Freshwater NOOB question.

[boldtogether]

Ok, here it goes...
I have been doin freshwater for years. Love it. I have a 210 with beautiful fish and it is thriving. Thanks to good husbandry.
I recently found a 72g tall at the thrift store...yes, the thrift store and it has a built in overflow and drilled bottom with the return plumbed in the overflow. Anyway, tank is awesome and it obviously was a saltwater tank at one time....so....now I want to try saltwater. Just fish, no coral or special lighting requirements. Just some sand, rocks(not live), plastic plants(nice ones) and thats it. And of course fish.
My question is simply this...do I have to use the salt mixes sold for serious $$ or can I use rock salt? Yes I am a cheap skeet and yes I want to save money. I do 75% water changes weekly on my fresh and if I am going to keep that kind of regimin with a salt tank than this is going to be too cost prohibitive and I know that will get old quick. Any suggestions? Any kind of fish suggestions?
Help me out please!!
'

 

[Wiggles92]

You need to use the marine salt mix, but you will not need to do 75% water changes every week if your filtration is adequate; water changes of that volume are going to be detrimental to the health of your saltwater aquarium anyway as they disrupt the balance of the system.

There's really no sense in not using live rock as it will make your life much easier when it comes to keeping the system in balance; live rock has an enormous capacity for beneficial bacteria and is the ideal biological media for saltwater aquariums. Other biological media, such as bio-balls and scrubbies, are inferior to live rock when it comes to a saltwater aquarium. I suggest that you make use of a sump considering that the aquarium is drilled for a sump; sumps are the preferred filtration method for saltwater aquariums and are superior to HOB filters (which are superior to canister filters in this case).

In the end, trying to save money now on this build is going to cost you more in the long run as you're not going to get satisfactory results.

 

[Purevil21]

Glad that your interested in taking the sw plunge. Sounds like your heading the right direction, but ditch the fake plants. A lot of things between sw and fw are similar, but a lot of things are different too. Huge water changes in sw can prove detrimental. I wouldn't advise buying live rock though. The hobby is changing now, just as fish in cycling is becoming a thing of the past, so is live rock. Dry rock is pest free, cheaper, has no ill effects on the ocean, and is much cheaper than live rock. Best of all, it becomes live just by going through the cycle with your tank. Mr. Saltwatertank and many other names within the hobby now opt for dry rock. www.reefrocks.net has rock and sand for cheap. A sump/refuge is the way to go for filtration. Your also going to want a good protein skimmer. Post questions as they come to you.

Sent from my PC36100 using MonsterAquariaNetwork App

 

[boldtogether]

I do appreciate the response to my post! I know the mineral content in sea water is replicated in commercial salt mixes but I just don't see the need if all I have is fish. What exactly is the advantage to salt mixes vs rock salt without any other ingredients? Isn't solar salt a more pure form of salt than synthesized salt? I know about the benefits to corals but do the fish need minerals only present in sea water? I haven't been able to get anyone at LFS to tell me exactly why I need the salt mix other than the coral argument. What exactly will happen? I'm not convinced it is so cut and dry. I am glad to hear there is conservation in mind with regards to live rock, dry rock is the way way I want to go.

Anyway, I have the tank set up with the sump and it it full with freshwater just circulating. No leaks and no problems. I am itching to get this setup rolling! I cant stand an empty bare tank!

 

[Wiggles92]

I do appreciate the response to my post! I know the mineral content in sea water is replicated in commercial salt mixes but I just don't see the need if all I have is fish. What exactly is the advantage to salt mixes vs rock salt without any other ingredients? Isn't solar salt a more pure form of salt than synthesized salt? I know about the benefits to corals but do the fish need minerals only present in sea water? I haven't been able to get anyone at LFS to tell me exactly why I need the salt mix other than the coral argument. What exactly will happen? I'm not convinced it is so cut and dry. I am glad to hear there is conservation in mind with regards to live rock, dry rock is the way way I want to go.

Anyway, I have the tank set up with the sump and it it full with freshwater just circulating. No leaks and no problems. I am itching to get this setup rolling! I cant stand an empty bare tank!

This is why you should use a commercial salt mix:

Before marine mixes, we had to use plain salt. The results were washed out colors, high mortality rates, and infrequent spawnings. Additionally, before marine mixes there were nearly zero hobbyists able to keep nudibranchs, corals, polyps, anemones, sea fans, crinoids, etc. alive for more than the time it took those organisms to starve to death. These organisms were only able to be viewed at public aquaria that piped a continual influx of sea water into their exhibits.

When I experienced large or frequent losses. I gave up on regular salt and pumped water off the jetties near my house into barrels in the back of my truck. The water was allowed to settle out (to reduce sand) and filtered before using it in my tanks.

In my opinion, a saltwater aquarium isn't something that you want to try to cut corners on because it will only come back to haunt you later on down the line; you're better off to just stick to the basic recommendations and go from there. I'm saying this from experience by the way; it's way easier to get good results with very little maintenance if you start out correctly rather than try to do it on the cheap and end up with a pretty terrible looking aquarium as I did at first.

