I currently have a coarse pre filter on a canister and am wondering if there’s really benefit to it. Is it worse for the detritus to go into the canister?
Pre Filter
- Thread starter Silvertongue700
- Start date
The more solid waste matter, coarse or fine, that you can trap in a prefilter, the less you have entering and becoming trapped inside the canister where it will undergo bacterial action and eventually create nitrates. This presupposes that you clean the prefilter often; the more often you do, the more waste products are removed from the tank before they contribute to nitrate accumulation.
This is the single biggest problem with canisters, IMHO. Using a prefilter and keeping it clean is the easiest way to mitigate it.
This is the single biggest problem with canisters, IMHO. Using a prefilter and keeping it clean is the easiest way to mitigate it.
Agreed. Sumps are the only filtration I’ll use as I get bigger tanks. Do you prefer filter socks or another method with sumps? The socks to me make a lot of sense.
I don't use socks; the initial filtration stage in my sumps is one or more sheets of Poret foam, ideally a coarse one first, backed up with a finer one. These are set up to be very easily accessed. I swap out clean ones for the dirty ones, then rinse the dirty ones thoroughly until the water runs clean; takes minutes. When I am home, I typically do this every day. These function strictly as mechanical filtration, not bio.
This first stage of filtration takes place in a bucket or pan that is at least a few inches taller than the top of the foam. I have a series of holes drilled around the periphery of the bucket just below the top. If for some reason (i.e. absence from home, in my case for up to three weeks at a time) I cannot do the swap/clean daily, the pads will slowly clog, slowing the water penetration and eventually causing water to build up above the pads in the bucket. When this happens, it builds up a certain amount of "head pressure" that helps force the water through. In most of my tanks (not heavily stocked, moderately fed, usually planted) a three week absence will have the water an inch or more deep over the pads, but never to the point where it flows through the emergency holes near the top.
I've used this system for years. All of my larger tanks for many years now have been sump-filtered like this; smaller tanks are almost always simply filtered with large sponges or mattenfilters, usually air-operated. The small ones are much more troublesome and time-consuming than the large ones, due to the lack of pre-filtration...but still far more efficient and less troublesome than any canister in existence, IMHO.
This first stage of filtration takes place in a bucket or pan that is at least a few inches taller than the top of the foam. I have a series of holes drilled around the periphery of the bucket just below the top. If for some reason (i.e. absence from home, in my case for up to three weeks at a time) I cannot do the swap/clean daily, the pads will slowly clog, slowing the water penetration and eventually causing water to build up above the pads in the bucket. When this happens, it builds up a certain amount of "head pressure" that helps force the water through. In most of my tanks (not heavily stocked, moderately fed, usually planted) a three week absence will have the water an inch or more deep over the pads, but never to the point where it flows through the emergency holes near the top.
I've used this system for years. All of my larger tanks for many years now have been sump-filtered like this; smaller tanks are almost always simply filtered with large sponges or mattenfilters, usually air-operated. The small ones are much more troublesome and time-consuming than the large ones, due to the lack of pre-filtration...but still far more efficient and less troublesome than any canister in existence, IMHO.
Anything that gets trapped in the canister, is still in your filter, so its still in the tank.
And although many aquarists think getting turds out of sight makes for a better, healthier system, in reality that sort filtering out of the visible is just for aethsetics.
The real unhealthy stuff for the system (once its cycled) is invisible, chemical pollutants like nitrates, growth inhibiting hormones, and other metabolites.
If you rinse your pre filter frequently , perhaps...every other day, or depending on fish/bio load (size, stocking) every day, to remove nitrate precursors from the closed system, that's accomplishing something.
Storing crap for any length of time in the filter is akin to sweeping dog do under a rug, and believing it won't stink.
And although many aquarists think getting turds out of sight makes for a better, healthier system, in reality that sort filtering out of the visible is just for aethsetics.
The real unhealthy stuff for the system (once its cycled) is invisible, chemical pollutants like nitrates, growth inhibiting hormones, and other metabolites.
If you rinse your pre filter frequently , perhaps...every other day, or depending on fish/bio load (size, stocking) every day, to remove nitrate precursors from the closed system, that's accomplishing something.
Storing crap for any length of time in the filter is akin to sweeping dog do under a rug, and believing it won't stink.
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Very true, and it's why I will never go back to canister filters again. I had and used several back in the '80's, the original Fluval series and also a couple of Eheims. The marketing back then was always trumpeting about the extended cleaning intervals, how long you could get away without touching your filter, etc. I was astonished; they made filters which were difficult, awkward and time-consuming to clean...and then spun that into a supposed benefit, telling you that you didn't need to clean them very often! I think that was when I first heard and grew to detest the term "spin doctor".
I haven't looked at one in many years. I wonder if someone who uses them currently can answer this: do they still go on and on about how long you can go between cleanings? Or, in this modern, more-enlightened age (at least, that's what I'm told we are in...) do they now shut up about that, and maybe work on making them less of a PITA to clean?
It certainly seems as though all the "cool kids" seem to think that merely mentioning that they use an FX6 removes any possibility that their tank has water problems. Hey, any filter that sounds like it's named after a jet fighter or starship just has to be the best...doesn't it?
Same for me, I stopped using them in the 80s, finding them not user friendly to maintain properly , and if cleaned frequent enough at a level where they didn't become nitrate spewers, they'd quickly fall apart.
I now have 2, unused, that came with the last 2 used tanks I bought, and are both only goodl to me win use as door stops.
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jjohnwm
duanes
I was originally thinking I'd setup a 210 with a sump as it's already drilled for it with an overflow, however I am now thinking of making the 210 itself a sump for a much larger plywood tank. Is a sump this big overkill and not necessary? Any reasons why this big of a sump would be good and useful? Other question I have is whether having fish in the sump as well is a bad idea?
In my 125 gal sump at the moment, I keep shrimp ( I have at times kept fry, using it as a grow out ).
The shrimp in my sump help break down stuff for use by the plants in the sump.
My idea of a sump/refugium, may be different than many other aquarists..
Once a tank is cycled, the most important factor I expect from filtration, is (along with water changes) the reduction of nitrate, which normal filtration does not deal with.
This is why I heavily plant sumps, and use shrimp to break down metabolites.(below).
I use the almost full 125 gal sump below, as a sump on my 180 gal tank
I find normal filtration (such as in canisters, or wimpy, standard sumps, etc) fall short from what I expect to get, from my own sump filtration.
This is my personal take on ieffective filtration, many might disagree, and suppose my take is overkill. But if you ask me, this is how I do it.
The shrimp in my sump help break down stuff for use by the plants in the sump.
My idea of a sump/refugium, may be different than many other aquarists..
Once a tank is cycled, the most important factor I expect from filtration, is (along with water changes) the reduction of nitrate, which normal filtration does not deal with.
This is why I heavily plant sumps, and use shrimp to break down metabolites.(below).
I use the almost full 125 gal sump below, as a sump on my 180 gal tank
I find normal filtration (such as in canisters, or wimpy, standard sumps, etc) fall short from what I expect to get, from my own sump filtration.
This is my personal take on ieffective filtration, many might disagree, and suppose my take is overkill. But if you ask me, this is how I do it.
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Were you able to do the same in the states? I'm fascinated by your approach, I'm just not sure how to replicate it on a much smaller scale. Also does your ability to have everything outside and basically regulated for you, other than water changes, one of the major reasons you're able to do this on such a large scale. Thanks
Sry if I over simplified your process, I've saw your posts all over, and just figured out how to word my question