I am getting a whole bunch of insignus females for my gorgeous young male, but I also have a 6" marginatus that is pretty stunning. I was curious if anyone's tried or seen a cross of the two? I couldn't find anything but I figured they aren't the most famous haps so maybe it just wasn't well publicized. If anyone has any experience here I'd love to hear/see what you ended up with. My only fear is that you may just end up with a very muddled insignus as the color on the Marginatus isn't as defined and more lighting based. My hope, however, is that I could produce a fish with both the two tone of the Insignus and the chromatic turquoise of the Marginatus. A kid can dream right?
Has anyone tried crossing Protomelas Marginatus with Protomelas Insignus?
- Thread starter Life Liberty Cichlids
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Please do not do this. Most (maybe all) malawi hybrids are much less attractive than their parents. The hobby already has too many impure stock.. Get a marginatus female.. marginatus are a beautiful fish that is not easy to find.. you would be doing the hobby a favor by producing more of those.
I disagree to be honest. I think there is no problem creating hybrid fry so long as you label them as such and keep them to yourself unless you intend to line breed. Moreover, while I agree that my marginatus is a gorgeous fish, I don't see any issue with exercising curiosity to see what the two together would make. Worst case scenario is I get some oddly colored fry for a 40 gallon I have laying around. And, beyond that, by virtue of the marginatus being difficult to find, so too are females of the breed. I have a 6" male that would make a phenomenal breeder that I'd be happy to propagate, but I have yet to see anyone selling females of the breed.
I would also mention that I've seen some truly gorgeous hybrid strains once they've had enough effort put into them. Sulfur head x polystigma as produced bright yellow blazes on poly's for a friend of mine on his 6th and 7th generations of line breeding combined with backtracing to the original poly's
I have no problem if someone wants to make hybrids, but they shouldn't distribute them into the hobby.. they need to keep them.
The problem is that if these hybrids are sold to another guy, and then the other guy sells them as pure bred, which is becoming a huge problem.. it is getting to the point where I don't want to buy Malawi fish from other hobbyist anymore.. Like I understand people have three different Malawi species in a tank, one is holding, so the hobbyist wants to raise the fry.
But the problem is they will look like species X, and then it is often difficult to know that they are really a hybrid with X and something else..and then they are passed on to other people as pure, even if it is not intentional.
outbreeding of this nature can actually be beneficial. For example, fish that were imported in limited amounts that are now no longer imported tend to form mini populations that get highly inbred and it's just easier to keep inbreeding than it is to import from somewhere else on the continent. If you were to hybridize say one generation and then breed back to which ever species you are intending it as moving forward, within about 4 generations you will probably see very little of the outbred species but with a higher potential for strong genetics.
Keep in mind that hybridizing for cichlids is probably fairly common in the wild, as is inbreeding. Just label it as such and you should be fine, though selling them etc might cause lazy stores/individuals to not keep track, so perhaps culling would be necessary.
Also keep in mind how resistant to inbreeding most cichlids are (some apparently do even better while inbreeding like Neolamprologus sp) and also how readily they hybridize.
Keep in mind that hybridizing for cichlids is probably fairly common in the wild, as is inbreeding. Just label it as such and you should be fine, though selling them etc might cause lazy stores/individuals to not keep track, so perhaps culling would be necessary.
Also keep in mind how resistant to inbreeding most cichlids are (some apparently do even better while inbreeding like Neolamprologus sp) and also how readily they hybridize.
There is some hybridization in the wild in the great rift lakes, but it is not common.
See the works by Koenings and other researchers.
It is not that difficult to get fish of the same species that are not siblings.
If I am buying a Malawi cichlid, I do not want it to have another species in its line.. That is still a hybrid. The outbreeding you speak of is why it is difficult to find pure fish now.
Most hybrids in the hobby come from irresponsible hobbyists, that see a female holding in a community tank, harvest the fry and then keep/sell them as pure when they are not 100% sure. If you can not keep Malawi fish in a species tank for breeding purposes, you probably should not be distributing fry. (Even in a species tank, sometimes things get screwed up because someone sold you an impure parent).
