Gathering fader info, plz help!

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izzy_here

Fire Eel
MFK Member
May 13, 2010
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michigan
As the title suggests I'm trying to gather info on the fader gene. What I'm asking for is anecdotal stories (with pics if possible) of fader to non-fader spawns.
info needed: what were the parents? what was the approximate percentage of fader fry?
Please remember, fader to NON fader spawns only. That means one parent should have absolutely NO fader blood in its ancestory. For instance Midas X Convict, or JD X bp, or convict X bp...you get the picture.
 
Thanks for the link Chris but that really doesn't help. Although one link from that thread does say its a dominant gene and that is helpful...

It still doesn't answer my questions completely, the above mentioned link claims the fader gene to be dominant and that is helpful. However, theres no info on how the gene is passed down in hybrid spawns...what if the hybrid fader in question is very far removed from the Amphilophus family? What if that fader is bred to a non fading, non amphilophus? If for instance I bred a normal jack dempsey to a (fader) con X parrot will 50% of the fry be faders? Does the fading depend on the amount of amp blood? will you still get faders if the % of amp blood is 25% or less? Is it in the instance of hybrids still a dom gene or is it co-dom?
 
Izzy - I have what I purchased as a "Red Devil" x "Red Terror" fish. Someone down in Indianapolis had a pair of fish the produced some fry that they sold to a pet store where I bought one of these fish. Based on what I can piece together, I believe the one parent was Midas/Red Devil/Midevil and the other parent was a Uro or Mayan. When I purchased the fish at 2" it had the typical look of a Mayan - vertical bars and the distinct tall tail spot. The fish grew rapidly and is currently around 6" and is a female and has layed eggs several times. This fish faded at around 4" and looks much like a Midevil type fish. I did not see the parents, I thought I saw a post somewhere on one of the forums by the person who bred them and the pictures of the parents looked like Midevil & Mayan.

So for the one fish I have, if it is what I believe it to be, then it would suggest the fading can be dominant from the Midevil when out crossed to at least some other species.

I have a Mayan male that this fish has bred with a few times (several months ago), but it is in my 400 gallon tank with a bunch of other fish and I have not raised any fry from them.

The information I was told when I asked about what % of a fader cross would likely fade and I as told to expect ~10%. To me this doesn't makes sense from a genetics perspective if fading is dominant.

My theory is that fading may be dominant when breeding citrinellus or labiatus, but when hybridize to other species, it can do strange things to the inheritance and the genetics are no longer simple.

Take the Red Texas crossed for example - if fading were dominant, then 100% of those fish should fade, but from what I understand, only a percentage fade. So there is more to this than simple/single trait inheritance.
 
I too have read that it may depend on the % of citrinellus or labiatus blood. That the fader gene does not affect some species at all. But there's very little about which species are affected (or not affected) by the gene. I have done some reading in regard to RTs, so I do understand what you're saying, and I do agree that hybridizing does muddy what is essentially a simple dom gene. Just trying to gain some understanding of the "mud" :)
 
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