Is this frowned upon?….

[RD.]

The offspring will be aquarium strain Vieja Melanura. Not frowned upon in general, but would be by certain folks if they are wanting to keep geographical strains pure. When I was breeding fish, I fell into the latter camp and would have had no interest in the offspring of a mix such as this as breeding specimens.

 

[markstrimaran]

Some where in the right ecosystem he would thrive, hatched from an egg in Iowa. Once upon a time they were all the same species. I am more curious about just how many varieties can be bred.

 

[Kevin@TUIC]

The one from me would be Vieja melanura 'var. synpila' and would be the the more red/blue colored species as it gets mature and most 'like' the Belize fish. The one from my buddy Ryan at global is the melanura likely from Guatemalan stock(at a least at one point was) which is the more orange fish. 2019, all of 2020, and up until the summer of this year I had both populations on hand. The Peten fish (Guatemala) is currently the more well distributed fish available from farms both domestic and internationally in Europe and Asia. It has also been available from myself at TUIC, Max from MaxCichlids, and cota. All 3 of which have sent these to farms and breeders all over the globe.

Below are some photos. 1st and 2nd is the original Belize melanura which was always distributed as 'synspilum - Belize'. The original Belize fish had a more streamlined body. Todays 'Belize' fish seem a bit stockier. The Fish in the photo is from the late 90s and was one of the very first of the Belize 'synspilum'. Myself and Mo Devlin bred that population and they were distributed by TUIC for many, many years. The 3rd photo is todays most common melanura 'var. synspila' and is the current stock that I distribute under that description. That particular population is long time captive bred and the original location is long forgotten. it is a stockier bodied fish and is very well distributed in the hobby. Lastly, is the original Lago Peten melanura, aka the true melanura. That exact pair was imported by TUIC in 2006(ish). They are in breeding color in the 1st photo. I bred that population for nearly 16 years. That is the same fish Jeff Rapps, myself, Max, cota and even Rusty Wessel(privately) have distributed for many years under the Lago Peten description.
While genetically they are all the same fish, the melanura species has a very wide range and each population varies. Often very significantly for one body of water to the very next.

original Belize fish from late 90s:



Todays common 'synspila':


The original Lago Peten Guatemala fish:

 

[dogofwar]

The Belize variant of V. melanura has been in the hobby since at least the late 80s. A fish store I worked in circa 1988 had a group of 5-6 of them in an 8' 300g behind the cash register. We raised some fry from time to time for the people who saw the big ones and wanted some but I don't ever remember seeing juvies available back then.

I think the Lago Peten variant came from a collecting trip made by Eric Hanneman (and probably Rusty) in like 2010.

 

[Kevin@TUIC]

certainly possible from the late 80s. they certainly weren't commonly available thats for sure. my adult photos is from the mid-late 90s. so for sure its possible.
I have photos, and videos from 2007 from lake peten melanura already spawning @ 6-8". they most certainly could have been reintroduced in 2010ish.

 

[dogofwar]

Maybe an earlier trip by Rusty and others for the 2007 fish?

certainly possible from the late 80s. they certainly weren't commonly available thats for sure. my adult photos is from the mid-late 90s. so for sure its possible.
I have photos, and videos from 2007 from lake peten melanura already spawning @ 6-8". they most certainly could have been reintroduced in 2010ish.

 

[newworld]

not to get into if they are the same species but i can say the peten fish i collected were mostly uniform fish when i collected in belize the coloration varied greatly as did meeki collected in the same water (literally) as matt said the “belize” fish has been in the hobby way earlier then the early 2000s… as well as the peten fish

 

[Man-made Monsters]

The one from me would be Vieja melanura 'var. synpila' and would be the the more red/blue colored species as it gets mature and most 'like' the Belize fish. The one from my buddy Ryan at global is the melanura likely from Guatemalan stock(at a least at one point was) which is the more orange fish. 2019, all of 2020, and up until the summer of this year I had both populations on hand. The Peten fish (Guatemala) is currently the more well distributed fish available from farms both domestic and internationally in Europe and Asia. It has also been available from myself at TUIC, Max from MaxCichlids, and cota. All 3 of which have sent these to farms and breeders all over the globe.

Below are some photos. 1st and 2nd is the original Belize melanura which was always distributed as 'synspilum - Belize'. The original Belize fish had a more streamlined body. Todays 'Belize' fish seem a bit stockier. The Fish in the photo is from the late 90s and was one of the very first of the Belize 'synspilum'. Myself and Mo Devlin bred that population and they were distributed by TUIC for many, many years. The 3rd photo is todays most common melanura 'var. synspila' and is the current stock that I distribute under that description. That particular population is long time captive bred and the original location is long forgotten. it is a stockier bodied fish and is very well distributed in the hobby. Lastly, is the original Lago Peten melanura, aka the true melanura. That exact pair was imported by TUIC in 2006(ish). They are in breeding color in the 1st photo. I bred that population for nearly 16 years. That is the same fish Jeff Rapps, myself, Max, cota and even Rusty Wessel(privately) have distributed for many years under the Lago Peten description.
While genetically they are all the same fish, the melanura species has a very wide range and each population varies. Often very significantly for one body of water to the very next.

original Belize fish from late 90s:
View attachment 1477074
View attachment 1477080

Todays common 'synspila':
View attachment 1477082

The original Lago Peten Guatemala fish:
View attachment 1477078
View attachment 1477079

Thanks for the info Kevin.

 

[Man-made Monsters]

They spawned on Saturday. The eggs just started hatching tonight. So far mom and dad are doing great taking turns guarding the wrigglers.