Which cichlid do you prefer Stalsbergi or Gold Saum and why?
- Thread starter Cichlidfever
- Start date
I plan to put a pair of them in 120 gallon tank with dithers. I am hoping that a 120 gallon is enough room for them?
I wish I could add more cichlids, but listening to the comments and advice, I better not try to add other cichlids. I am leaning more towards the Stalsbergi, more so just for the rarity between the two, although I must admit, I am crazy about both Green Terrors
I wish I could add more cichlids, but listening to the comments and advice, I better not try to add other cichlids. I am leaning more towards the Stalsbergi, more so just for the rarity between the two, although I must admit, I am crazy about both Green Terrors
I love both species but the Stals have really nice colours shape and big funky lips. They are pretty aggressive though and the females when breeding... Hell they live up to their name of the "TRUE GREEN TERROR"
Heres my young pair with fry 5 weeks ago....
And a large male.. look at his colours!
Heres my young pair with fry 5 weeks ago....
And a large male.. look at his colours!
One thing I will say about Rivs is its not always easy to find a good specimen at shops. I've noticed lots of deformaties inconsistances in their quality over the years. I can only put this down to you years of inbreeding. Stals tend to be better quality as they've not been exploited as much by the Aquarium industry and usually tend to come as Wild caught or F1 or F2 specimens.
Nice video cyberman, it helped me to chose Stalsbergi, most comments/advice leaned towards Stalsberi. I hope that I can get my pair looking like the video. I am going to use dithers to. I am hoping a 120 gallon tank is not to small?
Actually, the "green terror" nickname started with the original rivulatus imported into the hobby in the 1970s, not stalsbergi. The confusion comes because the question of the day was which is the true rivulatus. Some at the time thought the Peru fish (stalsbergi) was rivulatus and some books and articles had photos of stalsbergi captioned as the true rivulatus. Of course, the Ecuador fish has been confirmed as rivulatus, hence the new name for the Peru fish, stalsbergi.
As for white and gold edged rivulatus: "These fish got the name "terror" for good reason, though. They were far too aggressive to pair up and spawn; even in a large tank, the males trashed any and all females paired with them, and the divider method did not work with them as it can for other large aggressive neotropical cichlids." (see following link) Meanwhile, in the early 80s a German article called stalsbergi the "green terror that isn't." This is another source of confusion, because at the time some thought stalsbergi was rivulatus, but in reality it's stalsbergi the article was calling the green terror that isn't, because it was known to be a very similar, but separate fish from the original green terrors, rivulatus. Good source for this history is the Wayne Leibel article here, I've seen two or three articles by him attempting to clear up this confusion.
If you've had wild rivulatus (I have), they're plenty aggressive, even at an inch or two.
I take a lot of these old articles with a large grain of salt... My opinion on these "SO CALLED" Scientists isn't that good. I mean Trimacs are clearly related to Salvini yet they're both in different groups! They can't make their mind up about (the currently named) Cribroheros robertsoni the was Cichlasoma robertsoni then Amphilophus robertsoni.... when clearly its a member of the Thorichthys group.... They're just totally thick!
By the way, have you actually kept both species to compare them? In my experience, Stals are far more aggressive. I've just had to remove my Trimacs and Festae from the 70gal after the Stals decided to breed. They are just mental!
Wow I didn't know all that, l will be getting a pair of Stalsbergi with T Barbs for dither in a 120 gallon tank. I am hoping it works. Generally I like to have more than one species in the tank however reading all the information provided I am afraid to try...
I really want this to work, I am hoping that 120 gallons is not to small. You all has shared some great information, thanks
I didn't know that they was that aggressive... what should I feed them, what should the temperature be? Would it be ok to feed them earth worms as a treat say once a month as I do with my other cichlids in my other tank?
I really want this to work, I am hoping that 120 gallons is not to small. You all has shared some great information, thanks
I didn't know that they was that aggressive... what should I feed them, what should the temperature be? Would it be ok to feed them earth worms as a treat say once a month as I do with my other cichlids in my other tank?
I've kept both species and what neutrino said is correct.
All stalsberg himself admits and explains all about the green terror confusion.
Rivulatus is the true green terror.
I also don't see how robertsoni should be in the thorichthys complex.
Apart from being social earth eaters they are like night and day.
All stalsberg himself admits and explains all about the green terror confusion.
Rivulatus is the true green terror.
I also don't see how robertsoni should be in the thorichthys complex.
Apart from being social earth eaters they are like night and day.
Not an old article, but regardless it explains the history, history I've been around long enough to see for myself-- I've had the books with pictures of stalsbergi captioned as rivulatus-- and it's also up to date on the current taxonomy of the two fish. As far as wild rivulatus vs. stalsbergi for aggression, that's not even the point. They're closely related fish and, like most cichlids, you'll likely get individuals that vary. The point of the article is the history of the fish and understanding which fish is which.
If you think you know more than scientists, there's not much to talk about here... but for the record modern science centers on the genetics, which has revealed a more complex diversity than previously understood and more than you can see with the eye. In terms of relationships between animals it's a fundamental and ongoing progression of knowledge. In effect, genetic analysis has given us a tool you might compare to the Hubble Telescope, we can see things we simply didn't see before. Not much use denying that they're there.
The fact is sometimes fish (and other animals) that look very similar can be genetically distant (not closely related) and sometimes fish (or other animals) that don't look as similar are genetically closer. I could cite other cichlid examples, but I won't bore you.
Taxonomy is very much a work in progress, as genetic relationships and other factors are sorted out with ongoing study. Pandas are a famous example. Giant pandas were once thought to actually be related to raccoons, despite their bear-like appearance. This was based on bones and teeth. But-- genetically, it turns out they're related to bears after all. Red pandas were once thought to be related to giant pandas and also related to raccoons. Most people still think this, but, again, genetics shows they're not closely related to raccoons and apparently belong in their own family. The simple fact is appearances can be deceptive.
I will say there have historically been things some hobbyists have suspected from their familiarity with certain fish that it took time for science to get around to studying and confirming. And scientists don't always agree. But hobbyists have gotten a lot wrong also. And one of them is thinking they know taxonomic relationships better than what the genetics reveal.
