the "wild fish plague"? identify please.

[Retuks]

so there is this pond at Haleiwa Joe's resturaunt in kaneohe... between me and my girlfriend, catching fish in the wild has been very biased towards her.

The first fish i caught for her was a small convict Cichlid from the restaurant. this was over a year ago when we knew little about fish bacteria and introduced it to her 15 gallon hexagon community. within the week, all her fish except the convict where dead. she had some loaches, plecos, and other little nick-nack fish all LFS bought.

on our second occasion, i caught her a small brackish tilapia for her new saltwater tank. her only other fish was a yellow damsel from the LFS (which i told her not to get as i forsaw the same thing was going to happen) and of course it did, she explained to me that the damsel started acting "weird" and got darker and darker until it died.

the funny thing about this is, all the fish i have in my tank are from the wild except my tiger oscar which was bought at the same LFS as all of her fish. however i gave the new fish a 2 day quarantine in other containers before allowing them into the main tank. but one time, when i added my o'opu and plecos into the tank i did not even quarantine them. and my oscar was fine!

just yesterday i caught around 200 misc mosquito fish, sword tail, and guppy from the notorious Haleiwa pond that killed my girlfriend's community. i melafixed and gave them a 100% water change (25% of the water used to fill their container was from my main tank, 75% from the taps). i plan to use them as feeders...

MY QUESTION: what is the main culprit disease/bacteria thats most often killing off captivity fish by transmitting through wild fish. it acts like a plague and according to my gf, it turns the affected fish dark until dead.

 

[Lupin]

so there is this pond at Haleiwa Joe's resturaunt in kaneohe... between me and my girlfriend, catching fish in the wild has been very biased towards her.

The first fish i caught for her was a small convict Cichlid from the restaurant. this was over a year ago when we knew little about fish bacteria and introduced it to her 15 gallon hexagon community. within the week, all her fish except the convict where dead. she had some loaches, plecos, and other little nick-nack fish all LFS bought.

on our second occasion, i caught her a small brackish tilapia for her new saltwater tank. her only other fish was a yellow damsel from the LFS (which i told her not to get as i forsaw the same thing was going to happen) and of course it did, she explained to me that the damsel started acting "weird" and got darker and darker until it died.

the funny thing about this is, all the fish i have in my tank are from the wild except my tiger oscar which was bought at the same LFS as all of her fish. however i gave the new fish a 2 day quarantine in other containers before allowing them into the main tank. but one time, when i added my o'opu and plecos into the tank i did not even quarantine them. and my oscar was fine!

just yesterday i caught around 200 misc mosquito fish, sword tail, and guppy from the notorious Haleiwa pond that killed my girlfriend's community. i melafixed and gave them a 100% water change (25% of the water used to fill their container was from my main tank, 75% from the taps). i plan to use them as feeders...

MY QUESTION: what is the main culprit disease/bacteria thats most often killing off captivity fish by transmitting through wild fish. it acts like a plague and according to my gf, it turns the affected fish dark until dead.

I see some issues here.

1. Quarantine procedure.
Two days is not enough. Try four weeks. It is very rare for most wild caught species to harbor parasites that would destroy all the captive bred fish.

2. Compatibility.
That convict is a very aggressive species. There is no other explanation why the other fish died but its belligerence itself. That tank was ridiculously overcrowded and inappropriately stocked.

That tilapia you introduced in your SW tank is inappropriate for a SW setup. A lot of species of tilapias are highly belligerent. My guess is your damsel was unable to defend itself and may have been stressed until it succumbed to its condition.

Mosquito fish are also nasty little devils. I had a few of these before and they wreak havoc through the community tank when I would have thought they would simply act like guppies. This is why wherever they were introduced, they have been known to rip through the local flora and fauna.

3. Water parameters.
Brackish water specimens tolerate a certain extent of salinity. There are those that will not tolerate SW on its high end.

Overall, all your scenarios involved compatibility issues, nothing about parasites or diseases exclusively to wild caught populations so far.

 

[Retuks]

I see some issues here.

1. Quarantine procedure.
Two days is not enough. Try four weeks. It is very rare for most wild caught species to harbor parasites that would destroy all the captive bred fish.

2. Compatibility.
That convict is a very aggressive species. There is no other explanation why the other fish died but its belligerence itself. That tank was ridiculously overcrowded and inappropriately stocked.

That tilapia you introduced in your SW tank is inappropriate for a SW setup. A lot of species of tilapias are highly belligerent. My guess is your damsel was unable to defend itself and may have been stressed until it succumbed to its condition.

Mosquito fish are also nasty little devils. I had a few of these before and they wreak havoc through the community tank when I would have thought they would simply act like guppies. This is why wherever they were introduced, they have been known to rip through the local flora and fauna.

3. Water parameters.
Brackish water specimens tolerate a certain extent of salinity. There are those that will not tolerate SW on its high end.

Overall, all your scenarios involved compatibility issues, nothing about parasites or diseases exclusively to wild caught populations so far.

though your analysis holds water in technical terms, i am TELLING you what happened. not what can happen. PLEASE assist me in answering my question if possible.

in scenario 1 where the convict was introduced to the small tank, all other fish in the tank were untouched by the convict and had no external damage upon discovery of death.

the quarantine procedure was merely an example to show how my fish don't succumb to bacteria as my gf's fish did which i found confusing.

also wrong in the tilapia scenario as it was a very timid tilapia who was trying to escape throughout his entire duration of being in the tank while the damsel had no hostile interaction with it what so ever. the tilapia would swim away from the damsel who would be following it "trying to befriend it".

after a couple days my gf and i decided to return the tilapia to Kailua beach's canal where we found it out of sympathy for the fish. it was the next day that the damsel started to go into its serious and fatal condition which replicated the same symptoms that had shown in the other fish from the cichlid case.

again, i am trying to figure out with MFK's help what the main bacteria is that kills any fish that we buy at the store upon exposure to infected fish from the wild. i figured that wild fish are immune being born and raised in the rivers with this bacteria and to my success none of my fish have died as they are all from the wild except my Tiger oscar.

so what is this bacteria that will infect vulnerable/captive-breed fish, turning them darker in color and sometimes distorting their behavior until death within the week?

