What is considered too often?

  • We are currently upgrading MFK. thanks! -neo
P

ptadam22

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Apr 28, 2010
21
0
0
CA
I have a few questions about water changes and beneficial bacteria as it related to the health of the tank.

1. As I understand it beneficial bacteria just lives on physical items such as substrate and filter media, but does not just hang out in the water correct?

2. So water changes should only add to the health of the tank, are there negatives to changing the water too often?

3. How often should I gravel vac the substrate when doing water changes, is every time too much?

4. Is BB attached pretty well to the substrate such that the vacuum action only picks up deteriorating fish poo/food and other items you don't want sitting?

5. Will pulling items out of the aquarium for ~15-30min while cleaning the tank kill the BB by not being in water?

Also, can someone tell me how many times my 20g tank turns the volume over with an emperor 280 and top fin 20 HOB filters? Getting my learn on with this tank before I setup my 22nd bday present to myself, 100g tank. Thanks in advance to whoever can clear up these topics to a noob. :screwy:
 
im pretty interested in this subject too because i would love to try and do water changes every day because track season is over and i have more time now, however i woukld never want it to degrade the health of my fish
 
I have been told to only vacume 1" deep on half the substrate at a time alternating each half of the tank. for cleaning practies, but i believe less is more for smaller aquariums, smaller aquariums have less bb buildup and should practice more water changes ansd less aggressive gravel vacs. the substrate in smaller ecosystems grows beneficial bacteria at a slower rate than larger and should be treated as more fragile than ecosystems that are larger and have a more stable bb growth pattern. an easy way to help small tanks is to add a bio wheel or similar additional bb . also to press old filter pads against new pads at replacement , often over looked! seems simple but can't hurt
 
I have a question about adding bb to an established or new tank. is it best to add directly to the fitler system ( where the bb will be grown in the filter pad) or add into the tank as a whole ?
 
Changing water doesnt neccessarily degrade or reduce BB as long as you dont disturb that which it is attached to...substrate, media etc. If you are absolutly treating the new water for CL2 and chloramines and the temp doesnt fluctuate to much, I dont see any harm in DAILY water changes. Your fish may get stressed until thay get used to seeing you so up close and personal and again, temp fluctuations. You may begin to see behaviors you never saw before as a bonus. Your fish may begin to breed, something very clean water can often stimulate fish to do.
There a re a lot of threads in here about the pros and cons of frequent or excessive water changes, but I feel that as long as the WC is done properly, frequency really is a benefit.
My 2¢.
 
Does anyone have any good sites breaking down the cycle process and bacteria involved into a chemical in depth analysis? Being science minded I'd enjoy reading more in depth than what most people provide, leaving you with a feeling of taking their word for it all.
 
water changes when done properly do little to the bacterial populatation in a tank.

when you vacuum your substrate for example, you don't 'suck' the bacteria off the gravel. they remain stuck on via their sticky outer peptidoglycan coat.

they remain stuck on to the substrate.

if done right, there really is no such thing as 'too often'.

most discus keepers for example, do daily water changes of 50% on their discus.

so you really have nothing to worry about.

water change away! :)
 
can i ask why you want to do a daily water change? Seems a little excessive and waste of water/money to me.
The breeding part i can understand but just because?
 
Great information here for the most part...


I don't agree with only vac'ing 1" deep and I see no benefits from doing so. "Beneficial Bacteria" will live where there is water flow, which is the top layer of gravel. While the majority of the waste will also be in the top layer, some may settle lower and not removing it is leaving waste in the system.


Smaller tanks/ecosystems do not grow bacteria at a slower rate, nor are they more delicate. It is true that there would be a smaller total population, as it is a smaller environment, but smaller population doe not equal a weaker population.


As for 'seeding' a tank, it really doesn't matter. The bacteria will colonize where there is an abundance of resources. Which may be in the filter, may be on the substrate, may be on the decor, may be anywhere. Don't assume they 'mostly' live in the filter.


As the conlusion of this thread suggests... when properly done, you cannot do water changes "too frequently"....
 
In my experience, fish really benefit from clean water, so there is nothing like too many water changes. What creates a problem for fish is rapid changes in the water quality. If your fish are used to a 20% wc weekly and you do a 75% one week, they will probably freak out. However, fish could easily adapt themselves to these changes if they are progressive : two weeks at 20%; two weeks at 25%; two weeks at 30% ... two weeks at 75%. When adapted, they clearly benefit from the clean water (low nitrates, hormones, polluants); live longer, grow faster and bigger, more colorful...

It is the same principle when you add new fish in a tank that has a 30 ppm nitrates level : the old fish seem fine since they are used to it (progressive increase of nitrates level) while the new ones are stressed and may get sick.

This scientific study even found that fish could get used to ammonia. Here is the abstract :

"An automatic flow-through dosing apparatus was used to determine the effect on Tilapia aurea of acute and chronic exposure to un-ionized ammonia. For fish not exposed to ammonia prior to acute testing, the 48-hour median lethal concentration (LC50) was 2.40 mg/liter un-ionized ammonia. After fish were exposed to sublethal concentrations of un-ionized ammonia (0.43-0.53 mg/liter) for 35 days, concentrations as high as 3.4 mg/liter caused no mortalities within 48 hours. Histopathological changes occurred in the gills of fish given both nonlethal and acute doses of ammonia. Capillary congestion, hemorrhaging, and telangiectasis were common symptoms of gill abnormalities".

Source :
Acclimation to Ammonia by Tilapia aurea

BARRY D. REDNER and ROBERT R. STICKNEY Department of Wildlife and Fisheries Sciences, Texas A&M University, College Station, Texas 77843
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
MonsterFishKeepers.com
Top Bottom