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[Caperguy99]

Alright, so I’m in the early stages of planning a 210-225 gallon Frontosa tank and I could use some guidance.

I’ve decided to go with a sump for filtration, and since I’m not a big DIYer that means I will need to buy a “reef ready” or pre-drilled tank.

I’m considering the following two tanks:

1.) Aqueon 210 “Reef Ready” with dual megaflow overflows.

2.) Seapora 225 “Reef Ready” with dual corner overflows.

Does anyone recommend one over the other?

I’m hoping to plumb them into a sump. Again, I’m not a DIYer, so I’m thinking of buying a Eshopps RS-300 or an AR-300 and stuffing it with bio media and maybe a planted refugium. Do you think these sumps, appropriately arranged, would be suitable for ~8 Frontosa in a ~210 gallon tank? If not, is there a larger sump for purchase you could recommend? Or would I be better with two FX-6?

As for the plumbing the sump, from what I read online it seems like using an overflow box and the “animal bean” style would be the safest and quietest - but is that method even possible with the two tanks I’ve suggested above? If not, is there a style you’d recommend that would work with those tanks and would ensure I don’t accidentally flood my basement or make it too noisy to sleep? The tank will be in a guest bedroom, so that’s important.

Finally, lighting. I know Frontosa are a deeper water fish, so probably don’t like a ton of light. I’m thinking maybe a single Kessil A360x Tuna Sun - but I’ve also mulled the idea of using the Tuna Blue. Even though that’s a saltwater light, it could look good on the Frontosa. Would you folks go with one over the other? Or have any other suggestions?

Thanks in advance

 

[Backfromthedead]

Hello, youve got a great plan, sounds like fun. The funny names--bean animal, durso, herbie...just confuse me so ill try to explain best i can to simplify it.

I believe both of those tanks are bottom drilled with 2x 1" drain bulkheads and 1x 3/4" return bulkhead for each overflow. I would use a "herbie" type setup for each of these overflows. I would cut one 1" standpipe so it was feeding a couple of inches under the teeth of the weir(main drain-full siphon with a ball valve leading to sump), and then cut another one right at the top of the weir teeth (emergency drain-open channel, no valve needed). I would use 3/4" barb fittings and vinyl hose for the return bulkhead.

I agree somewhat with this diagram, but i actually position the emergency inlet higher than pictured, so that theres only water trickling through it if the water level is too high. The author explains that their way makes it easier to fine-tune the flow, but i find that using dc pumps with controllers give you fine enough control to eliminate this problem.


This would result in you having 2x 1" full siphon drains leading to your sump, another 2x 1" emergency drains to your sump, and 2x 3/4" bulkheads to plumb your return pumps into. I would be looking for 2x return pumps rated for 1500-2000gph each or one pump around 3000-4000gph. You might be thinking these are too much, but i find that running larger pumps on lower power improves power efficiency, pump noise, and heat dissipation.

If set up correctly with quality dc pumps this can be a very quiet tank, you may just have to experiment with different plumbing configurations to get it silent, keep it running in that sweet spot. Always some experimentation when youre setting up the first sump. Best of luck, let us know how you progress.

 

[Caperguy99]

Hello, youve got a great plan, sounds like fun. The funny names--bean animal, durso, herbie...just confuse me so ill try to explain best i can to simplify it.

I believe both of those tanks are bottom drilled with 2x 1" drain bulkheads and 1x 3/4" return bulkhead for each overflow. I would use a "herbie" type setup for each of these overflows. I would cut one 1" standpipe so it was feeding a couple of inches under the teeth of the weir(main drain-full siphon with a ball valve leading to sump), and then cut another one right at the top of the weir teeth (emergency drain-open channel, no valve needed). I would use 3/4" barb fittings and vinyl hose for the return bulkhead.

I agree somewhat with this diagram, but i actually position the emergency inlet higher than pictured, so that theres only water trickling through it if the water level is too high. The author explains that their way makes it easier to fine-tune the flow, but i find that using dc pumps with controllers give you fine enough control to eliminate this problem.
View attachment 1534145

This would result in you having 2x 1" full siphon drains leading to your sump, another 2x 1" emergency drains to your sump, and 2x 3/4" bulkheads to plumb your return pumps into. I would be looking for 2x return pumps rated for 1500-2000gph each or one pump around 3000-4000gph. You might be thinking these are too much, but i find that running larger pumps on lower power improves power efficiency, pump noise, and heat dissipation.

If set up correctly with quality dc pumps this can be a very quiet tank, you may just have to experiment with different plumbing configurations to get it silent, keep it running in that sweet spot. Always some experimentation when youre setting up the first sump. Best of luck, let us know how you progress.

Thanks so much for the answer -

Do you think that either of the sumps that I listed would be big enough for the bioload of 6-8 Frontosa for life?

As for the pumps, I was thinking of two Sicce SDC 9.0 pumps. However, reading online I see that I have to match the flow rate of the pumps to the drain rate of the tank overflows - How do I go about doing this?

Do I just fill the tank and sump, turn on the pumps, then adjust the gate valves on the full siphons to make sure the water level looks good?

 

[BIG-G]

Do I just fill the tank and sump, turn on the pumps, then adjust the gate valves on the full siphons to make sure the water level looks good?

