FLESHY;4758330; said:
I ask why? Why not a DSB? I have a 3" sandbed in my 20 gallon. I think DSBs are great.
300 gal FOWLR
- Thread starter yzf450motoxrider
- Start date
I ask why? Why not a DSB? I have a 3" sandbed in my 20 gallon. I think DSBs are great.
He believes that a DSB is a nitrate bomb waiting to happen.geronimo69;4762378; said:
I will contend that they can be, but like everything else in this hobby, poor maintenance can have dire consequences... its doesnt matter if we are talking about simple water changes or substrates.
Although, I will be going the complete oposite direction with my next tank... a bare bottomed SPS.
The heater should be adequate if it is like my setup, but watch closely particularly in the winter to make sure it keeps the temperature consistent. It may swing from day to night with the lights on and off.
75lbs of LR would be fine if your groupers started out as lil guys, then you could pick up choice bits of fully cured LR over time as they grow. Also I would not use a wet dry filter you would be far better off with a sump full of macro than a sump full of bio balls any day of the week. As for the FX5...It could be quite handy to use for emergency chemical/mechanical filtration. I myself have used it a couple times for temporary situations, but would advise against useing one on a permanent basis for "Bio" filtration like on a FW set up.
Good Luck. Sounds like you have some nice stuff. Geberally from what I've learned...a lb of LR to every gallon. I know it can get pricey. Check Ebay...I know a few people who have bought LR in bulk from Ebay it was actually cheaper with shipping.
yzf450motoxrider;4763941; said:
Yes, it is a beneficial form of algae that can be used for food, waste removal, or if you like the look of it.
Also, no need to worry about getting a lb per gallon of live stuff like weiners says. You can add what you want to slowly add to it as time goes by. Also, you could use base rock for the bottom and places that can't be seen. It will eventually seed and become live rock itself and serve just as well as the live stuff you would pay a lot more for.
thats exactly what i did. I bought 160lb sand and 75 lbs dry rock as package deal for $240 from marcorocks. Then i plan on taking a couple of lbs live sand from someonelses tank and buying 10lb live rock from lfs. should i use some shimp to cycle the tank? How long will it take generaly? how will i know its ready?
Thanks
Thanks
The live rock will cycle the tank, you don't need shrimp. That's the wonderful part of marine aquariums. You know it's ready just like a FW tank, when there are no ammonia or nitrite readings.
About the live rock...the "one lb per gallon" rule is not always a good one, depending on the density of the rock you are using. In a reef, you want to fill about 2/3s of the tank. In a FOWLR system, especially with big fish like groupers, you might want less rock. Groupers are territorial too, so set up multiple caves.
As for WCs, it really depends on how good your skimmer is and how big your groupers are.
What species of groupers were you thinking?
About the live rock...the "one lb per gallon" rule is not always a good one, depending on the density of the rock you are using. In a reef, you want to fill about 2/3s of the tank. In a FOWLR system, especially with big fish like groupers, you might want less rock. Groupers are territorial too, so set up multiple caves.
As for WCs, it really depends on how good your skimmer is and how big your groupers are.
What species of groupers were you thinking?
I realize a lot of this is repeat of what others have said, but I just wanted to put in my opinions on everything.
Just because you have 3" of sand doesnt mean you have a DSB.
Most DSB's are deeper than this, and technically, you arent ever supposed to disturb them.
What ends up happening is this...food goes into the tank, and waste settles down to the substrate.
If you have done your DSB properly, there will be a menagerie of live in the sand waiting to eat this stuff.
But they die, and poop as well, which ends up putting a great deal of that waste into your sand anyways.
Its too deep to be well oxygenated, becomes anaerobic, produces toxic gasses, and pollutes your tank as a nitrate factory.
In the real reef, there is a complete ecosystem down there which you can never hope to recreate. In nature, sand is also overturned, and moved daily in tons. The stuff is clean, because the ocean mixes it up.
By adding the variables of a DSB, you are making your system more prone to crashing.
My sand bed is 2-3" deep as well, but I keep it clean. There is no chance of anything rotting and creating gasses or doing anything else that might harm my inhabitants...no chance.
DSB just adds lots of variables even if it does work properly into a hobby where stability is the key to success.
Bare bottom is also something that I have thought about...but...I like to have the sand there.
Think its better for all the animals and looks better. Bare bottom would look cool until it got scratched all to heck and back.
