What is this?!? HITH?

[Kivstev]

Got a call from a friend a couple weeks ago. His GT had stopped eating and was sitting in the corner. Was told he had a bloated stomach. I told him to put the fish on magnesium sulfate and see what happens. That was ineffective. Then he noticed a small crater in the GT's forehead. I then told him the fish must have HITH and put the fish on Clout or metro. Well, after two weeks the fish wasn't getting any better and I went over there and found this:

[YT]yXcYoxC2RDs[/YT]

Video quality really sucks I know, but that's all he had. You can see a large crater like bloody wound in the middle of the forehead and a very bloated stomach. I told him to just euthanize as the fish was obviously suffering and had got progressively worse the last 48 hours.

My guess is that the fish developed a secondary infection from the hexamita infection. I've never really seen anything like it. There was only one deep crater in the head, and not many 'holes' like a bad case of HITH. Any guesses what this was? Scary ****. It looks like the infection rapidly ate away at the front of the fish's head.

 

[Chaz88]

It is hard to tell from the video but it is not what I typically have seen HITH look like. HITH generally has cleaner edges and generally a cleaner looking wound. It looks, to me, more like a wound that got infected or something a parasite might cause. With the stomach bloating I would also lean to parasites. With HITH head I have been more likely to see a sunken stomach than a bloated one. Hopefully some more people will chime in and help narrow the possibilities.

 

[Aquanero]

Water parameters? Include pH. Any other fish in the tank? Let's start there.

 

[Kivstev]

It is hard to tell from the video but it is not what I typically have seen HITH look like. HITH generally has cleaner edges and generally a cleaner looking wound. It looks, to me, more like a wound that got infected or something a parasite might cause. With the stomach bloating I would also lean to parasites. With HITH head I have been more likely to see a sunken stomach than a bloated one. Hopefully some more people will chime in and help narrow the possibilities.

Exactly. I've seen HITH and there aren't weren't any wounds like that. Just shallow craters. With this fish you could see right down into the flesh. Reminded me of the flesh eating bacteria I've seen on the news. I have read about HITH occurring with bloated stomachs.

Water parameters? Include pH. Any other fish in the tank? Let's start there.

I don't know what they were. The fish is dead now as far as I know. He said ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate were all good so I'll take him at his word. No other fish were in the tank. I'm just curious as to what this might have been in case I ever see it. Hope not! Here's a pic he sent over that shows it better. This was a few days ago. When I saw the fish the hole/sore was all red and deeper. In the pic it looks like a few distinct craters. When I saw the fish it was one large and deep wound. I find it hard to believe HITH could accelerate so quickly and turn into what I saw today.

 

[Aquanero]

With out being able to see what the cause was under a microscope my best guess judging from the open sore, would be aeromonas hydrophila.

 

[Kivstev]

With out being able to see what the cause was under a microscope my best guess judging from the open sore, would be aeromonas hydrophila.

After doing some reading up on this, it does seem likely with the rapid rate of infection and the bloated stomach is often a symptom. Have you successfully treated this with antibiotics? Thanks.

Edit: From a bit of research it seems oxytetracyline is most effective against this?

 

[Aquanero]

Aeromonas can be treated with Kanamycin in pH over 7.2, it can also be combined with Furan 2 for added effectiveness just as you would for columnaris. In lower pH triple sulfa & salt can be used topically ie non-systemic infections. However if the infection is systemic or in the case of aeromonas of the digestive tract and intestines neomycin is very effective if used as a food soak and ingested. Meth blue applied directly to the sore will also facilitate healing. If your friend would have come here sooner I think he could have saved this fish.

 

[Kivstev]

Aeromonas can be treated with Kanamycin in pH over 7.2, it can also be combined with Furan 2 for added effectiveness just as you would for columnaris. In lower pH triple sulfa & salt can be used topically ie non-systemic infections. However if the infection is systemic or in the case of aeromonas of the digestive tract and intestines neomycin is very effective if used as a food soak and ingested. Meth blue applied directly to the sore will also facilitate healing. If your friend would have come here sooner I think he could have saved this fish.

Thanks. I didn't think he had that bad of a problem as it sounded like a routine case of HITH. Maybe my fault for not asking for a video earlier.

The more research I have done on this, it seems that I don't see much literature recommending Kanamycin. Most lit recommends Kana and neomycin combo for pseudomonas. I see a lot of Koi experts recommending oxy-t. I have and old jar of oxy, but it has turned brown and I don't think it's good any longer - not to mention his fish is dead I assume. It does say on the label it is recommended for A Hydrophillia and they call it "Abdominal dropsy". Looking at the stomach bloat it does certainly fit that description/name. I've also read that this bacteria is abnormally resistant to many common antibiotics. In any case, some info in case this should turn up for anyone else. If you recall, I have an Oscar that had/has a similar malady and may need some of this info should it recur.

https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/AS/AS-461.pdf

http://www.nationalfishpharm.com/koi_pond.html

http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/aeromonads