Lesson to self: No more fish from 'specially cultivated water with special ingredients"

[FINWIN]

Okay, I've had it...went back to the FS with my receipt and frozen gold spot plec. Saw a nice eclipse catfish and decided to get one along with chancing another gold spot (this one bigger than the last). Lets just say I had another 'entertaining' discussion with the manager who burst from the back seeking a confrontation. He got one.

So moving forward I brought the two new entries home, one new gold spot at half price. I told the sane people at the store I planned to acclimate the fish with tank water and try a different approach. They said that was a good idea. Got home, put the eclipse and gold spot in a large bucket with airstones. Put a couple of capfuls of tank water and mixed it in the bucket. So far so good. Got dinner. Came back to feed other fish. Eclipse is acting spastic and crazy, gasping for air. Pleco turned on one side, stiff. I'm like WTF. So I'm waving the airstones around under the eclipse to help it breathe. Worked for awhile then it did belly rolls, opened its mouth wide and never closed it again. After hearing all the ph speeches I tried a desperation move. Made a solution of lemon juice and declorinated water. It worked for the plec, he rolled rightside up and was ok. The eclipse was still 'off'. So I watched for another ten minutes, massaging and moving water over the gills and then...gone. Just like that. So I'm down an eclipse and pissed. They can't say I screwed up the water, it was the same damn water they came in. The pleco is still alive. I had a small piece of wood I put in, the tannins should help as well. Fingers crossed the gold spot lasts.

I don't know what kind of green soup they use but this is ridiculous that some of their fish are extremely sensitive like this. Do they import amazon river water? What are you supposed to do when there's no opportunity to acclimate?? And no, there will be no returning the eclipse anyway. Manager bellowed "This is the last time we're doing this!" (half off for a dead fish) I told him FINE. I also informed him I do research and found out gold spots are very delicate when young, and that the information is available to find, and that it had nothing to do with him! He started about a ph speech again telling me "you can't just put them in a tank". I cut him off saying the other gold spot was in quarantine, not a tank. And why have all the other "low ph fish" thrived and that one went belly up? He wanted to squabble about the store credit I requested saying I wanted a guarantee. Told him I wasn't wasting time playing on words and never said anything about a guarantee. Before I left I told him nobody is too old to learn something. Crickets.

Even one of the employees said they always fall back on the "ph" excuse.

Manager is not liked in his own establishment and supposedly one person isn't even getting paid. When employees openly criticize you on the floor something is wrong. After meeting this guy I can believe it. So I'll get my fish online or at the regular big box Pet Stores...can't come out any worse than this. Better than wasting gas and driving 30-40 minutes to argue with some shrivelled up turd.

(One of the employees informed me the manager truly believes women are stupid) That's cool with me, a lot of men are stupid too. Equal opportunity, you dig?

 

[Fishflyer]

***Jeepers Creepers***--I am very sorry you had a rotten experience. It is supposed to be a satisfying, even at times fun experience. I look forward to going to fish store. And most of the time it is a good experience, but every once in awhile someone new (or not new) pulls some kind of superior attitude. Thankfully there are also some sweethearts that work at (our) fish store(s) that save the day.

Could be you got some some sick stock either unbeknownst or known by your fish store staff. If they had scruples they would put a sign on the tank of the fish. "Not for sale at this time."
If they are delicate, young and wild caught--difficulty matching their tope exact. You did a slow acclimation, and some emergency triage.
Did they give you large enough bags? Did they put the fish in one bag? Could be they weren't doing water changes often enough and you went home with fouled water. Maybe you do this too, but if my journey from fish store from when first fish went in bag to when I open the bag is more than hour, or the fish is large in proportion to bag, I open the bag and bring in oxygen--you probably do too.

>> And from corresponding with you, I would say you are extremely NOT a stupid woman. I do not even care for that "s" word.

As to water quality of the fish store-- very possible something is up with their water. Our fish store does not have a universal water system that services all tanks. Each of their many tanks has to serviced by staff, so if they are busy or short staffed water changes get interrupted or not done. There are advantages and disadvantages to both types of fish store water systems. So some of the tanks at my fish store get grunged, but 97% percent of the time I had good survival rate with fish at this store over many years. Our fish store does have a fast turn over of employees.

It is possible that the tank the fish came from, and/or the fish in that tank had an infection.

Good the Pleco still alive.

***** Nice work Nurse Nightingale!*****

Poor thing, had to do emergency care on two patients at once!

As for on line fish stores--I am going to check out Arizona Aquatic Gardens as soon as winter is through and spring is well under way here in the North. They guarantee their fish beyond the arrival date I think. They have been around since 1987, have a wide variety of fishand competitive prices. The big box stores--you probably know guareentee fish beyond the purchase. Petsmart 2 weeks I think, and I will have to check out Petcos guarantee. I will check out what is in your area and what their guarantees are and let you know tomorrow my friend.
It is not your fault that fish store owner/manager was being a horses' rear.
At least you got to fire back at him.

 

[Fishflyer]

Oh and congratulations on your graduation/elevation from Candiru to Fire Eel--left me in the dust--tail light guarantee.

