Possible Mistake with 110G Cichlid Tank

Telsiph

Feeder Fish
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Apr 23, 2015
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I have a 110 G cichlid tank that ran with an 8 inch Green Severum, an 8 inch Leopard Pleco, a 6 inch Red Tailed Shark, and a 6 inch Raphael Catfish for 3 months. I used this to get my large 100 gallon recommended out of filter and my smaller in tank filter cycled and ready for real fish.

So the time comes for me to turn this thing into a real Cichlid tank and I grab the fish I've always wanted, a Tiger Oscar. I put him in the tank and he's about 4 inches long and he's doing very well for a day until the Severum starts beating the #%$& out of him. I ask on the forums and at my FLGS and they recommend that I add 1 or 2 more cichlids so that the aggression is spread throughout the tank and not focused on one fish. Plus it is also best to get all of your cichlids while small and at the same time so they grow up together. So I head back to the FLGS and they convince me to get a Green Terror and a Fire mouth. Great, sounds good, move goes fine and everything looks good.

Then the aggression ramps up again and I'm told that dither fish would be a good idea to finish the tank with, so I head back with the intention of getting 2 Silver Dollars and calling it a day, but the FLGS convince me that a school of 6 giant danios would be best because they are faster and that it is fine for a tank that size. I also lowered my temperature to about 75 degrees. This means that the current stock is

6 - 2 inch Giant Danios (max 18" of fish)
1 - 4 Inch Tiger Oscar (max 12" of fish)
1 - 2 Inch Green Terror (max 6" of fish"
1 - 3 Inch Fire Mouth (max 8" of fish)
1 - 8 Inch Green Severum (fully grown)
1 - 10 inch Pleco (max 12" of fish)
1 - 5 inch Red Tail (fully grown)
1 - 5 inch Raphael (fully grown)

(74 inches)

So now the aggression problem is fixed, everyone seems incredibly happy but I'm being told on another forum after I posted it proudly that the tank is massively overstocked and that I should return every fish but the Oscar and stick with the original setup. That would be one heck of a return, and I'm curious if my current setup is manageable with biweekly water changes and perhaps changing out the smaller in tank filter for another large out of tank filter (maybe some kind of chemical treatment?). I feel like after watching some videos of other 110s that the current amount of fish is doable, but I'm honestly not sure. I'm kinda kicking myself for letting the FLGS talk me into a green terror and the 6 giant danios.

If I messed up then I messed up and I'll work to fix the tank. I understand the aggression might be fine now but it could be an entirely different beast in 6 months. I appreciate your time reading through all this and would appreciate any time you can give on this matter!
 

Montelboom

Plecostomus
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May 20, 2014
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There are several problems with your stocking. The Oscar will eventually snack on the giant danios, firemouths are kinda wussys and only get 6" inches max usually and green terrors can get up to twelve inches. Along with that firemouths grow slow and green terrors grow at snail speed so as the oscar gets bigger they might be eaten or fall to aggression from the severum as it already shows itself to be aggressive. Another thing is that I think it would be best to not use the gallon per inch rule when stocking cichlids. You will need to cut down on your stock before anything mentioned above happens.

Lastly what kind of filter do you have running on the tank?
 

Montelboom

Plecostomus
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May 20, 2014
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Also do you know the dimensions of the tank?
 

neutrino

Goliath Tigerfish
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Tank is 4 or 5 ft long? (I've seen both for 110s) The inch per gallon 'rule', if that's what you're thinking of in adding up inches of fish, is more a guide for beginners with typical community fish and relatively meaningless with cichlids, where you have to consider territory, fish girth and not just length, feeding habits (oscars are notoriously messy fish needing a lot of water volume and strong filtration), species aggression and other factors. Some cichlids you can stock heavier than 1" per gallon and some, like oscars, need a lot more than a gallon per inch.

While the fish are small, maybe no problem in your tank, but as adults-- If it's a 4 ft tank the oscar plus some odd dithers or catfish may be about it. Or severum and green terror or firemouth might work if they tolerate each other (I've had sevs and green terrors get along well.) If it's a 5 ft. tank, you could do a little more with right mix. But you're also underestimating potential max size of some of those fish. Green terror males can get 9,10 inches easy, some larger. Severums also, except for rotkeils, 8 inches is on the small side. 9,10 inch sevs are common and they can get larger than that.

