I see everyone still using siquia and red point etc. To my knowledge, these have all been determined to be nigrofaciatus. Has this been updated yet again? I haven’t been around lately and I trying to get up to speed.
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Amatitlania Questions
- Thread starter 8DiagramPoleFighter
- Start date
Red point counts as a common name, hence its persisted use, but siquia is a junior synonym, and can be used interchangeably. As far as science is concerned they are all nigrofasciata, but "siquia" can be still used in the hobby to help people identify what a fish is/used to be. Same way we still use the name synspila to distinguish the vieja population from belize even though they were found to be melanura.
I myself finally found and read the Bagley paper that synonymized the amatitlania species, and was finally able to confirm (for myself) that the rio los almendros population (honduran red points) are indeed nigrofasciata. They are in the same lineage as the monga (and subsequently claro) populations. I guess those people calling the mongas "honduran red points" were sort of right after all. Technically "siquia" would be all the nicaraguan populations, however.
I myself finally found and read the Bagley paper that synonymized the amatitlania species, and was finally able to confirm (for myself) that the rio los almendros population (honduran red points) are indeed nigrofasciata. They are in the same lineage as the monga (and subsequently claro) populations. I guess those people calling the mongas "honduran red points" were sort of right after all. Technically "siquia" would be all the nicaraguan populations, however.
I think of these collection names as location point variations, in much the same way as the various forms of Herichthys carpintus available these days.
A few have actually been gone species status, such as H, tamosopensu, but most just supply info as to what lagoon or river they were caught in.
That info can help in telling us how to keep them certain variants.
I kept H. carpintus "lago Chairel", that the lake is near the sea, so is seasonally inundated with sea water, and becomes quite brackish, and also that winter water temps can get quite cool, so I ran their tanks without heaters, and allowed temps to drop into the 60'F.
This info might help in keeping this variant from more inland variants like "escondido, or Ventojillo" where temp variations may be less volatile, or where a certain variant ha adapted to a slightly different nutrition regime.. Some carpintus variants end up with algae as a primary nutrition source, some become primarily snail eaters.
I also kept Herichthys tamasopoensis.
Although it has now been given species status, when I had it is was still considered a carpintus variant.
This is a riverine inland species, and current seemed to help with health, and aggression, in an environment without current they tended to be less tolerant of each other.
Another factor is that when the seller actually is conscious and persnickety enough to know that the cichlid actually is a legitimate species, coming from a certain geographical area, you might have a better sense that it "may" not be an aquarium strain mutt, with scrambled frankenfish genes.
When someone portrays a carpintus. as a green texas, you may be suspicious that no provinance is known and hybrid aquarium stain (combination H cyanoguttatus/carpintus hybrid is a possibility.
This is the same with many other species of cichlids.
The genus Paratilapia has about half dozen different species, yet it is often sold simply as a starry night.
Unless the aquarist is paying attention, or uses scientific names (possibly with locations) disappointment may ensue.
Yet a species Andapa (right) is quite different than an east coast " small spot" (left)
A few have actually been gone species status, such as H, tamosopensu, but most just supply info as to what lagoon or river they were caught in.
That info can help in telling us how to keep them certain variants.
I kept H. carpintus "lago Chairel", that the lake is near the sea, so is seasonally inundated with sea water, and becomes quite brackish, and also that winter water temps can get quite cool, so I ran their tanks without heaters, and allowed temps to drop into the 60'F.
This info might help in keeping this variant from more inland variants like "escondido, or Ventojillo" where temp variations may be less volatile, or where a certain variant ha adapted to a slightly different nutrition regime.. Some carpintus variants end up with algae as a primary nutrition source, some become primarily snail eaters.
I also kept Herichthys tamasopoensis.
Although it has now been given species status, when I had it is was still considered a carpintus variant.
This is a riverine inland species, and current seemed to help with health, and aggression, in an environment without current they tended to be less tolerant of each other.
Another factor is that when the seller actually is conscious and persnickety enough to know that the cichlid actually is a legitimate species, coming from a certain geographical area, you might have a better sense that it "may" not be an aquarium strain mutt, with scrambled frankenfish genes.
When someone portrays a carpintus. as a green texas, you may be suspicious that no provinance is known and hybrid aquarium stain (combination H cyanoguttatus/carpintus hybrid is a possibility.
This is the same with many other species of cichlids.
The genus Paratilapia has about half dozen different species, yet it is often sold simply as a starry night.
Unless the aquarist is paying attention, or uses scientific names (possibly with locations) disappointment may ensue.
Yet a species Andapa (right) is quite different than an east coast " small spot" (left)
It is sort of a different case with convicts, as originally, kanna referred to the "convicts" from the sixaola into Boca del toro in Panama, siquia referred to the convicts in guanacaste, nicaragua, and northern Honduras, while nigrofasciata referred to the convicts in Guatemala, southern Honduras, and eastern Costa Rica. And then of course coatepeque from El Salvador. Kinda all over the place, and the genetics proved that they were in fact not necessarily close to eachother in spite of their names, but were all close enough to be synonymized with eachother.
Today, the eastern Costa Rican "convicts" are now kanna as well as the sixaola/Boca del toro convicts, like they were before, and as you know, everything else is nigrofasciata, though there are about four main lineages of nigrofasciata across it's range. As I said before, "siquia" should technically only refer to the nicaraguan populations, but sellers still use it for the other populations that used to be considered siquia for the ease of conveying the fact that these aren't your typical convicts.
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