 

[Fishflyer]

Sometimes it can be dicey. Do you get them out of their bagged urinated water ASAP with a relatively fast acclimation or do a slow drip or slow drizzle acclimation. Depends also on difference in PH. Slower acclimation if greater PH difference.

I would ask for a large bag at fish store, or bring your own along. Any fish store has to have large fish bags to accommodate larger fish. That way you can get more of the fish store water (hopefully starting out with decent water parameters) in the bag so you can do a slower acclimation for delicate fish.

 

[duanes]

I checked the Washington DC water quality report, for average parameters coming from the tap.
pH 7.6 (slightly above neutral)
Alkalinity 61 (good buffering capacity)
Hardness 7 grains (medium)
Chlorine average 1.2 ppm (highest 3ppm)
nitrate 2ppm

Neither fish you bought need specialty water conditions
gold nugget Plecos pH 6.5-7.5
sun cat pH 6.2 - 7.6

What is the pH of your tank?
What is the nitrate of your tank water in ppm?
Sun cats can reach 18", so I hope a 300 gal tank is in your future plans.

 

[Fishflyer]

Good information. I am wondering if Finwin should compare her tap water with those parameters. Age and condition of plumbing can affect these values.

 

[Gourami Swami]

I checked the Washington DC water quality report, for average parameters coming from the tap.
pH 7.6 (slightly above neutral)
Alkalinity 61 (good buffering capacity)
Hardness 7 grains (medium)
Chlorine average 1.2 ppm (highest 3ppm)
nitrate 2ppm

Neither fish you bought need specialty water conditions
gold nugget Plecos pH 6.5-7.5
sun cat pH 6.2 - 7.6

What is the pH of your tank?
What is the nitrate of your tank water in ppm?
Sun cats can reach 18", so I hope a 300 gal tank is in your future plans.

As a dc resident I can confirm this is about what my water comes out of the sink at
FINWIN I'd be interested to hear what store this is. If you don't want to post it on the open forum send me a PM. I have not been very impressed with any of the stores in the DC area

 

[Fishflyer]

Petsmart has 14 day refund policy. Petco has a 30 day refund policy. Not on life fish.
3 Petcos in D.C. area. Quite a number of Petsmarts.
Petco and Petsmart were on the 10 Best Tropical Fish Stores List in the D.C. area.

 

[FINWIN]

I checked the Washington DC water quality report, for average parameters coming from the tap.
pH 7.6 (slightly above neutral)
Alkalinity 61 (good buffering capacity)
Hardness 7 grains (medium)
Chlorine average 1.2 ppm (highest 3ppm)
nitrate 2ppm

Neither fish you bought need specialty water conditions
gold nugget Plecos pH 6.5-7.5
sun cat pH 6.2 - 7.6

What is the pH of your tank?
What is the nitrate of your tank water in ppm?
Sun cats can reach 18", so I hope a 300 gal tank is in your future plans.

By the time I finished my post last night the pleco went belly up, too. So here's the rundown from this store:

3 jumbo parrot cichlids - doing extremely well
1 baby oscar - died from ick medication
1 baby oscar - growing crazy, from 2 to now 7 inches in 2 months. extremely well.
1 green severum - in quarantine, doing well ( 1 week)
1 syno catfish - in quarantine, doing well ( 1 week)
1 gold spot pleco a week ago - belly up in 2 days
1 gold spot pleco yesterday - belly up in 2 hours
1 eclipse catfish - belly up in 1 hour

I told the manager the water in DC is 7.6. He seems to be of mind that all fish need a ph of 6.0 range, regardless (at least from his store). As I mentioned, an employee said that's the excuse for everything, ph. First thing the manager accused me of was not having the right water for ph. I get the impression there's considerable deaths due to water chemistry change. In fact someone on YELP made this comment to beware.

I should note the tank that had the gold spots contained probably 100 to 150 of the little buggers. This week maybe 50 or so. Am I to believe they sold that many gold spots in a week?

The two fish that died were in the store water placed in a bucket with airstones. Since their water is so precious I didn't feel the need to test it...only put two capfuls of tank water (7.6) in there. It was from the big tank. I had just done an 80% w/c earlier and major clean.

And trust me, I had checked the ph range for both fish. But arrogant old men often don't listen to anything.

Ph at my door is 7.6 - 7.8
nitrite 0
nitrate 0

I only went there for the fish anyway. But its too much of a crapshoot and I'm done. There's a good Petsmart in my area with intelligent employees that know fish. I'll look there.

Funny thing, on the Eclipse catfish size. I thought they got to 18" too, but a person said no, about a foot...they'd never seen or heard of one that big. Just sayin'.

Gourami Swami I'll PM the info. Also check out comments on YELP when you get it and other comments too on search.

 

[Fishflyer]

Really sorry to hear about the loss of your Pleco too. It is not only the loss of the money, but the loss of a pet that enjoyed for years to come.

Here too in my area of the other Washington, we have a Petsmart where there is usually one employee on duty who has studied all the fish in their care. One knowledged lady and one knowledged gentleman there have both been in Petsmart's employee for a quite a number of years. They are polite, professional but also personable.