Talk to me about gymnogeophagus balzani

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Tripping Willow 91

Tripping Willow 91

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Oct 20, 2021
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So I've just got myself a juwel Rio 240 (121Lx41Wx55D 65us gal) not quite the 5ft tank I was hoping for but was a steal and tbh a 5ft would have probably been too large for the room. So with the smaller tank I've had to change my stocking idea of read head tapo and a sev. I'm loving balzani and have been researching into them and also messaging with duanes about them. I'd really like to get a little group of these guys but first I'd just like to get some more info off anyone that's had experience with them. How do they fair in hard water, best tank mates, do they tend to be hardy, are they usually bright or dull when mature? Any firsthand info would be great
 
 
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duanes said:
juvie above, young male below
a little older below
the group
The hardness of my water was @250mg/L (7 grains)
pH 7.8
Click to expand...
They're some good looking fish, I love the unusual shape of them. Were all of your group wild caught Bella union specimens? It would be interesting to compare some of the variants and the commercially bred fish. Good to see yours done well in hard water, mines at 358ppm so not too far away from yours
 
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I looked for these forever, never saw any locally. When I was lucky enough to find them I snagged up six as youngsters of about an inch. They have grown beautifully in my ~300ppm well water, in my basement fishroom where water temps are around 70-75F in summer and 60-65F in winter. The only reason I use a heater at all in their tank is because without it that cool-down period would stretch out to 6 months, so supplemental heat in the spring and fall shortens the cool period down to about 3 months. Right now the heater is maintaining about 72F, and around Christmas I will disconnect the heat until around mid-March.

My fish were locally bred for apparently a few generations. Unknown original locality. They aren't flashy, but as the dominant male matures he is quietly beautiful, lots of subtle colours and iridescence. They live with other cool-tolerant fish including a couple of cichlid species, a couple of Goodeid livebearer species and several other assorted smaller fish. The balzani are among the largest fish in the tank, the biggest male around 5 inches now after about a year. They are totally inoffensive and non-predatory, completely ignoring even newly-born Goodeids only a half-inch long. Their interactions with the other cichlids (Cichlasoma dimerus and Gymnogeophagus rhabdotus) are essentially non-existent. They don't bother anybody, and rarely even bother each other. These three cichlid species are so different in appearance and general shape that they really don't care about one another.

This past summer the balzani lost the coin toss and stayed indoors when I picked a cichlid to put outside in a stock tank for the season. The rhabdotus won the toss, but lost the spawning sweepstakes; I wound up with 3 fry! But the balzani didn't let that stop them, and at least 3 different females were seen carrying eggs at various times. The tank is heavily "decorated" with rocks and wood...a polite way of saying that it's a hot mess, but I never actually saw a spawning site. No young seem to have survived the community, but I have high hopes for these guys next summer.

Unlike some fish that you search for but quickly grow disillusioned with after finding them, the balzani have really been a satisfying and pleasing species to keep. Not flashy, but attractive...not constantly causing aggression issues, but not getting bullied either. Their distinctive tail-cocked-up posture is endearing, and my wife christened the big-headed male "Brainiac". My 360-gallon DIY tank was intended to be a community of Goodeids and similar-sized fish, with a couple of larger peaceful cichlids thrown in just for good measure. It quickly morphed into a cichlid tank with lots of dithers. The balzani are the stars of the show, and I don't see myself moving them on anytime soon.

I just noticed that your tank is 65 gallons; maybe a little on the small side for a group or harem of these fish. Males are supposed to get up around 7-8 inches, females a bit smaller. I wonder if their peaceful nature would be less so in that size tank. I definitely wouldn't put anything else into that small footprint together with a group of these.
 
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jjohnwm said:
I looked for these forever, never saw any locally. When I was lucky enough to find them I snagged up six as youngsters of about an inch. They have grown beautifully in my ~300ppm well water, in my basement fishroom where water temps are around 70-75F in summer and 60-65F in winter. The only reason I use a heater at all in their tank is because without it that cool-down period would stretch out to 6 months, so supplemental heat in the spring and fall shortens the cool period down to about 3 months. Right now the heater is maintaining about 72F, and around Christmas I will disconnect the heat until around mid-March.