You're correct about aggression. Fish that are 3,4 inches are often not displaying their adult temperament, especially with a larger but tolerant fish in the tank. At this point they're respecting the larger fish, but when they start putting on size of their own and hormones get rolling things can change pretty quick.
 

Telsiph

Feeder Fish
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Apr 23, 2015
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Well the fire mouth was the primary reason for the changes as he is the most aggressive one in the tank! The severum really calmed down once everything got into the tank as she was really only picking on the Oscar when it was a solo addition. Obviously this could change, but she's been incredibly peaceful up until that Oscar was added and ever since I added more fish she has been the nicest one in the tank. Really all the aggression at the moment is coming from the Firemouth, but it is still very early in their lives and my primary concern is the ammonie and nitrite in the tank.

I'm definitely not using the inch per gallon rule with Cichlids, I have no interest in getting to 110 inches of fish and where I am at now is the absolute max I would ever go. The filtration is a smaller

Also do green terrors reach 12 inches normally?! I thought they really only hit 8 inches normally. Filtration wise I am using an Emperor 400 and a Tetra Whisper Internal Filter. My thoughts are that I might need to replace that Internal with another Emperor.
 

Telsiph

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Apr 23, 2015
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Sorry about the broken replies, I'm used to being able to edit posts and I'm hitting post a little too quickly!

So what is the easiest change I can make for the tank? I'll be honest I really love my Oscar. Would I be able to get by with removing the Firemouth or Green Terror and leaving the rest? Right now the Green Terror and Firemouth follow each other around the tank and are buds as I added them together, but obviously that might change. If I have to take back both the Green Terror and Fire mouth I will, but I guess I was hoping to find some way to make the tank safe for them to grow in and see how the aggression turns out as they mature, and then making a decision on who to re-home if it becomes a necessity. If that is unsafe/inhuman for the fish however then I definitely want to avoid that.

Thanks for the replies here, I really appreciate it!
 

jaws7777

Probation Member
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Your sev was in the tank longer and claimed it. I had the same problem a while back. Why dont you think the sevs are real cichlids ? And if you always wanted a tiger oscar why didmt you start out with one

Anyway seems like your lfs was doing what most lfs do...making money off of you. As others have said that tank wont work out long term with that many fish. I would leave the sev, gt and firemouth with some dithers.


Or rehome everyone start from scratch and get the fish you want most then build around it.

Sent from my SM-G900P using MonsterAquariaNetwork App
 

Telsiph

Feeder Fish
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Apr 23, 2015
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I never said a Severum isn't a real Cichlid? I also started with a 35 Gallon and upgraded, putting a Tiger Oscar in a 35 gallon was not an option.
 

neutrino

Goliath Tigerfish
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IMO, assuming the more common 110 gal length of 4 ft, you have three reasonable options.

1) Decide whether the oscar will be the anchor fish for the tank or not. If not and you want a display of several cichlids, the oscar probably doesn't fit the tank. If yes, the other cichlids-- or at least most of them-- should go eventually. 12 inches is not the max for an oscar. If you did a bell curve, the peak of the curve would be more like 12-14 inches, but they can get a few inches larger. An oscar and one other decent sized cichlid would be cozy in those dimensions, but might be possible if the oscar is amenable.

2) Play it by ear, let them grow a bit, see which of the fish are getting along, which you really want to keep, and adjust your stock accordingly. Any of those cichlids can vary in aggression by individual, so there's no single formula for how they'll do together, and since aggression is often relative to a particular tank and what's in that tank, adding or removing fish can also change the dynamics of how they get along.

3) Plan on a bigger (longer) tank if you want to keep them all together with the oscar.

IME with green terror size (for males), if you plotted them on a bell curve, 9 inches would probably be at the peak of the curve, 10 inches close to the peak, 11 inches not far off the peak, 12 inches possible but less common. In other words, more often than not a male will exceed 8 inches ime.

Not telling you absolutes, as in there's no way this or that will or won't work or as though there's an absolute cosmic and moral truth in gallons about how much space makes this or that species happy or unhappy. Sometimes you just have to see it in your own tank and see what works for you. On the other hand, you should know that some of your estimated max sizes are at the low end for some of those fish. With good care they're capable of being larger than those estimates and all together would make a crowded tank once they're grown.
 
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