Yeah pretty much. Adjust the full siphon line so that there is the tiniest trickle of water going down the emergency drain. This will insure that the siphon line never sucks air and is quite. Or at least maintain the water level somewhere in between the two drains.
The other thing to remember is to cut the power and make sure that the sump can hold the entire volume that will drain back to it. This will ensure that it doesn’t overflow in the event of an outage.

 

[Backfromthedead]

Thanks so much for the answer -

Do you think that either of the sumps that I listed would be big enough for the bioload of 6-8 Frontosa for life?

As for the pumps, I was thinking of two Sicce SDC 9.0 pumps. However, reading online I see that I have to match the flow rate of the pumps to the drain rate of the tank overflows - How do I go about doing this?

Do I just fill the tank and sump, turn on the pumps, then adjust the gate valves on the full siphons to make sure the water level looks good?

I think those sumps look great, but admittedly have never used the prefab, partitioned sumps. My sumps are typically just empty tanks, the largest i can fit under the stand, rigged to hold whatever filtration and equipment im using.

I dont agree with the advice youve read about pumps. Its my opinion that you should get a pump thats more powerful than you will need, and then dial back the power to where you need it. Its no good to try to adjust your plumbing to match the pumps max flow, and again its better for the pumps reliability and noise if its not running full power all the time. Dont just get a pump rated for the plumbing you will inevitably end up buying a bigger one down the road. Two of those sicce 9.0 pumps you mentioned are more than adequate imo, they will probably only run at half power on your setup.

Most DC pumps will include an electronic controller for the flow, but otherwise you can install a valve on the return line to control the flow.

What i do when starting up a fresh rig:
1. Fill the tank up, fill sump to an acceptable level.
2. Adjust drain valves, for 1" plumbing i would start out with about 3/4 the way open.
3. Turn on pumps and adjust them to about half/50% power, let system run for a a few minutes.
4. If your overflow is sucking air, add more flow slowly until the noise tapers off. If your emergency drains are dumping water, then you have too much flow or the drains are not open wide enough--adjust them to your liking.

If you follow these steps enough you will find there is no one way to correctly do this, your setup will run in the way that you find works best. But imo the herbie type overflow is the easiest and most foolproof to set up for a quiet, reliable overflow.

 

[Caperguy99]

I think those sumps look great, but admittedly have never used the prefab, partitioned sumps. My sumps are typically just empty tanks, the largest i can fit under the stand, rigged to hold whatever filtration and equipment im using.

I dont agree with the advice youve read about pumps. Its my opinion that you should get a pump thats more powerful than you will need, and then dial back the power to where you need it. Its no good to try to adjust your plumbing to match the pumps max flow, and again its better for the pumps reliability and noise if its not running full power all the time. Dont just get a pump rated for the plumbing you will inevitably end up buying a bigger one down the road. Two of those sicce 9.0 pumps you mentioned are more than adequate imo, they will probably only run at half power on your setup.

Most DC pumps will include an electronic controller for the flow, but otherwise you can install a valve on the return line to control the flow.

What i do when starting up a fresh rig:
1. Fill the tank up, fill sump to an acceptable level.
2. Adjust drain valves, for 1" plumbing i would start out with about 3/4 the way open.
3. Turn on pumps and adjust them to about half/50% power, let system run for a a few minutes.
4. If your overflow is sucking air, add more flow slowly until the noise tapers off. If your emergency drains are dumping water, then you have too much flow or the drains are not open wide enough--adjust them to your liking.

If you follow these steps enough you will find there is no one way to correctly do this, your setup will run in the way that you find works best. But imo the herbie type overflow is the easiest and most foolproof to set up for a quiet, reliable overflow.

Thanks for the incredibly helpful guidance.

If the Sicce 9.0 will be a bit too powerful, is there another - perhaps cheaper - set of pumps that you’d recommend for this size setup?

 

[Backfromthedead]

Thanks for the incredibly helpful guidance.

If the Sicce 9.0 will be a bit too powerful, is there another - perhaps cheaper - set of pumps that you’d recommend for this size setup?

I use/have several Jebao dcp pumps for my tanks that are among my favorites. They are significantly cheaper than the old favorite brands like sicce, ecotech, current...but ime no less reliable or effective, and are relatively quiet.

I have 2x dcp-10000s on my 200g tank that have ran 60-90% power for around 5 years continuously with no issues. My tank has 1.5" drains, with your 1" drains you would not need that much power, i would say 2x of the dcp-6500 would work great.

 

[12 Volt Man]

For what its worth, Aqueon probably makes the better stronger tank. My LFS has had issues with Seapora tanks leaking, but it was nothing big like a 220g.. My Aqueon 150g is 14 years old and still going strong. its the same tank as the 210 only its 18 wide instead of 24 wide.

 

[Caperguy99]

For what its worth, Aqueon probably makes the better stronger tank. My LFS has had issues with Seapora tanks leaking, but it was nothing big like a 220g.View attachment 1534242. My Aqueon 150g is 14 years old and still going strong. its the same tank as the 210 only its 18 wide instead of 24 wide.

Wow what a great fish!

How are your overflows organized? Herbie style?

 

[12 Volt Man]

thank you! I don't have a sump. I have two Rena XP3 filters that are almost 18 years old (I had one of them before I got the 150g) and an Aquaclear 110 as filtration.