 

[Lupin]

in scenario 1 where the convict was introduced to the small tank, all other fish in the tank where untouched by the convict and had no external damage upon discovery of death.

Your post never indicated any unusual behavioral signs. What are they if you have not been seeing external damages? How long has her tank been running? How often do you change your water?

the quarantine procedure was merely an example to show how my fish don't succumb to bacteria as my gf's fish did which i found confusing.

Yet I do not understand why the quarantine process of yours entails only two days which is a very short duration especially for wild caught specimens.

also wrong in the tilapia scenario as it was a very timid tilapia who was trying to escape throughout his entire duration of being in the tank while the damsel had no hostile interaction with it what so ever. the tilapia would swim away from the damsel who would be following it "trying to befriend it".


after a couple days my gf and i decided to return the tilapia to Kailua beach's canal where we found it out of sympathy for the fish. it was the next day that the damsel started to go into its serious and fatal condition which replicated the same symptoms that had shown in the other fish from the cichlid case.

Why did you release the fish? Did you not reconsider the consequences of your actions? Releasing a fish from captivity back to the wild is a cause for disaster such as releasing diseases that native specimens have no immunity against.

What was the salinity level of your tank? What were the water parameters?

again, i am trying to figure out with MFK's help what the main bacteria is that kills any fish that we buy at the store upon exposure to infected fish from the wild. i figured that wild fish are immune being born and raised in the rivers with this bacteria and to my success none of my fish have died as they are all from the wild except my Tiger oscar.

so what is this bacteria that will infect vulnerable/captive-breed fish, turning them darker in color and sometimes distorting their behavior until death within the week?

This is why your quarantine duration needs to be stretched to protect your captive bred stocks. There is no certainty which exactly caused their demise but your actions need to be addressed as it is often the wrong quarantine regimen that is the culprit for their loss. It could be bacterial infection, internal parasites, etc.

What are your water parameters? You haven't added details on this one.

 

[Hwarang_Samurai]

Dont know about the tilapia scenario, but like what lupin said you should quarantine them for 4 weeks and the possible causes is that they could have these little bug external parasites I see on most wild fishes in the streams/ponds and most freshwater fishing streams/ponds have high levels of mercury and the wild fish waste could have killed them. Also I think its like this but captive bred fish are more vulnerable to sicknesses then wild fish for the wild fish has already built an immunity or is it the other way around? lol. Hope this helped

 

[beblondie]

it could be bacterial to determine which of the thousands of strains a culture needs to be made
it could be viral also
or it could also be internal flagellates (not likely within a weeks time frame but possible

 

[Retuks]

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Your post never indicated any unusual behavioral signs. What are they if you have not been seeing external damages? How long has her tank been running? How often do you change your water?

Please stop saying its my fish as it is not. the post is on behalf of my gf's issues. anyway, the fish would do any number of things, flicker or shake, do flips in the water, spin, etc. but the common symptom in all of HER cases were the darkening of the victims' bodies until dead. im ashamed to say she does not change her water when i tell her to, and i've done it on occasion when im at her place. so maintenance is irregular at best


Yet I do not understand why the quarantine process of yours entails only two days which is a very short duration especially for wild caught specimens.

my quarantine procedure for feeders/new fish is usually 2 weeks and its worked perfectly for my family for years. doing 30-50% water changes daily while quarantined and sometimes treating with meds. what i have told you was just a fact of the story and 2 days is not my normal procedure. that was a single moment in history when i put the o'opu and plecos with the rest of my fish without much quarantine time as i was willing to take the risk and testing my theory of wild caught fish being immune to other wild caught fish. in my case i have confirmed this. that is why i prefer wild fish over store bought. this island provides enough beauty for me.

Why did you release the fish? Did you not reconsider the consequences of your actions? Releasing a fish from captivity back to the wild is a cause for disaster such as releasing diseases that native specimens have no immunity against.

the date of capture was 3/15/09. the date of release was 3/17/09. that wouldn't have been enough time to affect the fish, let alone in a tank with one other inhabitant that died FROM the tilapia. the canal it came from is man-made and only inhabited by tilapia themselves which are an introduced species.


What was the salinity level of your tank? What were the water parameters?

i dont have this info, its not my tank. my girlfriend bought the damsel about three weeks before we decided to hunt for new fish for her tank. it was living healthy before the tilapia came. and died within the week of coming in contact with it.

This is why your quarantine duration needs to be stretched to protect your captive bred stocks. There is no certainty which exactly caused their demise but your actions need to be addressed as it is often the wrong quarantine regimen that is the culprit for their loss. It could be bacterial infection, internal parasites, etc.

What are your water parameters? You haven't added details on this one.

again, there is nothing wrong with my personal aquaria, the trouble is with my girlfriends tanks. i am not wondering why they are dying, i know why they are dying. i just want to know what exactly their dying from.

again, darkening of the body, restless and bizzare behavior, then death.

 

[megalopsatlanticus]

A standard method of quarantine is 30 days of observation and diagnosis, followed by a period of treatment.

 

[likestofish]

Think it might be pollutant in the water because salt and fresh have different diseases.