1000 Gal Pond Questions

[wednesday13]

I have to disagree... 8 channels, 1 rtc and 1 tsn will be more than fine in a 8'-12' pool/pond... Ive kept 20-30 18"-36" fish in a 12' and 10' intex for yrs no problem. i ran 2 55gal drums as filters... 1 full of bio balls and the other full of filter socks. all u need. 2 many fish police these days... do what u want/like and enjoy it.

 

[CichlidKeeper01]

I think I might try it, going to see how the water quality holds up. My channels can always be moved.

 

[moe214]

I’d agree with Wednesday you can do it however, will they be comfortable I don’t know.. he got more experience than I with the large set ups, I think you can do the rtcand tsn and a few channels. But 8 is a lot imo. I’d say go for it. And if you feel anyone is uncomfortable remove a few of the channels and see if that helps. As far as filtration you can always increase that to deal with bioload. Only real thing to think about is their comfort imo.

 

[taksan]

This all depends on the size of the channels actually... even my 4500 pond is still dependent on WC’s when it had only 2 RTC’s once they got really big. The best advice I ever had in stocking big fish came from a guy in Singapore who had literally everything and he said if you work on 20 gallons per pound of large fish it seems to be the sweet spot. It’s all about the water ... you could keep everything in 1000 if you had a drip or did big WC’s.

 

[taksan]

This guy is good for the big fish pond stuff ...

 

[amazonfishman]

We are going to get a 1000 gal pond or a 1250 gal pond for our group of channel cats. With this size of a pond, I was thinking about adding more of a stock then 8 channel cats. I was thinking a RTC but was wondering if I could also keep a Tiger shovelnose as well. If the stock was kept at an RTC, a Tiger shovelnose, and my group of 8 channels would it be over stocked? Also was planning to filter this thing with canisters, but was wondering how people normally oxygenate and heat these ponds?

As said you'll need some sort of custom pond filter not your off the shelf canister to get the job done properly. The trashcan ideas work great from what I've seen. Depending on how you setup the filter it will probably create enough oxygen on it's own just running with the return dumping in above the water line or when it comes into the filter container and when it returns to the pond. You could setup an additional large air stone if needed just like a normal aquarium setup but I think that would be unnecessary honestly.

As far as heat goes you'll need 2 large heaters for safety if you're keeping it in a garage in NC I'd think, and will need some sort of pond cover to minimize heat loss/evaporation. Is the garage underground like basement style or normal exposed with less insulation? I'd run two 1000w titanium heaters in case one craps out you'll have some time to find a replacement without losing all heat. You'll also have to find a way to mount them in the filter or the pond without direct contact to the liner if you're using an Intex pool because it will melt. Ideally place them in the filter somehow or in a pipe if you put them in the main pond. When I was running the 1000w titaniums they had a nice digital temp readout/control panel which you could mount to keep an eye on temp easier. You need to maintain a minimum temperature above 72 degrees for the SA cats to be happy.

As far as the stock goes, how big are the current Channel Cats? How big is the RTC you're planning to stock? How big is the TSN you're planning to stock? The growth on the RTC will be the single biggest problem for several reasons, it will outpace the Channels probably 3:1 which means they could become a meal in a few months and it will get very big fast which means more bioload on the pond. A 2" RTC could cross the 2ft mark in under a year fairly easily with heavy feeding. Same thing on the TSN but it won't be a threat to the Channels as far as eating them unless it was say 3ft and they were still under 18". A 2ft RTC could absolutely eat a 12" Channel.

 

[CichlidKeeper01]

I’d agree with Wednesday you can do it however, will they be comfortable I don’t know.. he got more experience than I with the large set ups, I think you can do the rtcand tsn and a few channels. But 8 is a lot imo. I’d say go for it. And if you feel anyone is uncomfortable remove a few of the channels and see if that helps. As far as filtration you can always increase that to deal with bioload. Only real thing to think about is their comfort imo.

Turns out I have only seven, I know thats not that big of a change. The main reason I started this thread was to help figure out if the fish would be comfortable. I had read several conflicting sources on tank sizes needed for RTCs

 

[CichlidKeeper01]

As said you'll need some sort of custom pond filter not your off the shelf canister to get the job done properly. The trashcan ideas work great from what I've seen. Depending on how you setup the filter it will probably create enough oxygen on it's own just running with the return dumping in above the water line or when it comes into the filter container and when it returns to the pond. You could setup an additional large air stone if needed just like a normal aquarium setup but I think that would be unnecessary honestly.

