New here, planning on a 48x48x48 plywood/glass

[Moike]

Greetings, I introduced myself here... http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152595

I'm getting ready to move (bleh) from my home of five years. And this means finally upgrading from the 125 I've had my Giant Gourami crammed into for quite some time into a tank he'll finally be more comfortable in.

Given my handy nature with fabrication and tools, I'd like to build my own tank instead of plunking down the cash for another used plexi tank. I have a local hookup for glass that I can leverage off of.

So this unit will go in a corner, three plywood sections, bottom, two vertical walls. Two glass sections, and a metal framework of angle iron with triangulation top, bottom, and on the back of the plywood sections.

Given that I'm handy with Valve's 'Hammer/SDK' toolkit, I mocked up in actual dimensions how this would go together in CAD. Forgive the firearms, this is a video game development toolkit.

The plywood sections would be pretty straightforward 4x4x4

The metal framework would be angle iron with flat cross bracing on the three ply sides and top. Lots of triangles, since well... triangles are the strongest. =D

Assembly would be the majority of the framework first, minus the 'top' and then dropping in the plywood 'box' section, and then sealed with PVC using the 'goop' method.

Glass would slide in next and sealed using the 'goop' method.

Then the top framework would be mounted, wet leather welding blankets would go over the glass and plywood, and the top framework would get carefully MIG'ed into location

The stand itself would be fairly simple. roughly 3ft in height, cinderblock/rebar with a 2x4 framework/ply top, dressed to look like stone, with room for the pump in the free space behind grating.

Complete it should look like this, simple, clean.

For scale, I did some basic modeling/rendering in a 'garage' type location with a human model for proportion.

I have some questions following this initial post, please do not quote this lengthy post if you respond. Thanks.

-Mike-

 

[Moike]

Now, some higher end technical questions.

When I had my 240 gallon tank, I used a commercial 55 gallon wet/dry and a Dayton external fluid pump on the return side on quick disconnects with 1/4 turn valves on either side of the pump. I can't remember it's GPH, but it's MTBF was high. I was considering just going with another industrial grade shallow well jet pump...

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200321690_200321690

And building another wet/dry system out of a used (55/75?) acrylic tank

My big problem is the glass. Most of the calculators I find say don't go above 36 inches, and well yeah, I can understand the physics behind why. But I'm sure there are several experts here that can tell me how thick and what kind of glass I should tell my "Guy that owns his own glass business" to get and cut for me that will be good up to 48 inches."

The framework will be taking the stress, and it will be flawless and square on the inside where the glass seats against it's surfaces. 1" 1/4" Angle iron is nice and strong... It won't buckle under the load

I'm sure lots of you are thinking -heavy- but I'm not concerned about the weight of the frame. I am choosing metal for strength and -ascetic- value, I really love working with metal. And it helps that I have a couple overhead electric winches at my disposal that can host 2000/4000 without breaking a sweat. So getting it off the ground and situated down to the millimeter won't be a problem.

Welding the top on may be a concern, keeping the heat off the glass while laying down a sufficient weld may be an issue. I may have to assemble the framework totally, and then assemble the ply in sections inside the framework, as well as the glass. Shouldn't be an issue as everything should go in as long as I tip it 45 degrees. I may have to go to Solidworks to figure that one out.

If any of the experts can point out any glaring errors or problems for me, or give me some tips or pointers, I'd greatly appreciate it.

Thanks,
-Mike-

 

[Buckdog]

Welding the top on may be a concern, keeping the heat off the glass while laying down a sufficient weld may be an issue. I may have to assemble the framework totally, and then assemble the ply in sections inside the framework, as well as the glass.


I like the overall idea. There are lots of guys here that can clear up the calculations for you. I calculate like this:

As far as the metal fabrication, I see where youre going. Dont weld anything with the glass in place. I would fab up the frame and weld tabs on top for the crosspiece. Match the crosspiece and tabs and match drill to desired tap size. Then drill the crosspiece to bolt clearance. Use stainless hardware. You may be better off using a grate pattern rather than an "X". You also have to make sure that your metal is coated well, especially at the welds and holes nearest to the water. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Buckdog]

I just thought of something else.
Most angle iron has a curve on the inside which will make it difficult for you to butt joint the glass as well as the ply. If you're using the "non curve" type then good.

I did a small scale mock-up on my tank first which helped me out a lot and saved me a lot of time and money.

 

[Arthur]

lol, did you build that with half life software, thought it was source sdk till I saw the half life girl.

 

[thrillbillie12]

nice use of garry's mod, that tank would be awesome when done.

 

[Moike]

lol, did you build that with half life software, thought it was source sdk till I saw the half life girl.

Yeah, I do lots of map building for HL2DM...

http://www.moike.net/dm_plastic_beta_5/

http://www.moike.net/dm_playground_deluxe/

So I'm very adept in Hammer, and since Hammer uses real world measurements it's really easy to bang something out in 'to scale' dimensions quickly and easily. I'd say it took me about an hour to whip out everything you see in Hammer.

If I needed to go heavy duty I'd fire up SolidWorks and use real CAD modeling software, but for what I'm dealing with here, it's not exactly rocket surgery, and Hammer is perfect for getting it done using the KISS method.

-Mike-

 

[Moike]

An example of what I see in hammer/SDK modeling up the tank.

KISS logic at it's best.

 

[Dr Joe]

Welcome

This will be a great addition to anywhere you put it .

Do not mount the glass to the frame, suspend it in a silicone gasket on all edges. This will alleviate differential expansion/contraction problems. Glass bowing and stress from this are the major concerns with this sort of height. I'd feel safe with 3/4", but your "glass guy" should be able to advise you too (or at least 'his' suppliers).

How are you going to filter it (drill bottom/top or overflows)?

Dr Joe

.

 

[Moike]

Welcome

This will be a great addition to anywhere you put it .

Do not mount the glass to the frame, suspend it in a silicone gasket on all edges. This will alleviate differential expansion/contraction problems. Glass bowing and stress from this are the major concerns with this sort of height. I'd feel safe with 3/4", but your "glass guy" should be able to advise you too (or at least 'his' suppliers).

How are you going to filter it (drill bottom/top or overflows)?

Dr Joe

.

Yeah, the glass guy will be the expert, I'll tell him what I'm doing... and let him advise me on what I should use. But I was hoping some of the DYI experts with real engineering degrees here could tell me what thickness I should be safe with going up to a 48 inch height (well, 42 to 44 inch water height)

For filtration I'm most likely going to sell/trade my 125 gallon tank for a 55 or 75 gallon tank and turn that into a wet/dry under the 48x48.

I figure I'll put two 1 inch bulkheads in the upper plywood corner eight inches from the top capped off with a simple plexi overflow box glued in place to the sheeting. Two one inch PVC drainpipes down to flexi one inch tubing to bulkheads the top of the wet/dry lid (belt/suspenders in case one pipe gets clogged and more flow) I'll then run water back in off the fluid pump from a Y connector in to either side of the tank at the ply/glass corners on simple PVC elbows up over the top of the tank to silicone tube returns. Drill vent holes in the top of the PVC tubes and gives you a bit of bubbles and prevents flooding from siphon should the pump fail/you lose power Once again, KISS methodology. It's similar to the setup I used on my 240 and it worked great.

Most likely I'll line the inside mating edges of the frame with glass grade silicone tape (again, back to the glass guy for the technical assistance there) to allow for thermal expansion, and I'll have the entire frame powdercoated to prevent rust (got a hookup).

-Mike-