Newbie poly keeper. Gill tassels?

[calichai]

Hello. I just got a ornate bicher a few weeks ago at around -"1in. He is now 3" and I've noticed when he eats these tassels pop out of his gills. Reminds me of mud puppy gills. Just wondering if this is normal. First poly.


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[lix.ma14]

It's perfectly normal for baby/juvi bichirs. Those are "external gill/lungs" that help these baby bichirs breath. They will disappear once they grow. Since bichirs are airbreathers, these external gills helps them get more oxygen. These gills can pop out if the bichirs live in bad water qualities and such where there is less oxygen available.

 

[Dr.B]

yes that is normal when they are young it help them catch air until their lungs are large enough and capable of functioning on their own

 

[Ian21777]

I read on here that the better the water quality the longer they keep the external gills, but also the opposite so who knows. Pretty sure they dont have lungs though.

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[Dr.B]

I read on here that the better the water quality the longer they keep the external gills, but also the opposite so who knows. Pretty sure they dont have lungs though.

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actually quite the opposite the better the water quality the better/faster their lungs develop and grow the faster they loose the external gills. Polypterus do have lungs thats why when you see them go up for air and when you see them let air out.

 

[Ian21777]

actually quite the opposite the better the water quality the better/faster their lungs develop and grow the faster they loose the external gills. Polypterus do have lungs thats why when you see them go up for air and when you see them let air out.

Im pretty sure they dont have lungs. Pretty sure they have modified swim bladders that are 'lung like' in function. Thats a bit different from having actual lungs. Im pretty sure they still have gills and breath as any fish does, but they can also gulp air into their swim bladders as required.

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[archers]

Im pretty sure they dont have lungs. Pretty sure they have modified swim bladders that are 'lung like' in function. Thats a bit different from having actual lungs. Im pretty sure they still have gills and breath as any fish does, but they can also gulp air into their swim bladders as required.

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Sombody please correct me of im wrong but...

Polys have a specialized organ called the labrynth organ, its the same organ thats found in anabantoid fish like bettas and ctenopoma and it allows these fish to breathe air. It is its own organ like a lung, not a swim bladder adaptation that allows this.

The better the water quality the faster the poly will lose his external gills BTW

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[Ian21777]

Sombody please correct me of im wrong but...

Polys have a specialized organ called the labrynth organ, its the same organ thats found in anabantoid fish like bettas and ctenopoma and it allows these fish to breathe air. It is its own organ like a lung, not a swim bladder adaptation that allows this.

The better the water quality the faster the poly will lose his external gills BTW

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Definitely not a labyrinth organ. They actually take air into this 'sac' be it lung or swim bladder. We are probably arguing semantics here. As although it is a modification to the swimbladder, it is modified to act as a lung. So maybe if it looks like a turd and smells like a turd... lol

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[Shopko]

Here is a good website on Polypterus lungs: http://digimorph.org/specimens/polypterus_senegalus/whole/

Here is a quick exerpt: "The lungs of Polypterus arise from a ventral glottis and pass around the alimentary canal into the coelom. The longer right lung continues almost the entire length of the body cavity, the left lung is shortened to accomodate the stomach and intestines. The movie was produced by isolating the internal volume of the bladder in VGStudio Max, rendering it in yellow and rendering the skeleton nearly transparent."

So, we can basically call them lungs.

 

[Shopko]

Here is a thought - many of the threads like this one (http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/f...43-Horns-are-growing&highlight=external+gills) indicate that two factors contribute to polys loosing their external gills.

1. Full development of their lungs
2. Water quality

I have found that in Ornates, they lose their external gills at around 4in (approx 10cm). So I figure that in Ornates, the development of their internal lungs is around that size. Water quality is another story. I think it may be more dissolved oxygen more than water quality. Here is my reasoning: A few years ago, I collected a bunch of salamander eggs and larvae in a 5 gal bucket. I removed the larvae to a 10 gal tank with the typical filter and air stone. About a month or so, I went to dump the bucket and noticed that there were several larva still in it (surviving on mosquito larva I guess). I put them in with the larvae in the 10 gal and noticed the new additions were the same size, but with significantly larger external gills. After awhile, the larger gills were reduced. The difference; water quality and an air stone. I did not test the water quality of the rainwater fed 5 gal bucket, but I really think the difference was the air stone.

This is just a theory.