Seeking a Flowerhorn / Hybrid Cichlid Expert

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dogofwar

Arapaima
MFK Member
Jan 3, 2006
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www.capitalcichlids.org
Many folks in the traditional cichlid hobby - including me - know very little about flowerhorns and other types of hybrid cichlids.

This lack of knowledge has led some to disparage and look down on flowerhorns, while it has led some (like me) to want to learn more.

The "big names" of the cichlid hobby are folks like Ad Konings, Paul Loiselle, and Wayne Leibel.

Who are some luminaries in the flowerhorn hobby who could be good "ambassadors" to the flowerhorn hobby?

Who among them could possibly present or write an article for traditional cichlid people (in the US) on such topics as:
- development of flowerhorns and other hybrid strains,
- different kinds of flowerhorns and how to tell them apart,
- what makes a good flowerhorn
- show judging classes & standards,
- flowerhorn maintenance and breeding
- responsible flowerhorn breeding and sales

Thanks for your thoughts here or you can PM me me!

Matt
 
Great initiative Matt!
I am tracking this thread as I too want to know how "organized" and how much "info" is being catalogued of these experimental fish. I say experimental because it is said there are no 2 FH's alike.

I really want to know more about this hobby and who is behind it.
Rich
 
There is a great store (Jojo Aquarium) in Sacramento that focuses on flowerhorns and discus. It's hands down the best store from a service, cleanliness, helpfullness perspective in town.

The guys that run it are Malaysian (I think). They had trophies in their store from competitions in Asia and regularly import fish from there. They also sell them for hundreds of dollars each.

I think that there's a lot of good information on Flowerhorns out there...and really knowledgeble, conscientious people...

It would be great to engage with them to help bridge the gap between the two "worlds" of the cichlid hobby...
 
It all comes from several breeding facilities out of Aisa / Malaysia / Thailand / Vietnam. They track hier own strains and are usually pretty secretive about how they get what they made. There are several books about them out there for purchase if you google for them.
 
dogofwar;2427018; said:
Many folks in the traditional cichlid hobby - including me - know very little about flowerhorns and other types of hybrid cichlids.

This lack of knowledge has led some to disparage and look down on flowerhorns, while it has led some (like me) to want to learn more.

The "big names" of the cichlid hobby are folks like Ad Konings, Paul Loiselle, and Wayne Leibel.

Who are some luminaries in the flowerhorn hobby who could be good "ambassadors" to the flowerhorn hobby?

Who among them could possibly present or write an article for traditional cichlid people (in the US) on such topics as:
- development of flowerhorns and other hybrid strains,
- different kinds of flowerhorns and how to tell them apart,
- what makes a good flowerhorn
- show judging classes & standards,
- flowerhorn maintenance and breeding
- responsible flowerhorn breeding and sales

Thanks for your thoughts here or you can PM me me!

Matt

Mr.Firemouth;2427351; said:
Great initiative Matt!
I am tracking this thread as I too want to know how "organized" and how much "info" is being catalogued of these experimental fish. I say experimental because it is said there are no 2 FH's alike.

I really want to know more about this hobby and who is behind it.
Rich

Some hard questions. Most of those article questions can no doubt be answered pretty easily if you find the right member with enough time to write it. Responsible sales/Judging classes & standards will be more complex though.

IMO it would be hard to say "Here this is the guy who started it" I don't know if you could track it down to even a few people with proof to back it up. And as of right now FH's are such a large hobby that you have so many breeders most of which are Thai/Malaysian based that I don't think I could count them all. I would consider all those people "leaders" as those are the people putting out the quality fish and keeping many interested.

We have some good basic stickys at the top of this section. I'm always looking to add more though it seems the knowledagble are low on time to create such things usually. Just the way it works. While general CA/SA cichlid rules apply to FH's there are alot of special "rules" for even just housing a FH correctly and getting it to look it's absolute best. Especially with the new strains they've come along way from just something that looks like a Trimac.

I will also say that real FH enthusiasts are very organized. It's not just breeding anything that will. And not just breeding a fish because it can. It's looking for certain admirable traits in each parent fish and you will find the good quality fish breeders only using the best of that species to breed with. It can come down to fin quality/shape being a deciding factor on whether that specimen is a nice fish or not. This is not to be offensive to anyone who partakes in non particular hybrid breeding, but usually the best looking hybrids/FH's didn't happen by accident.