 

[boldtogether]

Ok, I get it. So I use a mix. Now what? 10%, 20%? What is the right amount in regards to water changes? I am a strict budget kind of person and need to at least have an idea of what the cost will be. I plan on mixing the water in a 60 gallon tank I have and also pre-filter and mature the water before hand, maybe even heat it. How do salt water setups that claim once a month water changes do it? I will run a UV sterilizer, protein skimmer and a fluidized bio and maybe an ozonator. Should I have a refugium? Those always appealed to me because of the natural way they filter the water but I really don't want the expense of specialized lighting that has to be on all the time. Suddenly, I'm into saltwater for way more than I had hoped.
Anyone who says saltwater is just as easy as freshwater isn't telling all.

 

[Wiggles92]

Ok, I get it. So I use a mix. Now what? 10%, 20%? What is the right amount in regards to water changes? I am a strict budget kind of person and need to at least have an idea of what the cost will be. I plan on mixing the water in a 60 gallon tank I have and also pre-filter and mature the water before hand, maybe even heat it. How do salt water setups that claim once a month water changes do it? I will run a UV sterilizer, protein skimmer and a fluidized bio and maybe an ozonator. Should I have a refugium? Those always appealed to me because of the natural way they filter the water but I really don't want the expense of specialized lighting that has to be on all the time. Suddenly, I'm into saltwater for way more than I had hoped.
Anyone who says saltwater is just as easy as freshwater isn't telling all.

You will determine your ideal water change schedule through testing the water. Based on the filtration that you listed, I'd say that you shouldn't have to do anything beyond 10% biweekly if you stock the aquarium at a normal level, but you may find that you can get away with less water changes.

Premixing the saltwater is recommended as is preheating and aerating; the goal is to have the water change saltwater be same temperature and salinity level of the aquarium saltwater. Prefiltering is going to be unnecessary if you invest in an RO/DI unit in order to make nearly pure freshwater for mixing the saltwater.

A refugium is a great idea, but it doesn't require specialized lighting; there are a few articles out there that indicate that one can run a successful refugium with a cheap fluorescent bulb (maybe $5, if that) from a home improvement store. I use a daylight spectrum compact fluorescent bulb on mine, and it's working very well as the chaeto algae has been doubling in size pretty quickly.

Saltwater is just as easy as freshwater, but it has a higher start-up cost; it can actually be even easier than freshwater if done right.

 

[KellyFrancis]

^^ You said that testing the water will tell you when to do water changes. What chemical or whatever am I looking for to indicate that a change is necessary? I've had my 55 gal for three weeks now and it doesn't seem to need a water change...but I don't quite know what I'm looking for. Sbuse told me that when I start seeing all sorts of poop everywhere, change the water. Well, I don't see any poop. Does it get pushed and hide under the LR? And how do I know the poop from the green carpet algae stuff that's all over the LR? (I need a good algae eater to get rid of that, any suggestions?) Oh, and (one more and I'm done, honest) do I sift through the sand with the fat end of the hose thing and move the LR around when I'm doing the water change? Not exactly sure on the procedure there either....

 

[Wiggles92]

^^ You said that testing the water will tell you when to do water changes. What chemical or whatever am I looking for to indicate that a change is necessary? I've had my 55 gal for three weeks now and it doesn't seem to need a water change...but I don't quite know what I'm looking for. Sbuse told me that when I start seeing all sorts of poop everywhere, change the water. Well, I don't see any poop. Does it get pushed and hide under the LR? And how do I know the poop from the green carpet algae stuff that's all over the LR? (I need a good algae eater to get rid of that, any suggestions?) Oh, and (one more and I'm done, honest) do I sift through the sand with the fat end of the hose thing and move the LR around when I'm doing the water change? Not exactly sure on the procedure there either....

You need to be testing for at least nitrates in order to determine your ideal water change schedule; decide on a maximum acceptable nitrate level and do water changes accordingly. In your case, you should also test for phosphates in order to see if those are why the nuisance algae isn't going away. A good cleaner crew consisting of dwarf blue leg hermit crabs and snails will go a long way for keeping algae and detritus to a minimum.

 

[KellyFrancis]

You need to be testing for at least nitrates in order to determine your ideal water change schedule; decide on a maximum acceptable nitrate level and do water changes accordingly. In your case, you should also test for phosphates in order to see if those are why the nuisance algae isn't going away. A good cleaner crew consisting of dwarf blue leg hermit crabs and snails will go a long way for keeping algae and detritus to a minimum.

I got the tank from Scott and he was just letting the algae go wild for filtration. I believe its the remains of the purple algae stuff, but its green and black, not purple. lol. I know he had it growing. I'm not sure whether I want to promote it or not but I suppose my critters need something to eat.

So when the Nitrate's high, change the water? I can do that...There's only three fish, a snail, and a shrimp in there right now and I did start with 40 gals of distilled water so I can imagine that it will be awhile for regular water changes to set in...