Help id large male vieja

[Tojo09]

Hey guys, i picked up this 11" beast from a lfs. They labeled him as blue fenestratus but im pretty sure thats wrong. The pics are of him now in breeding colors because he paired with a female gutta.

He has alot of blue in the face and body around the black line,bright. Red lining his tail and fins. When not breeding him blink line goes from tail into the eye. This all makes me think zonatum?

My camera washes out all the blue and brightens red.

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[Madness]

I was saying Fen before I even read what you bought it as.

 

[Vancouver_98683]

That's a pretty interesting looking vieja. Hopefully somebody very inept on CA species chimes in. The blotched patterns behind the head resembles a heterospila. If you hadn't of mentioned the on/off black line. That would be the guess there from me. Good luck on ID.

 

[Stratoquarius]

looks like an adult "pink" fenestratus

 

[Madness]

That's a pretty interesting looking vieja. Hopefully somebody very inept on CA species chimes in. The blotched patterns behind the head resembles a heterospila. If you hadn't of mentioned the on/off black line. That would be the guess there from me. Good luck on ID.

Looking at this picture, I would say that very few of the Vieja look like what we are all use to seeing. My Zo, Fen, Bifa, Syn, Hetero, Hart, Brehi, all look nothing like those pictures.

 

[Vancouver_98683]

Looking at this picture, I would say that very few of the Vieja look like what we are all use to seeing. My Zo, Fen, Bifa, Syn, Hetero, Hart, Brehi, all look nothing like those pictures.

I totally agree with you. The chart is just a quick guide as a simple reference for those not too familiar with Vieja / paratherap. I'm somewhat new to the CA species as well. In fact, your expertise corrected an ID on my melanurus when it was sold to me as Fenestratus. I never looked at that chart at the time to question it, lol. When I mentioned the second portion of the body resembled the heterospila, IMO. Didnt want to say in the beginning, but could this Vieja be a cross between species?

Good example of ID difficulities, is when I was at a Cali LFS a week ago. I saw a 9" hartwegi labeled as a "Vieja Cichlid".

 

[Madness]

I totally agree with you. The chart is just a quick guide as a simple reference for those not too familiar with Vieja / paratherap. I'm somewhat new to the CA species as well. In fact, your expertise corrected an ID on my melanurus when it was sold to me as Fenestratus. I never looked at that chart at the time to question it, lol. When I mentioned the second portion of the body resembled the heterospila, IMO. Didnt want to say in the beginning, but could this Vieja be a cross between species?

Good example of ID difficulities, is when I was at a Cali LFS a week ago. I saw a 9" hartwegi labeled as a "Vieja Cichlid".

LOL. Just came from one of our LFS that usually either labels wrong or doesnt label at all. They had a really beautiful 6" Fen, and it was labeled correctly. Some times they get it right.

 

[BellycrawlerJaws]

Good example of ID difficulities, is when I was at a Cali LFS a week ago. I saw a 9" hartwegi labeled as a "Vieja Cichlid".

Same at my LFS - they had a 7" BEAUTIFUL Loiselli labeled as "Dovii" - they subsequently asked me for the exact latin name when I came in the store and did a double take on the name.
pic for reference.

 

[Tojo09]

I dont think its a hybred. I knew the guy who traded it in and he bought as a fena. But i have 3 fenestratus and they look very different cause they are 3 different strains. So i do believe its a fena.

I was in a very very reputable lfs today and he pulled out a bunch of old cichlid books and i was disagreeing with half the labels/pics. Some of the pic were the same as the chart. Lol who would have guessed we dnt always get it right..

Anyways here a lil guy im sure is a hybred. Look at the color on him and this is just a pic from my phone.
And just for fun a few others

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[notho2000]

Perhaps your "unknown" male is a P.'hartwegi'. Here's my 12" male for comparison , along with my 10" female.

male

female

There are times when the black area on the sides is much more extensive.
Well maybe not - - - the eye color is certainly different