so if CITES is for endangered species...

[deeboi]

if they get removed from the endagered specie list, or are not endangered, will they become legal?

also i seen on a cites permit for "pet". this was a cites permit but 50bux to process. any one know more about these?

 

[calcnerd]

I assume you're talking about the asian aros?

I'm also curious about the CITES permits. Anyone have any info on obtaining them?

 

[scriving]

wait for oddball

 

[Oddball]

The main problem is that so long as a species is listed in CITES Appendix I and II, there's no way it'll be removed from the US Endangered Species Act.

As to filing for a CITES permit, what's the use? Those permits would only allow you to export a CITES species from the country of origin. Those permits are only applicable to licensed animal businesses. A CITES permit does not allow a species automatic entry into the US. For that, you'll have to deal with US Customs. To deal with them, you'll need an import license specific to animals similar to the ones you're trying to import. Said import license is only applicable to an established business.

If you're willing to go through all of that, you're still not completely in the clear. All it takes is for an inspecting agent to interpret the law as being against the type of species you're trying to import for that shipment to be impounded. And, IF it's later determined that the shipment should be allowed, you get to pay the normal import tariffs and can be charged for the holding costs incurred during the legality disposition determination. Of course, that's providing the shipment is still alive at the final disposition.

 

[busy_kt]

The main problem is that so long as a species is listed in CITES Appendix I and II, there's no way it'll be removed from the US Endangered Species Act.

As to filing for a CITES permit, what's the use? Those permits would only allow you to export a CITES species from the country of origin. Those permits are only applicable to licensed animal businesses. A CITES permit does not allow a species automatic entry into the US. For that, you'll have to deal with US Customs. To deal with them, you'll need an import license specific to animals similar to the ones you're trying to import. Said import license is only applicable to an established business.

If you're willing to go through all of that, you're still not completely in the clear. All it takes is for an inspecting agent to interpret the law as being against the type of species you're trying to import for that shipment to be impounded. And, IF it's later determined that the shipment should be allowed, you get to pay the normal import tariffs and can be charged for the holding costs incurred during the legality disposition determination. Of course, that's providing the shipment is still alive at the final disposition.

Could someone with said permit be able to cross the Canadian border with Aros?

 

[deeboi]

The main problem is that so long as a species is listed in CITES Appendix I and II, there's no way it'll be removed from the US Endangered Species Act.

As to filing for a CITES permit, what's the use? Those permits would only allow you to export a CITES species from the country of origin. Those permits are only applicable to licensed animal businesses. A CITES permit does not allow a species automatic entry into the US. For that, you'll have to deal with US Customs. To deal with them, you'll need an import license specific to animals similar to the ones you're trying to import. Said import license is only applicable to an established business.

If you're willing to go through all of that, you're still not completely in the clear. All it takes is for an inspecting agent to interpret the law as being against the type of species you're trying to import for that shipment to be impounded. And, IF it's later determined that the shipment should be allowed, you get to pay the normal import tariffs and can be charged for the holding costs incurred during the legality disposition determination. Of course, that's providing the shipment is still alive at the final disposition.

not the cites permit i came across online. it was a pdf format direct from the cites website. it was late and was tired of online reading and didn't save the link. i'm sure i can search for it again.

but what i read through on the application clearly stated the animal for pet perposes. and even had a section on "farm" date, even if you don't know when the animal is to be born. and what i read includes export/import also, so the applicant can keep their "pet"...

of course this is only heresay...sp..but i did see this clearly, and also i didnt' want to pay the processing fee. nver seen this, y i was asking here...



also, the point i was trying to get an answer for, is if they're farming these fishes so much in their native state/country, wouldn't this help to clear them of the "endangered" title, and then they won't be any more endangered, an endangered species?


and then again, there are loop holes, esp. with the proper certification. i've seen shows, where hunters were able to bring back their kill from another country back to the U.S. thru customs...so i know there can be exceptions...

 

[Oddball]

Could someone with said permit be able to cross the Canadian border with Aros?

Not possible since CITES clearance does not relieve the fact that the US Lacey Act and the US Endangered Species Act does not allow for the transport, sale, or possession of asian aros in the US and its territories.

 

[Oddball]

deeboi: If you're referring to CITES Form A1-1 (2005/11/15) this is for Canada only.

The US FWS application OMB No. 1018-0093 requires an approved CITES permit before submitting the application. Permits will only be considered for a business, agency, organization, or institution directly related to the activity requested in the application. The Division of Management Authority (DMA) will NOT accept 'doing business as' for individuals. It must be a business or organization directly related to the species to be imported AND have proper licensing and permits to operate said business.

 

[Oddball]

The biggest killer for private owners is the following:

G​

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]. JUSTIFICATION FOR REQUESTED ACTIVITY. ​

[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]

7. Provide a full statement justifying the permit including details of the activities, particularly the following (please use a separate sheet of paper):
a. Description of the purpose of your proposed activity. If your purpose is for scientific research, attach a copy of your research proposal which outlines the purpose, objectives, methods (e.g., specific information on survey/collection methods, sampling regime, equipment to be used), and whether similar work has already been done or is currently being done.
b. Description of the technical expertise of each person, as it relates to the proposed activities. If the proposed activity involves the import of live animals, include the experience of each animal caretaker working with the species.
c. Copies of contracts, agreements or other documents that identify persons involved and dates of activities for which authorization is being requested.​

d. A statement on how the activities will enhance or benefit the wild population (in-situ and ex-situ projects). If your activities include conservation education, provide copies of educational materials (e.g., handouts, text of signage or public presentations). Educational material must discuss the ecological role and conservation needs for the species involved in the proposed activity.
[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[ctoychik]

wow, really complicated to get asian aro for US MFKers .... i feel for ya.

difficult to get payara back home cos apparently it is banned in Thailand .... not forbidden to import from other countries though ...hmmmm