PH issue

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Nigelk8485

Gambusia
MFK Member
Oct 3, 2014
462
1
18
Louisville, KY
I noticed that during my fishless cycle the ammonia has stopped decreasing as much as it was maybe a week or two ago. I tested my pH yesterday and noticed that it didn't even change the pale yellow color to signify 6.0. I did a large water change to increase the pH and got it back up to 7.8; however, less than 24 hours, the pH has dropped way back down to 6.4 again. I realize that pH fluctuations are common during a fishless cycle and it doesn't help that the only things in my tank are driftwood and plants, but should the pH be dropping that quickly? I'm looking at going and buying crushed coral tomorrow to add to the filter and aid with buffering the pH, doing another water change today to raise it until then. Any other suggestions?


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HarleyK

HarleyK

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Before you go out and buy stuff, I'd ask what your gH and kH are, because they determine the pH balance. Also, what substrate do you have ( ADA lowers pH like crazy) and what Fish do you want top keep ( pH 6 could be okay)


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N

Nigelk8485

Gambusia
MFK Member
Oct 3, 2014
462
1
18
Louisville, KY
HarleyK said:
Before you go out and buy stuff, I'd ask what your gH and kH are, because they determine the pH balance. Also, what substrate do you have ( ADA lowers pH like crazy) and what Fish do you want top keep ( pH 6 could be okay)


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I'm not sure, I only have the API master kit. I'll invest in one since I see it mentioned frequently. And I'm going for an oscar, either a delhezi or Senegal bichir, a shoal of rainbowfish, and then either a severum or acara. I'm using pool filter sand.


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mudbuttjones

mudbuttjones

Fire Eel
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Jul 29, 2014
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If I'm not mistaken driftwood leaching tannins could possibly affect Ph to some degree

Plants can also consume nutrients from the water column that help stabilize or buffer ph to some degree. (Deplete the carbonate hardness of the water for co2 production? ?)

Im no expert, just trying to throw out some possibilities. Your ph will fluctuate between during water changes. The nitrogen cycle Is constantly altering your water chemistry.

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N

Nigelk8485

Gambusia
MFK Member
Oct 3, 2014
462
1
18
Louisville, KY
mudbuttjones said:
If I'm not mistaken driftwood leaching tannins could possibly affect Ph to some degree

Plants can also consume nutrients from the water column that help stabilize or buffer ph to some degree. (Deplete the carbonate hardness of the water for co2 production? ?)

Im no expert, just trying to throw out some possibilities. Your ph will fluctuate between during water changes. The nitrogen cycle Is constantly altering your water chemistry.

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As far as I can tell the wood is no longer visually leaching tannins but I was aware that the pH would lower due to the nitrification process, the wood, and the plants. I just wasn't expecting such a large shift between a relatively high pH to an almost barely recognizable low pH. I know that the cycle can slow down tremendously due to such a low pH and it seems like if that were a regular occurrence, dropping from the upper 7's to the low 6's, then constant water changes to keep the pH high would be mentioned in the fishless cycling process.


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duanes

duanes

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Though your tap water in Louisville has an alkalinity of 74ppm, found in the box at the bottom of the cites annual report ( http://louisvillewater.com/sites/lo...oads/pdf files/FINAL CCR 2014-WEB version.pdf) only 45ppm of that total is calcium.
And because calcium is the substance that provides buffering capacity, your conclusion that large water changes to keep pH stable is a good one.
That also suggests to me, that when you finally add fish, that regime of frequent partial water changes will need to be kept up to maintain a stable pH, especially if you plan to over stock, or keep large fish.
Also remember that plants use oxygen at night and produce carbonic acid in the process, so if you test in the evening and get for example, a pH of 7, and test again in the morning and get a pH of 6, that would be very normal for the plant produced carbonic acid to drop pH considerably, especially with the calcium alkalinity of only 45ppm .
 
N

Nigelk8485

Gambusia
MFK Member
Oct 3, 2014
462
1
18
Louisville, KY
duanes said:
Though your tap water in Louisville has an alkalinity of 74ppm, found in the box at the bottom of the cites annual report ( http://louisvillewater.com/sites/lo...oads/pdf files/FINAL CCR 2014-WEB version.pdf) only 45ppm of that total is calcium.
And because calcium is the substance that provides buffering capacity, your conclusion that large water changes to keep pH stable is a good one.
That also suggests to me, that when you finally add fish, that regime of frequent partial water changes will need to be kept up to maintain a stable pH, especially if you plan to over stock, or keep large fish.
Also remember that plants use oxygen at night and produce carbonic acid in the process, so if you test in the evening and get for example, a pH of 7, and test again in the morning and get a pH of 6, that would be very normal for the plant produced carbonic acid to drop pH considerably, especially with the calcium alkalinity of only 45ppm .
Click to expand...
You're awesome. So do you think adding crushed coral would solve it?


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J

joe jaskot

Dovii
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Sep 16, 2011
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Your pH constantly dropping is due to low kh of your water. A simple solution is to add baking soda to bring the kh up and to stabilize the pH.
 
duanes

duanes

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Crushed coral will add some of the buffering capacity your make up water doesn't naturally have. The coral very slowly dissolves, as acids are produced and neutralized, and may need replaced over time.
I made fluidized bed reactors using aragonite to help buffer my tanks, and found every few months I needed to replace a small amount of the sand.
I find water changes a much more useful tool in combating acidification, in that there are so many other positive effects of removing old water during water changes.
The removal of the acids, nitrates, and hormones to name a few.
 
N

Nigelk8485

Gambusia
MFK Member
Oct 3, 2014
462
1
18
Louisville, KY
Well my gh and kh test came in. I'm kind of confused by the results. The gh required seven drops before changing colors which equates to 125.3 ppm. The kh required just two drops, or 35.8 ppm. Do I take the average of these as my gh and kh hardness? The chart they give lumps them together.


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