I think both FH and traditional CA/SA cichlid sides of the hobby could benefit from a all inclusive article on FH/Hybrids. There are actually alot of younger/newer FH enthusiast that could benefit from such info and it could only help make this hobby better in the up coming years with a more knowledgable group of hobbiests and people who want to breed..

Hopefully people like Danz, JPlikewoah, some of our knowledgable overseas FH lovers can chime in as well.
 
Thanks - I really think that "traditional" cichlid breeders would gain respect for the work that - I'm sure - goes into developing a high quality line of flowerhorns.

There are some who will never be on board. But it's their choice to be closed minded and insular.
 
The Developement of The Flowerhorn

Flowerhorns began in the South East Asian country of Malaysia. The Malaysians were attempting to recreate the proprietary hobby fish of Taiwan, the Blood Parrot. Though unsuccessful in their attempts to re-create the blood parrot (mostly due to the unavailability of Synspilums with the needed gene) they did create the first ever 'Flowerhorn'.

The very first strains and breeds of flowerhorns were very different from today's version. Most were not very colorful and only a handful had very large nuchal humps. As they were developed further, some very desirable and interesting traits developed. Meng Aquarium in Malaysia developed some of the most famous fish during this period. They called this line of breeding the 'Fuakok' strain. Generally this series of fish are considered the forefathers of the modern day Flowerhorn.

Meng Aquarium fish:

'Coronation Link'
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'Tornado Effect'
post-19-1196345404.jpg


'Perfect Harmony'
post-19-1196345484.jpg



Flowerhorn popularity in Asia was beginning to grow exponentially as flowerhorns grew more and more attractive. They resonated particlularly with Asian hobbyists because their features and traits represented desired feng shui and other Asian cultural phenomenon. Such as, red being representative of wealth and power as well as the nuchal hump resembling a chinese deity of wealth, etc.

Right around 2002-2003 the Flowerhorn was declared the official feng shui fish (replacing the asian arowana). Flowerhorn popularity had never been higher in Asia. Stores were selling 1-2" fry for 10 times the amount they had been previously. More and more breeders uninterested in the developement of the flowerhorn and very interested in making money began flooding the market place with very low quality flowerhorn fry. These fish would have been culled by a responsible flowerhorn farm, but because they were worth so much no matter how they looked they were sold to dispassionate hobbyists who knew little about the breed or their origins, caught up in the hype of the craze.

In 2003-04 The Asian flowerhorn bubble finally burst. Many aquarium shops and breeders went out of business and never returned to the hobby. Thousands of disillusioned hobbyists, upset that their expensive fish ended up very ugly when full grown despite the promises of the breeder or store began throwing their unwanted fish in rivers and local waterways. Perhaps this was the greatest tragedy of all.

While Malaysia was arguably the most effected by the crash, the hobby continued to live on (though much more low key) in other SE Asian countries. Supported by select dedicated and passionate breeders from Indonesia, Thailand, Singapore, a handful still remained in Malaysia. They continued to develope and create new flowerhorn strains that are directly related to the flowerhorn we see today.

Currently Malaysia, Thailand, Indonesia, Vietnam export flowerhorn to the US. The Phillipines have many excellent breeders and farms and hopefully they will begin exporting very soon as well. Each country currently has something of a signature fish that they are known for developing.

Malaysia:
Golden Monkey
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Thailand: SRT, ThaiMalau:
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Indonesia: Kamfa, IndoMalau
DSC_1249.jpg

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Vietnam: King Kamfa, Tan King
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Above is representative of the current state of flowerhorn in each of the mentioned countries. Developement is constant and ongoing today in all of them. Because there are so many different strains of Flowerhorns, breeders will rarely use a pure strain fish in their developments. Instead they commonly use line breeding and outcrossings with other strains of flowerhorns attempting to create a fish with the best traits of the above fish while simultaneously minimizing the defects in the above.

*NOTE*
This is not a complete history on the developement in flowerhorn. There have been some pieces, particularly right before and after the craze started, in which strains of fish were developed that I haven't covered in the interest of time. Hopefully some experts can chime in and correct any mistakes I made as well as add to this. I know they visit this forum from time to time as well!
 
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