As far as heat goes you'll need 2 large heaters for safety if you're keeping it in a garage in NC I'd think, and will need some sort of pond cover to minimize heat loss/evaporation. Is the garage underground like basement style or normal exposed with less insulation? I'd run two 1000w titanium heaters in case one craps out you'll have some time to find a replacement without losing all heat. You'll also have to find a way to mount them in the filter or the pond without direct contact to the liner if you're using an Intex pool because it will melt. Ideally place them in the filter somehow or in a pipe if you put them in the main pond. When I was running the 1000w titaniums they had a nice digital temp readout/control panel which you could mount to keep an eye on temp easier. You need to maintain a minimum temperature above 72 degrees for the SA cats to be happy.

As far as the stock goes, how big are the current Channel Cats? How big is the RTC you're planning to stock? How big is the TSN you're planning to stock? The growth on the RTC will be the single biggest problem for several reasons, it will outpace the Channels probably 3:1 which means they could become a meal in a few months and it will get very big fast which means more bioload on the pond. A 2" RTC could cross the 2ft mark in under a year fairly easily with heavy feeding. Same thing on the TSN but it won't be a threat to the Channels as far as eating them unless it was say 3ft and they were still under 18". A 2ft RTC could absolutely eat a 12" Channel.

Its a normal exposed garage. Thanks for the recommendation on the heaters. The main time Im going to be worried about the water temp is in the winter, and when it freezes. In the summer I might end up needing to cool it down. I have been looking at diffrent ways to build the filters. The channels are currently about 1 to 2 in. This build is months out. It is going to be for when the channels outgrow their current tank. I want to get the channels to 1 to 2 pounds before I add the SA cats. Im planning to stock a 1 to 2 inch tsn, and a 1 to 2 inch RTC. These will probably be in a grow out tank for 1 to 2 months before they are added to the pond. My main worry with this stocking was the RTC eating the channels.

 

[CichlidKeeper01]

This all depends on the size of the channels actually... even my 4500 pond is still dependent on WC’s when it had only 2 RTC’s once they got really big. The best advice I ever had in stocking big fish came from a guy in Singapore who had literally everything and he said if you work on 20 gallons per pound of large fish it seems to be the sweet spot. It’s all about the water ... you could keep everything in 1000 if you had a drip or did big WC’s.

That rule makes sense. The channels are about 1 to 2 inches. What do you have in the 4500

 

[amazonfishman]

It's a normal exposed garage. Thanks for the recommendation on the heaters. The main time I'm going to be worried about the water temp is in the winter, and when it freezes. In the summer I might end up needing to cool it down. The channels are currently about 1 to 2 in. I want to get the channels to 1 to 2 pounds before I add the SA cats. I'm planning to stock a 1 to 2 inch tsn, and a 1 to 2 inch RTC. These will probably be in a grow out tank for 1 to 2 months before they are added to the pond. My main worry with this stocking was the RTC eating the channels.

Yeah you'll almost certainly see high 40 degree garage temps, without a cover for the pond and a lot of heat it will be impossible to keep it warm enough for the RTC and TSN. The channels will survive without any heat no problem in the garage. As far as summer temps it shouldn't be an issue either channels and the RTC/TSN can take temps into the low 90's as long as there is decent dissolved oxygen. I'd recommend some kind of insulation on the floor prior to pond setup just use the 1/2" sheet insulation from Home Depot or something both for cushion and insulation from the cold concrete

I'd expect a growth rate of 0.5-1.0"/month on the Channels so for them to get to 1lb is probably 12 months. I'm currently raising some in a 5 acre outdoor pond and have seen growth rates along those lines. I'd wait until the Channels are 12-14" before introducing a TSN at 6" and wait for the Channels to be at least 18" before introducing a RTC at 6" to buy yourself some time before you have to worry about any Channels becoming feeders.

FWIW TSN usually put on 2" a month up until the 24" mark then slow down a little, RTC can put on 4"+ a month until the 24" mark then still seem to maintain a 2"+ growth per month at least up until closer to 36".