Advice on plumbing my drilled 135g

[elting44]

Let me preface this by saying I am a noob when it comes to overflows and plumbing. I have a couple of questions for the more experienced folks.

Here is a rough sketch of what I have in mind for my plumbing.

Right now I plan on having the 1" bulkhead drain into a ball valve, and then have vinyl tubing go from the valve to an elbow, both fastened by cement and hose clamps. The more reading I do the more it seems the barbed fittings with hose clamps is the preferred method, so I may go that route.

Will I experience a loss of overflow capacity by implementing a ball valve? Or can I plan on still having the 600 gph on the overflows?

In the picture I have the return pump going to 3/4" PVC the whole way? I assume there a better method? The Sen 900 pump is rated at about 820 gph at the height I will be running (4'8"), by splitting it into two 3/4" returns how much of that can I expect to lose?

I assume that the side with the longer plumbing will have slower flow, Instead of using 3/4" PVC, could I put in a "Y" fitting and use 3/4" Vinyl for the returns, the goal being to have similar lengths on each side of the "Y" (or at least closer in length I would have in the drawing)?

Thanks for the help.

 

[fox3]

Barb fittings restrict flow. They are very good at that. Mebbe use 1-1/4" vinyl tubing right off the drain then the restrictions from the barb fittings will not be as detrimental to overall flow. Use 90° sweeps if you can instead of elbows.

Use larger plumbing off the pump, say 1" and tee off 1" then reduce to 3/4" just before you reach your returns. Use flexible whenever you make contact with the tank to reduce shock and quiet the plumbing.

I've used PVC on two 1" drains converting from barb to a sweep right at the tank and get ~ 800 gph ( or more) thru each of them.

 

[elting44]

Barb fittings restrict flow. They are very good at that. Mebbe use 1-1/4" vinyl tubing right off the drain then the restrictions from the barb fittings will not be as detrimental to overall flow. Use 90° sweeps if you can instead of elbows.

Use larger plumbing off the pump, say 1" and tee off 1" then reduce to 3/4" just before you reach your returns. Use flexible whenever you make contact with the tank to reduce shock and quiet the plumbing.

I've used PVC on two 1" drains converting from barb to a sweep right at the tank and get ~ 800 gph ( or more) thru each of them.

Thanks for taking the time to help, although I am confused

So go from a the drain bulkhead go directly to a 90 degree sweep? Or go from the bulkhead to a barbed fitting?

"Use flexible whenever you make contact with the tank"

Does that mean use vinyl before the bulkhead on the returns?

I apologize for not understanding

 

[fox3]

Use a barb fitting and connect to the bulkhead with 1-1/4" flexible tubing. This barb will be threaded into a slip fitting with threads and glue that into the sweep, or elbow if you absolutely cannot find a sweep. I used a 1-1/2" sweep as that was what the pool supply carried and then reduced that back down to 1-1/4". You can find most hard to get sch40 PVC at irragation supplies or commercial pool supplies. Or mail order.

You might want to make all connections to the tank with flexible plumbing, either vinyl, spa flex, flexible tubing etc. In case you bump into it while doing maintenance it acts as a shock absorber and also dampens noise from being telegraphed back into the tank. I use vinyl as it is easier to clamp than spa flex.

 

[Egon]

I agree with Fox3 on the barb fittings restricting flow. They are not recommended for drain lines. Drains are low pressure so leaks are minimal if ever.
You have a good set up to work with; I will give my .02 as if this was my tank to set up. The following will maximize water flow through your system, IMO:
The Drain: Maximizing the drain flow is the most important part of a sump system like yours. Get rid of the ball valves, no need for them on your system. Make your drain plumbing size the same as the drain bulkhead size all the way to your sump. So if you have 1” drain bulkheads then go with 1” PVC all the way to the sump. Avoid sharp 90 bends. I use flexible PVC for my 90’s, it’s super easy to work with and gives you a little “slop” when lining up the drain to the sump. Position the sump for easy maintenance; you want to be able to get to stuff easy like filter socks. Nothing sucks more than breaking your back every time you have to clean a filter sock when you would of only broke your back one time setting the drain lines up to make maintenance easy!
The Pump: Again go with plumbing sizes the same as the return bulkhead fittings. If this is 3/4 then use 3/4 plumbing through out your system, no reason to get fancy. If possible use a Y type fitting from your pump to your bulkheads (Ace Hardware has these fittings). I like to use vinyl tubing with barb fittings for all of my pressure plumbing, it’s easy to run and easy to get leak free. Length of tubing after the Y fitting is not critical. The goal is to push as much water back into the tank as possible. If you already have the pump you’re done. If you haven’t purchased the pump go with two smaller pumps for redundancy. The pump will eventually fail, having two, at least you will still be up and running until you notice the reduced flow. In fact I would buy three of the exact same kind of pumps, two running and one for back up.

