Why are these being sold????
- Thread starter Mitchell The Monster
- Start date
So we are back on the topic of bans? I grew up in an area of Canada/US where 60 yrs ago carp and koi had damaged the ecosystem to almost a point of no return. So parts of AU have deemed them noxious, again due to the morons of the world who feel it's ok to let aquarium fish go free into natural waterways. Bans are never going to be perfect, but it beats sticking ones head into the sand and pretending that there isn't a problem. Invasive species threaten wild ecosystems by outcompeting native fish and destroying natural habitat, what part of that don't people understand? No one wants the Govt to intervene, but what other option is available when people can't use common sense, and follow guidelines? Toss a 1K fine onto someone's ass and most folks start to think twice.
Theres two discussions on the topic of bans.
1) The discussion of fish that shouldnt be kept due to their size.
2) invasive species. I think most of us agree its necessary. Though
Ogertron3000
provided a pretty good example on why they are problematic.
Guy buys a koi in an area they are not banned all's good in the hood.... he moves to victoria and unknowingly is keeping a banned fish. Maybe theres legal consequences.
I think common sense can also be applied to understanding that two different conversations are taking place
1) The discussion of fish that shouldnt be kept due to their size.
2) invasive species. I think most of us agree its necessary. Though
Ogertron3000
provided a pretty good example on why they are problematic.Guy buys a koi in an area they are not banned all's good in the hood.... he moves to victoria and unknowingly is keeping a banned fish. Maybe theres legal consequences.
I think common sense can also be applied to understanding that two different conversations are taking place
I agree with the above, and will give a couple of examples (although not all aquarium related).
I grew up on the shores of Lke Michigan.
When I was a kid, there were smelt, sculpin, bass, walleye and many other species in the near shore areas.
Now, just about the only thing you find are Asian Gobies, and zebra/Quagga mussels, probably from the bilge of international ships.
The perch fishing industry that was once booming, has totally collapsed, and the lake is heading toward a mono-culture system, at least near shore.
Another example
In the 1960s a Dr wanted a pond on the shore of Lake Gatun Panama, near where I live now, with Peacock bass.
During the rainy season those 6 P-bass (of course) escaped, now.....
most of the endemic cichlids are gone from the lake, eaten by the P-bass.
All it takes are a couple to ruin the entire system.
I grew up on the shores of Lke Michigan.
When I was a kid, there were smelt, sculpin, bass, walleye and many other species in the near shore areas.
Now, just about the only thing you find are Asian Gobies, and zebra/Quagga mussels, probably from the bilge of international ships.
The perch fishing industry that was once booming, has totally collapsed, and the lake is heading toward a mono-culture system, at least near shore.
Another example
In the 1960s a Dr wanted a pond on the shore of Lake Gatun Panama, near where I live now, with Peacock bass.
During the rainy season those 6 P-bass (of course) escaped, now.....
most of the endemic cichlids are gone from the lake, eaten by the P-bass.
All it takes are a couple to ruin the entire system.
I think everyone is in agreement on invasive species but where some of us disagree is on labeling something unacceptable because it gets to large or isnt cared for properly.
Thats a shame what the p-bass caused btw
The AU example was regarding species deemed noxious, and they are indeed a noxious species of fish. That's just a reality. People who live in AU generally understand what's legal, what's not, and more importantly why (at least in certain areas of the country) it's so important that the rules be followed to a T. If someone doesn't take the time to educate themselves, and catches a fine, I have zero sympathy for them.
So no, IMO the carp/koi ban in AU is not a perfect example of bans gone wrong. It's a perfect example of why govt agencies have had to step in and create more legislation, red tape, and outright bans in certain states.
So no, IMO the carp/koi ban in AU is not a perfect example of bans gone wrong. It's a perfect example of why govt agencies have had to step in and create more legislation, red tape, and outright bans in certain states.
I believe that
Zoodiver
once stated that in his opinion an adult Arapaima requires a minimum of 15,000 gallons. His pima grew to 6ft in the first two years.
L Luc70 definitely had it going on in his 20 ft x 10 ft, and 4-5 ft deep pond. https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/threads/arapaima-question.569956/
The build here: https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/threads/arapaima-pond-build.455084/page-18
But not a ton of people out there that have that kind of set up to house an adult Arapaima.
Zoodiver
once stated that in his opinion an adult Arapaima requires a minimum of 15,000 gallons. His pima grew to 6ft in the first two years.L Luc70 definitely had it going on in his 20 ft x 10 ft, and 4-5 ft deep pond. https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/threads/arapaima-question.569956/
The build here: https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/threads/arapaima-pond-build.455084/page-18
But not a ton of people out there that have that kind of set up to house an adult Arapaima.
Probably less than 1%of people in the hobby .
I think that 1% should be able to order such fish from source. I don't think such fish should be mass sold in lfs. If bans reduce cruelty and save ecosystems, I'm not selfish enough to not be all for it.
Bring onthe bans, I can keep something else.
