A sump filtration rant up for debate.

[LD50]

I have a well fed adult Trimac pair in a 90g with a 29g sump and not 1 oz of bio media in it. A few lbs of hornwart and hydrophila keep all readings at 0 even after 2 weeks of no WC (I do 10% every other week and have pristine water) . I also know a few other people and MFK threads that have had the wonderful bennies of plant/algae filtration in their sumps (pristine water, fish munchies, no alagae in the display) so why is it still so common that people insist on sumps full of scrubbies/bio balls/ceramic rings etc (and the eventual frequent 30/50% WC's to maintain water quality) ? The salt side of the hobby has been useing plants for years to keep their tanks and water quality pristine, why are the fresh water guys so reluctant to use anything other than typical NH3/4 ->NO3 filtration?

Discuss

 

[RedDwarf]

The quick and simple answer is that most people overstock and over feed their thank hence the need for larger biological filtration.

 

[NatashaAliza]

x2

 

[Juxtaroberto]

Because while most aquatic plants prefer NH3/NH4+, and therefore prevent even a build up of nitrates in the first place, there's always the risk of them not getting enough nutrients/lights/carbon, and dying. It's a lot easier for a plant to die than for your BB to die, so there's always an associated risk.

 

[Burto]

What sort of lighting do you have?

I have a lot of plants in all my tanks but only a couple have enough plants growing at a fast enough rate in relation to the stocking and feeding level that I think they could do away with filter media and water changes.

In terms of initial and ongoing costs I'm not sure an algae/plant scrubber method of filtration would work out cheaper than filter media and water changes for my other tanks, unless I could utilise free sunlight.

 

[LD50]

The quick and simple answer is that most people overstock and over feed their thank hence the need for larger biological filtration.

Good answer, but "needing" 3 AC110's and 2 FX5's or a large sump packed with nothing but ceramic rings to handle the bio load on a 75g tank with 4 adult oscars that get a heaping cup of ol'roy dog food every other hour weather they need it or not is just bad fish keeping. I was targeting the people who stock properly and fight nitrogen and DOC's via WC's in an attempt to keep top water quality to grow healthy fish in a well balanced aquarium.

Because while most aquatic plants prefer NH3/NH4+, and therefore prevent even a build up of nitrates in the first place, there's always the risk of them not getting enough nutrients/lights/carbon, and dying. It's a lot easier for a plant to die than for your BB to die, so there's always an associated risk.

Plants wither over time they dont just insta die causeing an issue, if there is a nutrient/light problem the plants will tell you long before they die. But then again I suppose some ppl might not want the hastle of takeing a peek at the status of a fuge every few days. And thats totaly cool, I get it but I know there are quite a number of people on MFK who love to tinker with their system looking for ways to improve it.

What sort of lighting do you have?

I have a lot of plants in all my tanks but only a couple have enough plants growing at a fast enough rate in relation to the stocking and feeding level that I think they could do away with filter media and water changes.

In terms of initial and ongoing costs I'm not sure an algae/plant scrubber method of filtration would work out cheaper than filter media and water changes for my other tanks, unless I could utilise free sunlight.

I have free floating hydrophila/hornwart growing under two 20w clip on home depot lights with 6700k "grow" CFL bulbs. The start up cost was about as much as a new FX5, if you count the plants I pull out and sell off it probably paid for itself by the first year. If you are not running a sump allready or have a pre/home made one with small intricate chambers it would not be cost effective to switch. However your plain jane sumps that have a large area for bio media could be doing so much more than being high volume AC110's.

 

[aclockworkorange]

I personally think it's because it seems the majority of MFK can readily plumb amazing huge tank setups... but big systems of live plants in said setups are some sort of mystical realm of fish keeping that is far too complicated to be attempted.

 

[Burto]

I have free floating hydrophila/hornwart growing under two 20w clip on home depot lights with 6700k "grow" CFL bulbs. The start up cost was about as much as a new FX5, if you count the plants I pull out and sell off it probably paid for itself by the first year. If you are not running a sump allready or have a pre/home made one with small intricate chambers it would not be cost effective to switch. However your plain jane sumps that have a large area for bio media could be doing so much more than being high volume AC110's.

That's my kind of filtration, but keep in mind you've got an extra 40 watts of electricity on the lights in your sump, which is probably cheaper to run where you live but not free.

I planned on doing something similar with the sump on my 6x2x2 when I got it, a large chamber with a deep sand bed and floating water hyacinth growing under 2x 2' 18 watt T8 fluorescent lights, maybe try raising some cherry shrimp in there, but I quickly realised I valued silence too much to keep the sump.

 

[fox3]

I am running a fuge in my 40G sump onna 210G tank. I completely removed all biomedia after ~6 months after getting tired of trying to net fry which went for a ride down the chute and took up residence in the bio chamber.

Ammonia and trItes never budged and the tank is over stocked/ fed with 3 dozen and more large mature Haps and mbuna.

My nitrAtes are still a problem though and will rise to 30 or more if I do not perform water changes. Plants are good and all but WC's are still a mandatory.

 

[RedDwarf]

Good answer, but "needing" 3 AC110's and 2 FX5's or a large sump packed with nothing but ceramic rings to handle the bio load on a 75g tank with 4 adult oscars that get a heaping cup of ol'roy dog food every other hour weather they need it or not is just bad fish keeping. I was targeting the people who stock properly and fight nitrogen and DOC's via WC's in an attempt to keep top water quality to grow healthy fish in a well balanced aquarium.

You do understand that your plants in your sump are acting as a bio-media and absorption media as well. In a balanced aquarium, there is no need for all the added filtration that you find in most aquariums. Just regular WC's to replenish nutrients not found in the food you give to your fish and to decrease chemical compounds that some fish secrete. Algae/plant scrubbers work wonderfully to remove excess nutrients from the water but can't remove everything harmful hence the need for WC's.
Vegetative filtration is only really cost effective in a pond type setting if your going to have larger bio-loads.