8' tank will let me break a few rules ;)
 

RD.

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An 8ft tank may or may not work out, depending on the other dimensions, and keeping in mind the OP is referring to an all male tank. (not one where a dom male has females to keep him busy) An adult Protomelas can cross an 8ft tank in the blink of an eye. Not trying to be debbie downer, but I guess you'll find out in due time. Good luck.
 

Spartacus

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Aug 8, 2011
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well a lot of the rubys I've seen these days do seem to have firefish in them,and he's basically right.A Firefish isn't a peacock.It's a hybrid.It does have mbuna in it.therefore to attach Alounacara to the name is incorrect.that's also the reason why there are so many variations of this species.023.jpg

023.jpg
 

chiroken

Feeder Fish
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Nov 3, 2012
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Vancouver Island, BC Canada
I was unaware fire fish have any mbuna, that is a first I've heard of it. Which mbuna? I've heard the OB's having mbuna. If anything I've heard there might be Protomelas in there with fire fish. And if so, then technically a hybrid versus line bred. He was basing peacock allocation by body colour. He was saying peacocks aren't red! He had a few ruby reds, poorly coloured, in his tank and I had to point them out to him, they were not the same fish as the fire fish. He was completely mixed up in what he was saying. Technically you are correct w.r.t Aulonocara. Our biggest supplier here in Canada had what I ordered as "Protomelas sp. fire fish".

well a lot of the rubys I've seen these days do seem to have firefish in them,and he's basically right.A Firefish isn't a peacock.It's a hybrid.It does have mbuna in it.therefore to attach Alounacara to the name is incorrect.that's also the reason why there are so many variations of this species.View attachment 1020877
 

timbo6684

Gambusia
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Mar 2, 2013
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While the origin of the firefish, strawberry, or dragonsblod is a mystery to me and most in the hobby...as far as I know I've never heard the mbuna theory...

Here's an interesting chart I came across awhile back.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using MonsterAquariaNetwork App

uploadfromtaptalk1403492091146.jpg
 

RD.

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And that's the problem with hybrids, there is no telling as to what the genetic make up is of each group of fish being marketed by various vendors around the world with various trade names such firefish/dragon bloods/red orchids, etc. A vendor in Germany could be using a completely different cross/line compared to another vendor in Bangkok, and both could be marketing them under the same name. Clearly they are more than just a selective line bred Aulonocara ......
 
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