My fish were locally bred for apparently a few generations. Unknown original locality. They aren't flashy, but as the dominant male matures he is quietly beautiful, lots of subtle colours and iridescence. They live with other cool-tolerant fish including a couple of cichlid species, a couple of Goodeid livebearer species and several other assorted smaller fish. The balzani are among the largest fish in the tank, the biggest male around 5 inches now after about a year. They are totally inoffensive and non-predatory, completely ignoring even newly-born Goodeids only a half-inch long. Their interactions with the other cichlids (Cichlasoma dimerus and Gymnogeophagus rhabdotus) are essentially non-existent. They don't bother anybody, and rarely even bother each other. These three cichlid species are so different in appearance and general shape that they really don't care about one another.

This past summer the balzani lost the coin toss and stayed indoors when I picked a cichlid to put outside in a stock tank for the season. The rhabdotus won the toss, but lost the spawning sweepstakes; I wound up with 3 fry! But the balzani didn't let that stop them, and at least 3 different females were seen carrying eggs at various times. The tank is heavily "decorated" with rocks and wood...a polite way of saying that it's a hot mess, but I never actually saw a spawning site. No young seem to have survived the community, but I have high hopes for these guys next summer.

Unlike some fish that you search for but quickly grow disillusioned with after finding them, the balzani have really been a satisfying and pleasing species to keep. Not flashy, but attractive...not constantly causing aggression issues, but not getting bullied either. Their distinctive tail-cocked-up posture is endearing, and my wife christened the big-headed male "Brainiac". My 360-gallon DIY tank was intended to be a community of Goodeids and similar-sized fish, with a couple of larger peaceful cichlids thrown in just for good measure. It quickly morphed into a cichlid tank with lots of dithers. The balzani are the stars of the show, and I don't see myself moving them on anytime soon.

I just noticed that your tank is 65 gallons; maybe a little on the small side for a group or harem of these fish. Males are supposed to get up around 7-8 inches, females a bit smaller. I wonder if their peaceful nature would be less so in that size tank. I definitely wouldn't put anything else into that small footprint together with a group of these.
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Thanks for your detailed response lots of good info for me. From everything I've found its looking like these are very adaptable to hard water and not fussy in that respect. The temps yours are kept at are very similar to what mine would be at, I'm in the UK and my tank will be in the living room, it's currently 63f (17c) in here and it'll remain in that region for the next few months, then in August it might hit low 80s for a couple weeks so I think temp wise I'll be on the money.

I've never been into super colorful fish and it's the natural colours and unusual shape of balzani that draws me to them, I've seem some pics of some with lovely yellow bellies, how do yours compare to duanes, any photos?

Yer my tank is tiny compared to your giant but sadly in my little house this is about the biggest I can go right now, I don't want to get these fish if they're not going to be happy in my set up though, I believe duane kept his in a 60g? My plan was keep the scape simple, low light, silica sand substrate, some long oak branches and large pebbles for cover. With regards to stock I was thinking 1-2m and 3-4f, along with a small group of either bloodfin or buenos aires tetra and 5 or so corydoras, do you think this would be too much for my tank?
 
It doesn't matter how big or how small your tank is, there's always somebody else with a comparative "monster". :)

I've only had these fish for a bit over a year, so I'm far from expert on their quirks. If it were me, I would buy a group of babies, raise them up until you can sex them, and then keep the best male and 3 females. It seems that the male will breed with multiple ladies, rather than pairing up with one and then beating up all the others as some cichlids would do. I wouldn't put two males into that tank, because they are still cichlids and that sounds like a fight, or at least an unhealthy intimidation, waiting to happen.

And if it were mine, I wouldn't put in other fish, simply because I like sparsely populated tanks. You could certainly get away with a few cool-tolerant Corydoras like C.paleatus, but the balzani are typical sand-sifting eartheaters and other bottom-feeders aren't going to be needed unless you want them. I have a few Scleromystax (formerly Corydoras) barbatus in my tank, just because I like them.

