Jardini tail?!?

[Cabinetman 1]

Happy holidays everyone! Well I am still trying to figure out why my Jardini goes through issues with his tail. I had a pretty good run when I had Tiger barbs in the tank with him but, no more tiger barbs and his tail is getting bad. In the past I have tried all the medications suggested with no solution. I think he bites at it. I plan on moving him to a larger tank after the holidays. Water quality has been good, he is 5 1/2 years old 17" long, eats 4-6 nightcrawlers a day. Also would appreciate advice on catching/moving an arowana this size to minimize risk of injury. Attached are pictures of his tail.

 

[thiswasgone]

Is this an empty tank (void of decoration & other tank mates)? In my experience of owning a arowanas (silvers & a jardini who grew to ~24") most of the time I found a split tail fin was either due to jumping and hitting tank lids or fighting with other fish.

From the looks of your photos it looks like the latter although the fin did "heal" it looks like a botched healing. I've heard of people clipping/cutting fins that have splits or injuries like that with successful recoveries and seemingly no issues. However, I have never had to do such a surgeries.

I recall seeing Joey from "The king of DIY" youtube channel do it in an older video along with other SE/Chinese Asian videos using asian arowana; perhaps you can use it as reference?

edit: this was the video I was referencing

 

[Cabinetman 1]

Thank you for your reply. He is alone in the tank, I have actually seen him spin around and bite his tail. I am hoping getting him in a larger aquarium with another fish he might leave it alone.

 

[thiswasgone]

Thank you for your reply. He is alone in the tank, I have actually seen him spin around and bite his tail. I am hoping getting him in a larger aquarium with another fish he might leave it alone.

If you don't mind me asking, what are the dimensions of the tank he is in?

I've only seen a similar type of self-destructive behavior in cichlids when they have parasites or some type of external infection.

Maybe someone like thebiggerthebetter might have some experience with this type of behavior?

 

[Cabinetman 1]

If you don't mind me asking, what are the dimensions of the tank he is in?

I've only seen a similar type of self-destructive behavior in cichlids when they have parasites or some type of external infection.

Maybe someone like thebiggerthebetter might have some experience with this type of behavior?

The tank is 24" deep X 22"ht X 60" long. That's the interior dimensions of the tank. I am moving him to a 240 ( 30" X 26" X 72" ) Like I said I have tried medication without any improvement other injuries he gets (smashing the lid going for worms or misc scraps always heal asap) I do 50% water changes every 5 days.

 

[thiswasgone]

The tank is 24" deep X 22"ht X 60" long. That's the interior dimensions of the tank. I am moving him to a 240 ( 30" X 26" X 72" ) Like I said I have tried medication without any improvement other injuries he gets (smashing the lid going for worms or misc scraps always heal asap) I do 50% water changes every 5 days.

I'm at a bit of a loss as well. Unfortunately i've never owned a tail self-biting fish that wasn't visibly sick and after searching online other people believe boredom and stress maybe the factors outside from illness. The only other potential issue outside from these 3 factors (stress, boredom, and illness) that I could find was constipation.

Since your water parameters should be good with such large WCs and the size of your tank seems adequate the only thing I can think of would be external influences. Perhaps something in it's environment is stressing it out? Or maybe it hasn't gotten use to the removal of the tiger barbs so it is still being highly territorial/aggressive especially as it turns and sees a fish's tail (fish are not self-recognizing as far as I now)?

Regardless I think a larger tank footprint and a change in environment will help significantly at diagnosing this issue. As for moving a fish this large in my experience I lower the tank's water level to 50% if multiple fish in the tank or, if it's a complete tank swap, to the tallest fish's body height/depth. Then I get in the tank with a large transparaent plastic bag (ideally one that can cover the front to back of the tank ). Pillow cases, koi socks net, or even a large tarp all work as well as the goal is to try to and scoop the fish up in one slow smooth motion with some water to prevent it from freaking out as much as possible.

