Grammodes or Istlanum?

[Cichlidfever]

Which one of the two are the most aggressive? I have had Grammodes but never Istlanum. Why would anyone want one verses the other? Can both live together in the same tank? Do you think I could raise Grammodes, Istlanum, and neet in a 360 gallon tank?

What would be reasonable living with Grammodes or Istlanum?

 

[Ihsnshaik]

Depending on size and temperament as each fish can act a different way. I can see it working I've kept different amph species together

 

[MonitorSpiderCichlid]

Grammodes is more aggressive from my experience.. But it varies with personality. Grammodes are obvious predators, large head and mouth... Thin body.

Istlanum would be a better personable fish IMO but it's not a first choice if we have other cichlids in line.

However, a large male Grammodes is much more breath taking than a istlanum. But they grow slow and take a long time to get to that point.

It all depends what you want. A 360g is more than enough for the three lol. You'll likely never experience any serious aggression issues. Add a Cuban and salvini to the mix, even a convict pair (Grammodes are piscivores in the wild from what I know) so no worries as far as convict fry surviving.

 

[MonitorSpiderCichlid]

The likelier outcome would be, istlanum and everyone else outgrowing the Grammodes.. And if you keep the community for years.. The Grammodes will catch up and wreak havoc. But in a 360g like I said should be no issue.

 

[the animal guy]

Grammodes are really mean and stubborn. Sibblings will even fight inside the bag from store to home if together

 

[duanes]

When you look at these "aggressive" cichlids in their natural habitat, you often find they are usually the only ones of their type. I don't think this is coincidence. Evolution has allowed them to vanquish all others, and they end up the "fittest", and the apex cichlid.
You may want to buck that evolutionary system, and your large tank might allow for somewhat of a truce. May be a long time, maybe not.
I usually find (especially with community situations of Central Americans) trying to mimic natural habitat non competitors, rather than combining competitors a more workable situation.

 

[PYRU]

Here's an grammodes article
http://www.cichlidae.com/article.php?id=428

Here's an article on istlanum.
http://www.cichlidae.com/article.php?id=5


Duanes beat me to it.

They're both equally aggressive from my experience (at a very small size as well). Unless you compartmentalize them you have a very high likely hood of ending up with one dominant grammodes or istlanum. They're both interesting in different ways.

Grammodes were always hiding in their caves unless trying to murder someone. I used a bunch of driftwood to breakup lines of sight and to just help them feel secure. Pretty hardy and are look great. Ultimately I lost patience every time and sold them. I bought one at 6", but unless feeding time it hid as well.

Istlanum are some of my favorite fish. Always out looking for trouble. Interesting and entertaining to watch. They bloat easy from stress or bad water quality when young which is another reason to keep seperate. Growth rate is decent. Really nice coloration. I didnt listen to duanes advice about compartmentalizing with my last batch and they went from 8 to like 3 in a few days. Ultimately my last male slipped past the dividers and killed the 2 females. Ive only had the red variety with my largest topping out around 10"

 

[Freshwaterpredators]

I've kept both and although grammodes are tough, they don't hold a candle to istlanums. Istlanums have a mouthful of teeth that a grammode can't handle. The istlanum is also much more sure of themselves and I would put money on istlanum making quick work of any grammode. And beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I also think that istlanum are much nicer looking than the grammodes at any size.

My wc istlanum I used to have hit 13" for the record.. Straight beast mode

 

[PYRU]

QUOTE="Freshwaterpredators, post: 7551266, member: 54232"]I've kept both and although grammodes are tough, they don't hold a candle to istlanums. Istlanums have a mouthful of teeth that a grammode can't handle. The istlanum is also much more sure of themselves and I would put money on istlanum making quick work of any grammode. And beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I also think that istlanum are much nicer looking than the grammodes at any size.

My wc istlanum I used to have hit 13" for the record.. Straight beast mode[/QUOTE]

Not to derail the thread, but I would love to see a pic/vid of a 13" istlanum.

 

[duanes]

One more commentary from me, and I'll get off my soapbox.
When we think of a 300+ gal tank, in aquarium terms, it seems large.
But when comparing it to the river system istlantum dominates, and has pushed every other similarly competitive cichlid out of, that system is millions if not billions of gallons. A 300 gal aquarium is a puddle in comparison
Being aggressive may not be the only factor for its dominance, because it is an omnivore may have made it most adaptable and helped push others out.
But this is a similar scenario to beanii, it is also the sole cichlid of its habitat, and in most cases, trying to house more species in a tank with it, is also a bloodbath.
And look at haitiensus, there are no other endemic cichlids on the entire island.
In most cases if it can't kill other species housed with it, it tends to bloat and die of stress.
These natural indicators should be taken into consideration whenever trying to house any cichlids together.