Aquaponics with rays?

[packer43064]

Aquaponics is raising fish and plants at the same. The plants use up the excess nitrates after the cycling process from the fish and the fish provide the decaying feces and worms in the growing bed to give nutrients to the plants.

Typically people grow actual plants to eat (tomatoes, cucumbers. Etc.), but with using a conditioner such as Prime I'm not sure I would take that risk.

I've been planning a good 8 foot x 8 foot x 3 foot high plywood pond lined with EPDM liner for breeding rays. At least those dimensions.

The aquaponics people rarely change their water. Basically it is a self sustained system. That's how they do it at least, whether it is right or not it typically works.

So let's say I use Potho's as the plants. I'm sure you all have seen the threads about using this plant. It really works wonders.

The plants would be in their own setup which basically lifts the water up to the plant station then gravity will flow the water back in. With enough plants I think it could take a good hit on nitrates.

The questions though are:
1. Let's say I can keep it under 20ppm of nitrates every week. We know that fish produce hormones usually stunting other fish. How long would you go without a WC? At what point in time would you all do a change and why?

2. I.could be wrong, but I believe potho's are poisonous to dogs. Obviously were talking about rays....any chance it could harm them somehow? Again the potho's won't be in the actual tank.

Also there will be other means of filtrations too. 2 blue drums filled with scrubbies over the pond. So with all of that it should put a dent in nitrates. Just not sure how long to go between WC's if say the nitrates were under 20ppm every week.

Sent from my SGH-T839 using MonsterAquariaNetwork App

 

[Chub_by]

1. Every 2 weeks is what I do in overfiltered tanks that don't get many nitrates.

2. The rays won't eat the leaves so don't worry. Lots of people use pothos even with herbivorous fish.

 

[KNH]

You'll just have to test the water to see when a wc is needed. Many ray keepers use plants but I'm not aware of anyone that solely relies on them. Rays produce a large amount of waste so water changes will most likely be needed. Pothos are poisonous but I don't think they will be an issue for you. I've used them in a pup tank in the past without any problems.

 

[JK47]

A heavy ray feeding would by far outdo the bioload that a normally stocked tanks would produce. Not to say it is impossible but the consistency you would normally find in most aquaponic sytems would not be there for rays and would need be supplemented with filtration (plants helping filtration not the filtration helping the plants). Plants will take up ammonia prior to consuming nitrates. In most cases the plants are competing with a bacterial colony and such high swings in bioload is not only not good for the rays but I would think would make it hard to achieve consistency in the plant filtration. The reason most people are suing flowering of plants that produce fruits is because the energy it takes to produce that requires additional fuel for the plants i.e. - better filtration capabilities.

That said I love the topic and have every intention of trying hybrid approaches to achieve something similar.

 

[packer43064]

A heavy ray feeding would by far outdo the bioload that a normally stocked tanks would produce. Not to say it is impossible but the consistency you would normally find in most aquaponic sytems would not be there for rays and would need be supplemented with filtration (plants helping filtration not the filtration helping the plants). Plants will take up ammonia prior to consuming nitrates. In most cases the plants are competing with a bacterial colony and such high swings in bioload is not only not good for the rays but I would think would make it hard to achieve consistency in the plant filtration. The reason most people are suing flowering of plants that produce fruits is because the energy it takes to produce that requires additional fuel for the plants i.e. - better filtration capabilities.

That said I love the topic and have every intention of trying hybrid approaches to achieve something similar.

Just to clarify. You're saying that the rays will produce too much waste and you still might have 60ppm of nitrate in a week...beter than 120 perhaps, but obviously not great?


Would it even be a worthwhile adventure to try it? I mean if it will help and knock out a certain amount of nitrates along with the 2 blue drums ill give it a shot. It wouldn't be much more to make a small setup for the plants.

Also what is an ideal nitrates on a weekly basis for the rays? I typically don't go over 40ppm for your typical fish.

Sent from my SGH-T839 using MonsterAquariaNetwork App

 

[packer43064]

You'll just have to test the water to see when a wc is needed. Many ray keepers use plants but I'm not aware of anyone that solely relies on them. Rays produce a large amount of waste so water changes will most likely be needed. Pothos are poisonous but I don't think they will be an issue for you. I've used them in a pup tank in the past without any problems.

I wouldn't be soley relying on them just to clarify.

There will still be 2 of those blue drums filled with pot scrubbies or something similiar. They will have a pump pumping water to them and gravity will do the rest. The plants would just be extra.

Sent from my SGH-T839 using MonsterAquariaNetwork App

 

[JK47]

I wouldn't be soley relying on them just to clarify.

There will still be 2 of those blue drums filled with pot scrubbies or something similiar. They will have a pump pumping water to them and gravity will do the rest. The plants would just be extra.

Sent from my SGH-T839 using MonsterAquariaNetwork App

Honestly with my rays if they hit 40ppm nitrate something is wrong and they are acting like it too. That is why so many ray keepers run drip systems because keeping nitrate below 20ppm in ray tanks and staying married or having a life requires it.

I said what I said about the plants because it's not that is impossible but you have an X factor you don't have to worry about as much with tropical fish. When you feed small fish heavy you get an ammonia spike but it isn't huge. The plants will only consume so much at a time so it takes a while but that goes away. Rays will produce a significantly larger amount of ammonia after a feeding so the heavy filtration accommodates for that bioload, plants on any home or reasonable scale would not be enough or take so long to consume the ammonia that the rays suffer or worse.

In the next year I will have constructed something similar. Yes worth it but try and think like this:

>> Filter it like you like you have no plants.
>> Plant it like you have no filter.
>> Add a drip system so there is no build up of hormones.
>> Test the water like you have no drip.

The resulting system will exceed what others are doing. The rays will force the fauna growth and Monsanto look like an amateur...

 

[packer43064]

Honestly with my rays if they hit 40ppm nitrate something is wrong and they are acting like it too. That is why so many ray keepers run drip systems because keeping nitrate below 20ppm in ray tanks and staying married or having a life requires it.

I said what I said about the plants because it's not that is impossible but you have an X factor you don't have to worry about as much with tropical fish. When you feed small fish heavy you get an ammonia spike but it isn't huge. The plants will only consume so much at a time so it takes a while but that goes away. Rays will produce a significantly larger amount of ammonia after a feeding so the heavy filtration accommodates for that bioload, plants on any home or reasonable scale would not be enough or take so long to consume the ammonia that the rays suffer or worse.

In the next year I will have constructed something similar. Yes worth it but try and think like this:

>> Filter it like you like you have no plants.
>> Plant it like you have no filter.
>> Add a drip system so there is no build up of hormones.
>> Test the water like you have no drip.

The resulting system will exceed what others are doing. The rays will force the fauna growth and Monsanto look like an amateur...

Thanks for the extra post. That makes alot of sense now.

Sent from my SGH-T839 using MonsterAquariaNetwork App

 

[DIDYSIS]

Well said. Ditto. The rest of your post was just as brilliant but this is my favorite part.

Honestly with my rays if they hit 40ppm nitrate something is wrong and they are acting like it too. That is why so many ray keepers run drip systems because keeping nitrate below 20ppm in ray tanks and staying married or having a life requires it.

Sent from Note 2 mini computer

 

[DIDYSIS]

Personally for my well stocked setup the plants I am running do nothing as far as I can tell. The drip system does it all. Without the drip I was having to do massive water changes and the water still was 80 nitrates all the time. Now with the drip its 20ppm I do change out 175 gallons a day but I am also heating the tank with that water so its really allot cheaper to run. And I love the water being so good.

Sent from Note 2 mini computer