And again, I'm sure you could swing a few carefully chosen tetras as well; both choices you mentioned would probably be good in those temps. I wouldn't do it just because I like buying schooling fish like that in at least a group of 10 or so, and then we're back to that crowded tank thing of mine. If you keep up with water changes I'm sure its doable, just not pleasing to my eye. If some small fish are a must-have, I'd go with the Bloodfins because the BA tetras get fairly large.

Personally, I'd prefer some kind of livebearers in that tank. I love the look of big fish and little fish together, and tiny livebearer fry growing up amongst relatively large fish like balzani looks good to me.
 
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The Wet Spot has tank raised for $10/ea
 
Disregard my last post, shipping to England would be cost prohibitive.
 
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jjohnwm said:
It doesn't matter how big or how small your tank is, there's always somebody else with a comparative "monster". :)

I've only had these fish for a bit over a year, so I'm far from expert on their quirks. If it were me, I would buy a group of babies, raise them up until you can sex them, and then keep the best male and 3 females. It seems that the male will breed with multiple ladies, rather than pairing up with one and then beating up all the others as some cichlids would do. I wouldn't put two males into that tank, because they are still cichlids and that sounds like a fight, or at least an unhealthy intimidation, waiting to happen.

And if it were mine, I wouldn't put in other fish, simply because I like sparsely populated tanks. You could certainly get away with a few cool-tolerant Corydoras like C.paleatus, but the balzani are typical sand-sifting eartheaters and other bottom-feeders aren't going to be needed unless you want them. I have a few Scleromystax (formerly Corydoras) barbatus in my tank, just because I like them.

And again, I'm sure you could swing a few carefully chosen tetras as well; both choices you mentioned would probably be good in those temps. I wouldn't do it just because I like buying schooling fish like that in at least a group of 10 or so, and then we're back to that crowded tank thing of mine. If you keep up with water changes I'm sure its doable, just not pleasing to my eye. If some small fish are a must-have, I'd go with the Bloodfins because the BA tetras get fairly large.

Personally, I'd prefer some kind of livebearers in that tank. I love the look of big fish and little fish together, and tiny livebearer fry growing up amongst relatively large fish like balzani looks good to me.
Click to expand...
Haha yer that's true, maybe one day I'll have a tank that makes my 65 look tiny but for now it's my monster.

So far I've found a couple sites that's sell balzani, I've never ordered fish online and it's not really the way I'd like to do it. I will ring around the lfs but I have a feeling I won't find any that stock them. I've never kept cichlids before, I've recently been in to heavily planted tanks lightly stocked with tiny fish but I fancied a change to bigger fish without the hassle of plants and cichlids seemed like the perfect candidate.

I think maybe I'm underestimating the size they'll get, I've never been one for a heavily stocked tank but I'm also thinking without having a tonne of plants the tank will look very empty. Bigger fish and plantless tanks are both new for me. I personally didn't think a 4ft tank with 4-6 balzani, 10 tetra and 6 cories would look heavily stocked but as I said its all new to me and perhaps I'm underestimating the size they'll get.

I've always been particularly keen on bloodfin tetras and in my last tank it was a toss up between bloodfin and glowlight danios, I decided on the danios so this time around I'd definitely be happy with bloodfin, I wasn't sure if they'd be too small but obviously not. I've always been keen on Endlers but if balzani don't predate the fry I wouldn't want to end up overrun with them. The thing that attracts me to corydoras is just that I think they'd look good sifting through the sand alongside the balzani but if the balzani spend most of there time on the bottom then it might be too much going on down there.

The tera are to act as a dither plus for some movement higher up in the water, the idea of 2 males was for displaying purposes and I assumed the dominant male would colour/size up better with a rival in the tank? But as you say perhaps it's a little too small for 2 males.

What do you think to 1m 3f with 12 bloodfin and 1 albino bristlenose (the missus wants a catfish of some sort), do you think this would be a heavily stocked tank? I picture this as being quite lightly stocked but with enough activity to make a nice feature tank in my living room
 
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