Updraft Filtration?

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Scylla

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Nov 9, 2009
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New Orleans, LA
Years ago I remember a friend of mine had a large cichlid tank that he'd built with overflow/sump filtration. The interesting part was his return pump from the sump pumped water through PVC piping that ran to multiple small directable outflows that were situated along the BOTTOM of the tank, in the gravel. It's hard to describe in words, but it was like he had 8 small powerheads buried in his substrate that were pumping in clean, filtered water directly from his sump. This return flow caused what can only be described as a constant "updraft" of his water column right into his overflow.

The result: the cleanest water and substrate I've EVER seen. I was there one day when he was siphoning his gravel. NO DEBRIS. None. When my siphon touches my gravel (a weekly occurrence), a cloud of debris is whisked away. He hadn't siphoned his substrate in over 3 months. He said with this setup he really didn't have to. Instead he simply cleaned his sump prefilter. It's as if his substrate is constantly being siphoned.

Has anyone else had experience with this setup? It seems like a great way to reduce the bio-sink we all experience from our hungry tanks. Any drawbacks (besides the obvious rather difficult initial setup)?

Any tips, pictures, plans would be greatly appreciated as I am seriously considering building this type of setup in my next tank.
 
You are describing the theory of a "reverse flow under gravel filter"

You can establish this concept by setting up a typical Under Gravel Filter but use a powerhead to push water down into the plates, as opposed to sucking through them...

As for doing it with the return line from the sump... you would have to be careful not to allow a siphon to be created when the sump pump is turned off (or in a power failure). This could by having a spray bar above the waters surface plumbed into the return prior to the buried returns. Then when the pump is turned off air will enter in through the spray bar and break the siphon connection.
 
There should be tons of plans for RUGF in the DIY section.
 
ran to multiple small directable outflows that were situated along the BOTTOM of the tank, in the gravel
Click to expand...

Could be all wrong..but when I read the OP i got "under gravel jet" picture in my head..
 
KaiserSousay;3610590; said:
Could be all wrong..but when I read the OP i got "under gravel jet" picture in my head..
Click to expand...

HILARIOUS!! You were absolutely correct, sir.

So I Googled under gravel jet first since it seemed more like what I had seen. The first website I looked at had a comment stating they got their plans from this website: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/ug_jets.php

That's not only the exact setup I was talking about, that is the SAME TANK! The article was written by my buddy I'd mentioned before, Marc. The pictures and plans are of that same tank I saw years ago.

Small world.
 
I dont think the OP is talking about RUGF's.... I remember seeing a DIY thread about this, but it was a while back & I wouldn't even know where to start looking now. Basically, the return line was plumbed over the top lip (like usual), but the pipe extended all the way to the bottom of the tank, then split out into a network of smaller pipes under the substrate. Each pipe had an outlet pointing a different direction so there were no deadspots & they were angled to sweep debris off the sand so nothing settled. I'll look around for the thread, but I'm sure this would require a fairly massive pump...
 
Scylla;3611029; said:
HILARIOUS!! You were absolutely correct, sir.

So I Googled under gravel jet first since it seemed more like what I had seen. The first website I looked at had a comment stating they got their plans from this website: http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/ug_jets.php

That's not only the exact setup I was talking about, that is the SAME TANK! The article was written by my buddy I'd mentioned before, Marc. The pictures and plans are of that same tank I saw years ago.

Small world.
Click to expand...

I bet thats the same article I was talking about... I read an article from there on how to rinse sand a while back. I loved the idea!
 
That question was quickly solved :P

I went to RUGF since gravel was mentioned as substrate... UGJets are typically used with sand, despite being referred to as Under "Gravel" Jets (which I never did understand)...

The substrate in the article by Marc seemed to be an 'inbetween' size. Very large sand or tiny gravel... This substrate is probably small enough in size so that waste wouildn't settle down into it very bad even without the Jets....

When using UGJs with typical gravel, we are still likely to have waste settle intot he gravel in low current areas, unless we have so darn many Jets therer are no low flow areas...
 
I've never used an under gravel jet system, but I do have a reverse under gravel filter. It does keep detritus from sinking into the gravel, but doesn't keep it off the surface. All the fish crap settles on top of the substrate and stays there till a fish swims by and stirs it up and it gets sucked into the filter. The top of the gravel doesn't look so great but if i jam a gravel vac into the substrate nothing comes up at all, so I never need to vacuum it unless I want it to look nice for half a day until the fish start to crap some more. My gravel is 1 - 2 mm average grain size, so even though its a lot bigger than sand and I have 1200 gallons per hour getting pushed up through it, the gravel diffuses the turbulence and creates a very even and gentle upwards flow that isn't enough to keep debris suspended in the water. Before I put the substrate in the tank though, nothing got a chance to settle because there was so much turbulence on the bottom: it was acting exactly like an undergravel jet, where the jets are above the substrate.

If i could do it again I would make an under gravel jet system as opposed to a reverse under gravel filter. I think the jets would do a much better job of keeping debris from settling on top of the gravel.

The only issue I can see is that if you have too much flow and too much turbulence, it will bother the fish. I have oscars that like to lay and rest on the bottom of the tank sometimes, and before I put the gravel in, they could never find a spot to chill out because there were no dead spots and they were getting blasted by hundreds of tiny water jets whenever they got within 6 inches of the bottom.
 
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