100% self-sustaining 240

[Bsixxx]

Sold all my monsters and eels, going another route after a visit to a buddy of mines shop.
He has a 100% self-sustaing tank, as in the tank grows algea and micro organisms and so on to feed the inhabitants from the corals, the shrimps and to the fish.

Well i have decided to go that same route, planning for the next few months in my 240.
Planning on getting a larger sump and converting it to a giant refugium. Filtration wise this will be the only means of filtration, other than the algea and seagrasses i will be growing as well as the bacteria from the live rock and sand. No skimmer or reactors of anykind. Only a small one layer of bio filtration. Which will be a filter pad. Plan on just growing algea and bacteria for the next few months, and planting some algea and plants after that untill it gets a good head start. Fish inhabitants will only be a few tangs and a few dwarf angels, followe by a few crustations i am still researching.

This is the very breif planning i have come up with so far, but it should begin to take shape by mid- september. As in first plant matter and crustations.


Please share thoughts on this.

 

[Otherone]

Interesting concept for a tank that has been running for many years however from scratch you may need a bunch of help to get to this piont. I call my angel and Tangs "sea deer" - they graze all day and nite long. It would take alot of algae to sustain them esp. when the Tangs get larger. Also Dwarf angels are similair in attitude and behavior to mbuna african cichlids, it's probable multiple Dwarf angels will squable til stress becomes a disease issue within the tank.

As for plants, I tried seas fans ( flora) in the tank w/ Tangs - didn't last a week - they comped'm but by no means am I saying it's impossible just not probable. After a week or two of owning and feeing Tangs seaweed you'll see what I mean about Sea deer.

I'm guessin' your gonna do an R/O system feeding an autodrip( replenish Hydrogen) into the sump ( I have this system and don't use it)- hopfully your chlorine levels are low and heavy metals high from the tap otherwise a UV sterilzer( I don't use my UV) will probably be needed which will also kill bacteria and algae spores within' the water column. Also if all trace elements are removed suppliments might be needed. A protien skimmers not alot of maintence for it's benifits - empty the smelly cup full once or twice a week, but may be able to get away without it if you got enuff flora to eat the dissolved protiens in the water column. If you go the coral route I'd strongly suggest a skimmer for many reasons.

Either or Hope this helps a lil' and keep us updated - best of luck to you

 

[Bsixxx]

Thanks for the input, will take much into consideration.
As for stock It should be severely limited, like 4 fish tops.

As for algea and marine plants I have ordered the following from live aquaria
1 lb Ulva Lettuce Algae
1 lb Red Gracilaria Feeding Algae
1 lb Red Bush Algae
and already have a little bit of hair algea growing alon the powerheads.
I plan on letting all this grow for about 3-4 months to get established and see how it does with water conditions and flow to see if i need to adjust anything to maximize growth rate in my tank.

After the algea and plants get established enough for my liking and basically cover the tank, i plan on setting up a brine shrimp colony and then after get either a mysid or ghost shrimp colony going if the brine can be sustained by the enough to not be decimated by the mysid or ghost shrimp.

After i get this going (assuming all goes perfectly and in a balanced manor) I should ad the first few fish as babies, smallest as possible. Which shall be the following...

3x Saddleback butterflyfish
1x Magnificent Foxface
1x Jackknife Fish
1x (Clown Tang) or (Naso Blonde Tang ) or (Lieutenant Tang ) or (Blue Unicorn Tang ) or an achillies tang, not quite sure yet.

Tank is a 240 gallon tank 8x2x2.
Lots of planning but sure to get it going soon.
Will update soon.

 

[Zoodiver]

Jack knife is a schooling fish, you'll want more. They are also a very high metabolism fish, so you'll need to feed it if you get them.
Also, you said 4 fish tops, then listed 6. ??


Not to be a downer, this idea sound great on paper, but it doesn't usually work out on small systems like this. Dead sand (which is what you'll get without gravel vac'ing the tank) will create pockets of an-aerobic bacteria (not aerobic like a healthy tank needs). If anything disturbs a big area, your tank will die off 100% in a day. The idea of a refug only sump will also lead to issues after time. You'll need mechanical filtration of some kind or you'll end up with pockets of detritus that will create issues as well. Rock and sand break down over time, and animals/plants don't address any of that.

 

[Bsixxx]

Yea lets re phrase that 4-6 fish,
Self sustaining for the most part, clearly i'd do some basic tank maintenance. I get what you are saying, maybe i'll re think the whole protein skimmer thing, but probably keep it on a timer using it maybe 3 hours or so out of the day.
The thing i'm trying to accomplish is what my friend has, yea his system all togeter is about 850 gallons including the refugium. but I think i can manage this in a smaller scale. Maybe cut down to 3 fish total. As in a single Naso tang, magnificent forxface, and something other than the butterfly fish and jack knife. maybe seahorse lol.
but yes still on the drawuing board as of right now, all i have are plants and algea in the tank. nothing else.

 

[Heathd]

I dont see it working. You are trying to emulate mother nature, and if it was that easy, we wouldnt dump all the cash we do for equipment and chems.

The fuge you would have to implement in order to feed your fish with no supplemental feedings would have to be absolutely huge, and the maturity of the tank would need to be a year before you put anything fish in it so the pod and other micro-fauna populations would be saturated and self-sustaining.

Im not trying to burst a bubble for you. Its just coming from my personal experiences with the whole "natural method". I had caulerpa in a large fuge and was never able to keep nitrates or phosphates in check... even with a light bioload.

 

[Otherone]

There in lies the "Catch -22" - without the top of the food chain the bottom can not exsist. Bacteria needs more than just light to survive, without a constent source of decomposion any and all bacterias that would feed the fuge and clear the water of unhealthy gases would die off as the "cycle" can not complete. Macro algaes excell with phospherous, nitrogen, and C02 - all created naturally via the breakdown of solid waste. Without this they will at the very least not grow and slowly die off. Pod populations will only grow to it's food source limitations. Without healthy bacterial colonies they too will die off. I'm not sure supplimental feedings on such a small scale will do much to mantain a healthy cycle perhaps if you kept throwing rotting fish meat in the tank daily but that seems a tad extreme and quite unattractive. - Hence - your tanks gonna need alotta help in the begining couple of years.


If your only gonna run the skimmer 3 hours a day don't waste your time or money - skimmers don't work that way. They need time themselves to establish balance within it's system, usually upon start up - 2-7 days. This intial start up process will reoccur when the skimmer isn't running after several hours. Basically all it's gonna give you is a full cup of water daily.

 

[Heathd]

You could supplement with ammonia drops or rotting market shrimp to get the same effect as doing a cycle with fish....

 

[Zoodiver]

I agree with running the skimmer 100% of the time.

 

[Bsixxx]

Just to clarify tank has been running for a long while even afte i got rid of the big fish, never have turned the system off. The sump i am using now is pretty large the one i plan on using is 6x2x30, which is what i plan on throwing under the tank. i get that this tiny system wont work entirely by itself but thats why its a fish tank. I will be constantly maintaning it. and watching it...