Last dead Armatus

[DB junkie]

Well last one is circling the drain right now. I have had 6 total. All dead now. I KNOW 2 were killed by rays. The other 4 have me starting to wonder and second guess as to the exact cause.

I still have my Rhaph. He has been in the same pond the Armatus have been. Something is killing these things. I think water conditions is out since the Rhaph is still fine. The ONLY thing I can think of that I do different than everyone else is diet. My Armatus are always on cleaned smelt by 6 inches and dead by 10-14. The 14 incher was a huge fan of both shrimp and smelt. The last batch ate strickly smelt. All dead before a foot. Rhaph prefers shrimp. No one else converts to dead food till they are closer to 10 or more. Is it possible I'm killing these things with cleaned smelt? Feed feeders and there's no trouble but you try to do the right thing and end up with a freezer full.

This is embarrasing as hell, I'm not gonna lie. But if you can learn from my mistakes then it's worth it.

Anyone know of someone well versed in fish biology that could perform an autopsy? I kept them all so that maybe someone can give a reason as to why they died. There has to be a college or something that could answer this question if provided with a few specimens. Hopefully we can all learn from one guys stupidity.

 

[benzjamin13]

Sorry to hear about your losses

 

[DB junkie]

I'm sorry too, that I can't properly care for a certain species of fish. But maybe someone out there can help me out and we can all learn from this.

I KNOW if I do ever decide to venture down this species again I will feed nothing but live.

 

[vamptrev]

sorry to hear...

was there any damage to them from the rays? but u prob couldnt tell because they could have been chewed on after they died...

sometimes i see my smaller rays tryin to pounce on my armatus...

maybe ur rays pinned them down just long enough to kill them....

 

[JimmyT22]

That sucka. Sorry.

 

[DB junkie]

Like I mentioned earlier..... I know I lost 2 to rays. The other 3 had NO damage to them. The last one was seperated from all the other rays except for 2 pups that are less than 6 inches across. Was seperated after I lost the one prior to the last one. The last 2 exhibited similar symptoms. Loss of appetite. Quickly following that complete refusal of food. A week later they start to have trouble keeping them selves upright. 3 days later death. It's almost like they develop some sort of swim bladder issues.

The temp in my pond did get as low as 76. Was typically 78-80.

My Armatus were NEVER kept with my big rays. Only Juvies that are 9 inches diameter MAX. My Rhaph is around a foot and is housed with the big rays (up to 16 in diameter) Never even a missing scale.

So you guys doubt it was anything diet related?

Any ideas of what I should do about seeking an answer as to cause of death? I need a reliable place that could do an autopsy to determine COD.

 

[Gr8KarmaSF]

Sorry DB, you might want to PM Zoodiver regarding an autopsy...

 

[BRYANT]

Sorry about your losses

 

[hybridtheoryd16]

Sorry to hear it. I would not think it was diet related only because there natural diet would most likely be fish in the wild and smelt is a fish right? And most anything (animals/humans/plants) that gets a poor nutrition shows that in there figure. Like a poorly fed dog from birth will be very thin and sometimes deformed and or small. And humans are the same way. And plants will be disfigured and discolored. So as long as the smelt did not have anything added to it that would harm a fish then i would say no. What about current? everyone says they need a large turnover rate and current with lots of dissolved oxygen. Could that be a problem. Like they were suffocated somewhat over time? I am just looking for a reason hear and i am not offering any 100% reasons for death at all.

 

[DB junkie]

DEFINETLEY NOT a current or O2 issue. They hung out in the corner where the sump returns almost 5K gallon per hour via 2 2inch drains going a foot down into the water. One has a 90 on it the other has a 45. There is also a 5 inch bubble disk with a large airpump dedicated to that disk. There is a disk on the other side of the pond as well with it's own pump. 2 more pumps run 2 18 in bubblebars located under the bio towers before making the 2 foot freefall down the sump returns and into the pond. They were divided off in this corner with these returns. Also 4 powerheads throughout in the pond to help circulate.

The smelt is cleaned and no head. Wondering if there is something missing from thier diet that is necassary in the proper development of this very rapidly growing fish. Smelt fed daily and skipped once or twice a week. Rhaph prefers shrimp. First Armatus I has ate shrimp and smelt about the same. It grew to almost 14 inches before being killed by tankmates.

Water changes were done almost once a day (would skip a day every now and then)at low percentages along with a vac of any solids (pond is barebottom) with large ones (50%) done on weekends. The other inhabitants are 4 Odoes, 1 Rhaph and 3 big rays on one side and the Armatus were divided off with 5 smaller rays. 2 6 inchers the other 3 7-8 inches.

The filter has a volume of well over 70 gallons of pot scrubbies and bio balls in a wet/dry.