poly family tree questions

[jaws7777]

Just picked up aqualog olypterus by by frank schafer.

I have a question about the poly groups. In the book he mentions 4 groupings of polys as follows

P. Bichir group-
Consitong of p. Ansorgii, p. Bichir (pbb ?) , p.congicus, p. Endli, and p.lap.

P. Delhezi group-
Constisting of p.delhezi, p. Ornatipinnis, and p.werksii

P.senegalus group
Consisting of only p.senegalus

P.palmas group
Consisting of p.palmas, p.buettikofrleri, p.polli, p.retro,

I always thought the break down for lower jaws was two groups lap and endli.

Lap -
Pbb, laps (including all variants), koliba/koloton (i guess still open for classification.

Endli -
Congicus, endlis (including all variantss)

Where does ansorgii fit ?

We still have no clue about sp. Dabola so lets leave that out of the discussion for simplicity

How do the upper jaws break down ?

This isnt a knock on the book as i really enjoying it, was published in 2004 so im sure allot has changed since then

 

[moe214]

Interesting, I thought if it the same way you did kind of. Lower jaws was lap and endli for me, and ansorgii was more like a lap to me, but idk how to identify them properly or much about them at all so idk either. Upper jaws, for me the only group or complex was palmas, and the others were just all different to me. Interested in what more experienced and knowledgeable keepers have to say

 

[jaws7777]

Yeah moe i didnt know where ansorgii fit. I thought lap.

Totally lost on how upper jaws break down. I kind of thought they were all palmas.

 

[DMD123]

Well the ansorgii seems to defy a LJ or UJ category because of its 'two jaws of equal length'
http://www.fishbase.org/summary/5005

 

[Dr.B]

Well one of the problems with the book is that it was published in 2004. As you said a lot has changed since then. At the time the book was published (not to mention the years taken to write it), polypterus teugelsi was still polypterus sp. Cameroon, what we know as retropinnis was still called "Zaire Green" and what we know as Mokelembembe was still called "Retropinnis." Also in the book there are a decent amount of mis identifications. PBB as Laps, Laps as PBB, Buettikoferi as palmas palmas. As far as the classings congicus is actually closer to being a lap than an endli.

I see it as this

Polypterus Senegalus

Polypterus Delhezi

Polypterus Ornatipinnis

Polypterus Weeksii

Polypterus Teugelsi

Polypterus Mokelembembe

Polypterus Polli

Palmas Complex- Polypterus Palmas Palmas, Polypterus Palmas Buettikoferi

LJs

Polypterus Bichir Complex- Polypterus Bichir Bichir, Polypterus Bichir Lapradei (all variants included since none are described)

Polypterus Congicus

Polypterus Endlicheri

Polypterus Ansorgii

 

[moe214]

Isn't congicus a sub species of endlicheri though?

 

[jaws7777]

Well one of the problems with the book is that it was published in 2004. As you said a lot has changed since then. At the time the book was published (not to mention the years taken to write it), polypterus teugelsi was still polypterus sp. Cameroon, what we know as retropinnis was still called "Zaire Green" and what we know as Mokelembembe was still called "Retropinnis." Also in the book there are a decent amount of mis identifications. PBB as Laps, Laps as PBB, Buettikoferi as palmas palmas. As far as the classings congicus is actually closer to being a lap than an endli.

I see it as this

Polypterus Senegalus

Polypterus Delhezi

Polypterus Ornatipinnis

Polypterus Weeksii

Polypterus Teugelsi

Polypterus Mokelembembe

Polypterus Polli

Palmas Complex- Polypterus Palmas Palmas, Polypterus Palmas Buettikoferi

LJs

Polypterus Bichir Complex- Polypterus Bichir Bichir, Polypterus Bichir Lapradei (all variants included since none are described)

Polypterus Congicus

Polypterus Endlicheri

Polypterus Ansorgii

Wow see i thought that lower jaw had to complex's lap and endli.

So all of th upper jaws are of a different complex ?

Isn't congicus a sub species of endlicheri though?

Me too

 

[Dr.B]

No it's not. It was actually described as its own species

 

[moe214]

No it's not. It was actually described as its own species

Didn't know that, thanks. The Internet can be misleading lol

 

[jaws7777]

Doc not doubting you at all but can you post that info. Loke moe said the internet is misleading and good stuff is hard to come by