Of course if that is alot of work for you I've also had success using my large rubber mesh net I use for trout fishing. Another method I've actually read about on here is using a tranquilizing fluid but it was for a large arapaima gigas and there are some risk associated with this method if you're not careful.

edit: If you use the net method you'll probably need to cover the top of the net as you raise the fish outside the water to prevent it from jumping out.

HTH

 

[Cabinetman 1]

I'm at a bit of a loss as well. Unfortunately i've never owned a tail self-biting fish that wasn't visibly sick and after searching online other people believe boredom and stress maybe the factors outside from illness. The only other potential issue outside from these 3 factors (stress, boredom, and illness) that I could find was constipation.

Since your water parameters should be good with such large WCs and the size of your tank seems adequate the only thing I can think of would be external influences. Perhaps something in it's environment is stressing it out? Or maybe it hasn't gotten use to the removal of the tiger barbs so it is still being highly territorial/aggressive especially as it turns and sees a fish's tail (fish are not self-recognizing as far as I now)?

Regardless I think a larger tank footprint and a change in environment will help significantly at diagnosing this issue. As for moving a fish this large in my experience I lower the tank's water level to 50% if multiple fish in the tank or, if it's a complete tank swap, to the tallest fish's body height/depth. Then I get in the tank with a large transparaent plastic bag (ideally one that can cover the front to back of the tank ). Pillow cases, koi socks net, or even a large tarp all work as well as the goal is to try to and scoop the fish up in one slow smooth motion with some water to prevent it from freaking out as much as possible.

Of course if that is alot of work for you I've also had success using my large rubber mesh net I use for trout fishing. Another method I've actually read about on here is using a tranquilizing fluid but it was for a large arapaima gigas and there are some risk associated with this method if you're not careful.

edit: If you use the net method you'll probably need to cover the top of the net as you raise the fish outside the water to prevent it from jumping out.

HTH

Thank you,
I really appreciate the help. I will say I never thought of constipation, but that could be some of what is going on. He has always had irritation at his anus. Sometimes of course it is much better than other days. Right now I feed him nightcrawlers. I could try and give him more of a variety but he usually will eat one thing and reject anything else. Any suggestions on foods to compliment his diet? Thanks again for all the advice!!

 

[thiswasgone]

Thank you,
I really appreciate the help. I will say I never thought of constipation, but that could be some of what is going on. He has always had irritation at his anus. Sometimes of course it is much better than other days. Right now I feed him nightcrawlers. I could try and give him more of a variety but he usually will eat one thing and reject anything else. Any suggestions on foods to compliment his diet? Thanks again for all the advice!!

I trained my jardini to eat NLS pellets (https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/threads/arowana-won’t-eat-northfin.755424/post-8517749) but this can be quite the process as I find NLS pellets to be fairly dense/hard for arowanas. So while it can be done, and while NLS pellets are much better in terms of ingredients used, you may want to look into Hikari food sticks. Hikari is still a reputable brand and while the ingredients listed are decent they are not the best of the best. Those are the two brands that i've used successfully in the past although there are many others like Northfin and Omega One that i've heard great things about.

Of course I wouldn't suggest you to stay loyal to any brand but do focus on the ingredients, the pellet's dried weight protein %, and the fillers used. You may want to look up RD. posts about fish food nutrition as they provide great in-depth breakdowns on how to parse through the BS on pet food ingredient labels.

Finally, remember the best food in the world means nothing if the fish won't eat it so you may want to test with smaller bags/containers first and see how receptive your jardini is to the pellets; unless you want to forcifully train the fish like me.

HTH

 

[Cabinetman 1]

Thank you, Happy New Year!

 

[thebiggerthebetter]

Happy New Year! I believe this is a first for me, I mean biting self in fish in general and I don't think I ever saw it with our fish. Bizarre and interesting. I've already learned from Thiswasgone's replies and hope to learn more.

I do wonder if the jar could be doing it out of hunger. For a 17" fish 4-5 nightcrawelers may be a bit too little, depending on the worm size. Also at 5.5 years, a jar should be solid 2ft, another clue supporting the underfeeding.

Not criticizing, only thinking together.