Not to mention the sand holds a lot of surface area for beneficial bacteria.
+1
The pound per gallon rule is like WPG for me now.
Dont force a certain amount of rock into your tank, heres why.
#1. You will look at the price, and buy the cheapest rock you can find, which wont be that good, and will lower the quality of filtration it is giving you, and the amount of filtration it is giving you is the reason why there is the pounds per gallon rule.
#2. Your animals wont like it. You need something that keeps the tank open, with caves that are suitable for the inhabitants, and designed to meet their needs and desires. If you are more worried about cramming rock into a tank, you will have dead spots, and probably be challenged in aquascaping for the fish.
#3. You wont like it. Hard to come up with something creative when you have 130 pounds of rock in a 75 like I did once, no matter how you started it ended up as a wall.
In my mind, you are better off buying a smaller quantity of high quality rock. Check out www.saltwaterfish.com their rock seems to be a "rocking" deal and comes with free shipping.
PS - Stay away from atlantic farmed stuff...never been as happy with this stuff as the pacific wild stuff.
+1
Water changes need to be determined by weekly testing, before and after h2o changes.
When you get a regimen that keeps your h2o where you like it, that is what you will continue to do. Better filtration, more bio filtration, small amounts in regards to feeding and stocking, with more tank volume...all things that will increase time in between h2o changes.
I am a big fan of macros somewhere in the system for nitrate and phosphate control, just make sure that you pump o2 into they system at night when plants are taking it in, otherwise you are asking for rollercoaster pH's.
geronimo69;4762378; said:
Just because you have 3" of sand doesnt mean you have a DSB.
Most DSB's are deeper than this, and technically, you arent ever supposed to disturb them.
What ends up happening is this...food goes into the tank, and waste settles down to the substrate.
If you have done your DSB properly, there will be a menagerie of live in the sand waiting to eat this stuff.
But they die, and poop as well, which ends up putting a great deal of that waste into your sand anyways.
Its too deep to be well oxygenated, becomes anaerobic, produces toxic gasses, and pollutes your tank as a nitrate factory.
In the real reef, there is a complete ecosystem down there which you can never hope to recreate. In nature, sand is also overturned, and moved daily in tons. The stuff is clean, because the ocean mixes it up.
By adding the variables of a DSB, you are making your system more prone to crashing.
My sand bed is 2-3" deep as well, but I keep it clean. There is no chance of anything rotting and creating gasses or doing anything else that might harm my inhabitants...no chance.
DSB just adds lots of variables even if it does work properly into a hobby where stability is the key to success.
Heathd;4762478; said:
Bare bottom is also something that I have thought about...but...I like to have the sand there.
Think its better for all the animals and looks better. Bare bottom would look cool until it got scratched all to heck and back.
Not to mention the sand holds a lot of surface area for beneficial bacteria.
LD50;4763777; said:
+1
we4wieners;4763957; said:
The pound per gallon rule is like WPG for me now.
Dont force a certain amount of rock into your tank, heres why.
#1. You will look at the price, and buy the cheapest rock you can find, which wont be that good, and will lower the quality of filtration it is giving you, and the amount of filtration it is giving you is the reason why there is the pounds per gallon rule.
#2. Your animals wont like it. You need something that keeps the tank open, with caves that are suitable for the inhabitants, and designed to meet their needs and desires. If you are more worried about cramming rock into a tank, you will have dead spots, and probably be challenged in aquascaping for the fish.
#3. You wont like it. Hard to come up with something creative when you have 130 pounds of rock in a 75 like I did once, no matter how you started it ended up as a wall.
In my mind, you are better off buying a smaller quantity of high quality rock. Check out www.saltwaterfish.com their rock seems to be a "rocking" deal and comes with free shipping.
PS - Stay away from atlantic farmed stuff...never been as happy with this stuff as the pacific wild stuff.
SimonL;4764914; said:
+1
Water changes need to be determined by weekly testing, before and after h2o changes.
When you get a regimen that keeps your h2o where you like it, that is what you will continue to do. Better filtration, more bio filtration, small amounts in regards to feeding and stocking, with more tank volume...all things that will increase time in between h2o changes.
I am a big fan of macros somewhere in the system for nitrate and phosphate control, just make sure that you pump o2 into they system at night when plants are taking it in, otherwise you are asking for rollercoaster pH's.
