newbie to discus

[troutking]

1.r discus easy to breed?
2.what size do they start breeding at?
3.can u sex them?
4. what is the best pH level can u keep them at 7?
5.how do u keep the pH stable at a lower pH level?
6. how do u change the hardness?
also any other advice?

 

[TwistedPenguin]

I broke every Discus "rule" when I got my 4 Discus 2 months ago. I've got hard water (kh 14, gh 300) and they're in with six 1" Geo babies (used to be in with Cory Cats). The 2 biggest ones were only about 3" when I got them and those 2 paired up and spawn twice a week every week. They're too young to know what they're doing (I believe they have to be about a year old normally to get it right) so they keep eating the eggs. The eggs wouldn't hatch anyway because my water's too hard. I had no intention of breeding them, it just happened so I'm not concerned with getting the eggs to hatch.
You need a kh test if you want to soften the water. The easiest way is to mix RO water with your tap water. Don't concern yourself too much with what pH is, get the kh around 5 or so if you want the eggs to hatch. The Discus themselves can live fine in hard water though. Mine are super bright neon colors, have almost doubled in size and eat everything I give them. My best advice is the same advice I give for Oscars and all other fish-keep your nitrates low. Period. Like around 5-10 ppm max. That's going to do them a lot more good than anything else. No way to sex them unless you see one laying eggs and one fertilizing them. I always thought my Super Red Melon was the female but found out he's the male.
But trust me-you'll hear a ton of "you have to do it this way" with Discus

 

[troutking]

and RO system is not cheap

 

[Bderick67]

You need a kh test if you want to soften the water. The easiest way is to mix RO water with your tap water. Don't concern yourself too much with what pH is, get the kh around 5 or so if you want the eggs to hatch.

You really should research pH shock, especially if your gonna run your carbonate hardness as low as 5 degrees(about 80 ppm). Having your carbonate hardness under 70 ppm makes for unstable pH, and fish don't respond well to large pH swings.

 

[TwistedPenguin]

Oh good lord. And you should read up on the myth of "pH shock' which actually isn't 'pH shock', but more along the lines of 'tds shock' for lack of a better label.
http://www.aquariaplants.com/waterchemistry.htm

 

[Bderick67]

Oh good lord. And you should read up on the myth of "pH shock' which actually isn't 'pH shock', but more along the lines of 'tds shock' for lack of a better label.
http://www.aquariaplants.com/waterchemistry.htm

Good read, good to see you finally doing some research(You should read again, that way you'll understand that kH has nothing to do with the Hardness of the water

Anyhow, the author contradicts himself and does state that pH swings could cause adverse effects if water quality isn't perfect. Low quality water is something many fishkeepers are quilty of and suggesting that they don't need to worry about pH swing is very wrong.

pH

More people probably worry and fret over this number than anything else in fishkeeping. Beginners are always concerned their pH is too high or too low. Sadly many authors have given rise to this myth that fish need a specific pH to thrive. While it may be true that some fish need a low or high range pH to spawn and have the eggs hatch the truth is an overwhelming number of fish will live, breed, and eggs hatch and thrive in a very wide range of pH. Much more significant is TDS or Total Dissolve Salts...Total Hardness. Plants really don't seem to care about pH...but they do better with plenty of CO2 in the water and when that occurs the pH is going to fall near neutral. The important thing to remember about pH isn't that your fish require a specific pH but rather a range of GH and KH that will effect the pH, in that sense pH can seem to be important. I'm also unconcerned about pH swings if due to an influence in CO2 levels. And I firmly disbelieve that there is a "pH shock" that many authors refer to. I keep many "considered" sensitive fish such as Apisto's and Chocolate Gourami's. I've never experienced any sign of stress related to sudden and dramatic changes in pH in fish tanks. I routinely move fish from CO2 injected tanks to non-injected tanks...again no problems in either direction.

I've never seen any problems nor do I subscribe to the belief that there is such a thing as "pH shock". Wright Huntley has some interesting posts on the APD if you search the archives for "pH shock". Here's my take on the issue of pH shock. In and of itself pH swings cause no harm, but the impact of a movement in pH may have synergistic effects. Meaning that it's a combination of two or more substances which produce effects greater than their sum. For example, the pH of the water will determine the toxic effects, if any, of many substances. Ammonia, Nitrite, and metals have toxicity based on pH. Provided your water is pristine and devoid of ammonia and nitrite then pH swings should never cause any stress. Moving fish from water with low TDS to high TDS is often tolerated too, but moving a fish from high TDS to low TDS will often kill them in minutes. I never move fish from water with differing amounts of TDS...never.

 

[Bderick67]

This author is wrong on another point also

Baking Soda will rasie both GH and KH

What to do if my water lacks buffer (low KH)

If you chose to inject CO2 you really need to have a KH of at least 3 degrees. Starting with a lower amount of buffer means your pH is lower too. Since injecting CO2 to levels of 20-30 ppm requires a drop in pH of 0.6 to 1.0 it's safest to do so with a starting pH of at least 7.4 so that at 30 ppm your pH is no lower than 6.4. Experienced fishkeepers can operate safely at levels below this if they have special circumstances but for most the prudent thing to do is to begin CO2 injection with 3 degrees or more of KH. To increase KH you can use baking soda. Baking soda is sodium bicarbonate. Bicarbonate/baking soda will raise the KH of 50 liters by 1 degree per 1/4 teaspoon. Baking soda will only raise the KH, if your water is too soft you may wish to use calcium carbonate to raise both GH and KH. Calcium carbonate will raise both KH and GH of 50 liters of water by 1 degree per 1/2 teaspoon. Alternately you can place crushed coral, cuttlebone or dolomite in your filter to dissolve slowly and increase both KH and GH but understand that this method is inexact and inaccurate.

I know ths for a fact, it is not my opinion but is my experience.

 

[troutking]

any help?

 

[cassharper]

1.r discus easy to breed?
2.what size do they start breeding at?
3.can u sex them?
4. what is the best pH level can u keep them at 7?
5.how do u keep the pH stable at a lower pH level?
6. how do u change the hardness?
also any other advice?

Not to take away from this lively debate... but I'll help you where I can. Discus come from naturally soft and slightly to moderately acidic water... that's in the wild. Chances are the discus you buy were bred in neutral to soft water, and as a captive species they have adapted to live in pretty much any water type (within reason now!)

The only time you should alter the water is try and ensure they arrive in your home in water parameters close to what they were being kept in by the breeder/purveyor. Slowly change this to whatever their lifelong water will be (that is slowly!).

Discus can be easy to breed, but they can be very hard. I suggest to go to google for this as there are many great articles out there.

 

[troutking]

Not to take away from this lively debate... but I'll help you where I can. Discus come from naturally soft and slightly to moderately acidic water... that's in the wild. Chances are the discus you buy were bred in neutral to soft water, and as a captive species they have adapted to live in pretty much any water type (within reason now!)

The only time you should alter the water is try and ensure they arrive in your home in water parameters close to what they were being kept in by the breeder/purveyor. Slowly change this to whatever their lifelong water will be (that is slowly!).

Discus can be easy to breed, but they can be very hard. I suggest to go to google for this as there are many great articles out there.

thanks finally so useful info