Once set up and running test your system by shutting off the pumps and watch the water drain back into your sump. If it’s getting ready to overflow start the pump and reposition the return “loc line” a little higher near the water surface and turn your pump off again. May need to drain some water out of your sump a bit too. Once you get the water level set with the pumps off and the sump is not over flowing mark that water level- pump off. Then turn the pump back on and mark that water level- pump on. Now you’re all set for water changes. You will never over fill your system and have a flood when power goes out.
Good luck!

 

[elting44]

Thanks for the advice, anyone else want to drop their two cents in, the more advice I get the better.

 

[elting44]

I agree with Fox3 on the barb fittings restricting flow. They are not recommended for drain lines. Drains are low pressure so leaks are minimal if ever.
You have a good set up to work with; I will give my .02 as if this was my tank to set up. The following will maximize water flow through your system, IMO:
The Drain: Maximizing the drain flow is the most important part of a sump system like yours. Get rid of the ball valves, no need for them on your system. Make your drain plumbing size the same as the drain bulkhead size all the way to your sump. So if you have 1” drain bulkheads then go with 1” PVC all the way to the sump. Avoid sharp 90 bends. I use flexible PVC for my 90’s, it’s super easy to work with and gives you a little “slop” when lining up the drain to the sump. Position the sump for easy maintenance; you want to be able to get to stuff easy like filter socks. Nothing sucks more than breaking your back every time you have to clean a filter sock when you would of only broke your back one time setting the drain lines up to make maintenance easy!
The Pump: Again go with plumbing sizes the same as the return bulkhead fittings. If this is 3/4 then use 3/4 plumbing through out your system, no reason to get fancy. If possible use a Y type fitting from your pump to your bulkheads (Ace Hardware has these fittings). I like to use vinyl tubing with barb fittings for all of my pressure plumbing, it’s easy to run and easy to get leak free. Length of tubing after the Y fitting is not critical. The goal is to push as much water back into the tank as possible. If you already have the pump you’re done. If you haven’t purchased the pump go with two smaller pumps for redundancy. The pump will eventually fail, having two, at least you will still be up and running until you notice the reduced flow. In fact I would buy three of the exact same kind of pumps, two running and one for back up.

Once set up and running test your system by shutting off the pumps and watch the water drain back into your sump. If it’s getting ready to overflow start the pump and reposition the return “loc line” a little higher near the water surface and turn your pump off again. May need to drain some water out of your sump a bit too. Once you get the water level set with the pumps off and the sump is not over flowing mark that water level- pump off. Then turn the pump back on and mark that water level- pump on. Now you’re all set for water changes. You will never over fill your system and have a flood when power goes out.
Good luck!

I dont quite understand the red part. So basically, on my drains. I want it to go from Bulkhead to a short section 1" PVC and then vinyl all the way to a 90 degree sweep into a short section of PVC that the filtersock is attached to? Also, I can't seem to find 1" 90 Sweeps, only 1 1/2".

As far as the return is concern, how far up off the pump do I want the Y or does it matter?

 

[fox3]

If I were plumbing this I would use a short piece of clear 1-1/4" vinly right off the bulkhead barb to a barb fitting that goes directly into a sweep. This clear vinyl will leave a 1" sight window for when you are tweaking while silencing the system. It will fit perfectly over the bulkhead barb. When you are tweaking later you will notice bubbles thru this sight window and can get a feel for where you need to go. A gate valve would be ideal to use but I used PVC B-valve.

I used a 1-1/2" sweep as it was easy to locate locally and used one threaded slip ffitting for the barb and the other reduced to 1-1/4". From here direct the 1-1/4" PVC towards the sump and this is where you locate the ball valve that will balance the system for flow and silence. Have this piece out of level a bit dropping towards the sump. You can use an elbow at the end to dump into the sock.

Repeat for the other drain.

For the pump come off with a length of flexible tubing to quiet the pump vibrations. Hopefully you can transition from the pump to 1" or up to 1-1/2" quickly. Take this tubing and tee with the same diameter as the tubing and _then_ reduce to 3/4" flexible to your return bulkheads.

I did this on a 210 with two 1" megaflows and get 1800gph thru them.

You can use flexible 1" all the way if you wants, let us know how that works for ya.

 

[elting44]

Okay here is MKII

Is this better than the first?

Changed include Vinyl on all the bulkheads, 1 1/4" Vinyl coming off the bulkheads going into 1 1/2" 90 Sweep elbows and 1 1/4" PVC draining into the sump

The return pump will have 3/4" Vinyl tubing up to a a barbed fitting to a 3/4" WYE that has two barbed fittings that connect 3/4" vinyl into the return bulkheads.

It take a little from both egon and fox3

 

[fox3]

That should work out nicely.

Thing with drains is the closer to full capacity the quieter they are. Unless you hit it perfect the pump will either pump more than you require, a good thing using a tee to divert excess back to the sump, or it will be under sized, thats all she wrote and you run what you brung.

Using a valve to restrict flow on the drain is like imatating full capacity and you can use this technique to tweak for silence. Consider using a gate or ball valve in the horizontal run on your drains.

Alweays leave room for error and let the drain flow more than the supply to the DT. Balance the system then back off ie open the BValve some, for piece of mind.