300 gallon sump design

[Jc1119]

Ok, so moving along nicely with the mental design for the new 300 gallon tank, but I have a few questions for all you sumpers and reefers. First, the tank is going to be a glassscages 96x24x31 with dual overflows in the back corners. I notice that each overflow has two holes and bulkheads going through the bottom of the tank. Years ago, my 180 reef had 1 hole in each of the overflows which i ran to the sump and the return went up the back of the tank and over the wall. I assume the second hole in the new tank is for the returns, but what (other than aesthetic) is the advantage of doing so and do any of you use the additional hole for the input to the sump instead of a return line?

I plan on using a 75 gallon acrylic sump and originally i was going to fit it with a reeflo super dart gold (2700gph@ 6') ,but im considering going a step up to the barracuda gold(3300gph@6'). At what point is the pump size going to be too much for the sump and overflows Im planning on using? My gut tells me the sump would be fine, but do I need to do anything to the overflows to accept the additional wateflow andr can i use a ball valve on the output to safely throttle the output? I used ball valves in the past for pump maintenance, but I always ran them wide open during normal operation.

Thanks in advance!!

 

[Clay]

Well, using a ball valve is essentially saying that your pump is oversized and wasting electricity. It buys you nothing other than knowing that a smaller pump would have done the same job for fewer watts.

For reference, I plan to run a dart full out at ~5' (2900gph) on my 375. That's less than 10x turnover, but still a tremendous amount of flow.

As far as the drain system, there are a few ways to do it, but I suggest either a herbie or a bean. For clarification on these systems, check this thread:
http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=384407

 

[Jc1119]

Thank you very much. That link is great. Looks like the herbie method is the way to go for me. Its funny, the noise factor had yet to play into my planning, but Im sure i wouldve noticed once I pumbed the whole thing
Would have been insanely loud seeing as the tank is going in the main downstairs hallway of my house. Wife wouldve loved tha!!. So, I should probably plumb the main drain 4-6 inches from the top of the overflow box, to prevent the water crashing effect, then plumb the emergency drain right at the top. Great idea!!

One more question...since Ive been reading up on your math regarding the returns. If I stay with the super dart and run two returns back up to the tank, I hadnt planned on reducing the line diameter at all.....basically 1 1/2" out of the pump to a 1 1/2" tee running two 1 1/2" lines up to the tank. Since Im not reducing the line size, there shouldnt be any reduction in flow, should there? Flow wont be as strong out of two outlets as opposed to one, but I should be good right. Thanks

 

[Clay]

You can safely get away with the main drain being 4" from the teeth of the overflow and the safety being 1.5-2" from the teeth. Minimal waterfall.

1.5" from the dart = (2) 1". However, by upsizing immediately out of the dart to a 2", you can alleviate some of the pipe and elbow loss.

 

[Jc1119]

You can safely get away with the main drain being 4" from the teeth of the overflow and the safety being 1.5-2" from the teeth. Minimal waterfall.

1.5" from the dart = (2) 1". However, by upsizing immediately out of the dart to a 2", you can alleviate some of the pipe and elbow loss.

perfect!! Thanks so much.......

 

[Clay]

Also, don't forget that unions and ball valves are useful almost everywhere you can put them.

 

[Jc1119]

I'd planned on using two directly under the overflows before the sump. Then one between the sump and pump and one after the pump,all union balls. I also planned on putting a tee with male adapter before and after the pump to attach hose to. Essentially I could shut the ball valves before and after the pump, attach one hose to the output running to the yard and the other to the input side going into the tank. Pump would he offline but could be used for the water changes saving water and time.

Oh yeah, I'll put ball valves off the tees to turn off flow out of the adapters

 

[Jc1119]

I replied to this in the link you gave me, but i figured id throw it here as well

After you posted that link to Jose's herbie setup, I spent a good bit of the night last night surfing through numerous reef and marine sites getting a really good idea of their setups and i noticed alot of them dont use a standpipe in the main drain at all. they just use the bare bulkhead.

They say that they roll back the gate valve till the water is up near the top of the overflow box, then roll it open till the water level stabilzes in the box. Just a standpipe on the backup drain. Their contention is that since there is no pipe, there is nothing to make a vaccuum or siphoning sound being that the bulkhead is completely submerged under a large volume of water. Ever try this? I suppose if your standpipe was only hand tightened in, it would be pretty easy to do an A B comparison. Few guys who have been doing reefs for years were very adamant about it in fact...

 

[Jc1119]

One more question for the sump experts. It appears that the glasscages 300 gallon comes standard with 1 1/2" drains. I researched and found flow to be around 600gph per drain. Ill have two mains and setup the other two herbie style, but does that mean I'll only have 1200gph drain capactity? If I use a pump rated close to 3000gph how will this work? Im sure im missing something but I really want to cover all my bases before I start ordering materials.

The pump Im looking at is the super dart gold with 1 1/2" outlet. Should i have them drill the tank for 2" drains or is this counterproductive? Kinda confused

 

[yamaracer5]

One more question for the sump experts. It appears that the glasscages 300 gallon comes standard with 1 1/2" drains. I researched and found flow to be around 600gph per drain. Ill have two mains and setup the other two herbie style, but does that mean I'll only have 1200gph drain capactity? If I use a pump rated close to 3000gph how will this work? Im sure im missing something but I really want to cover all my bases before I start ordering materials.

The pump Im looking at is the super dart gold with 1 1/2" outlet. Should i have them drill the tank for 2" drains or is this counterproductive? Kinda confused

From what i have looked up online it looks like 1.5" drain line can flow 2000 gph. 3/4" pipes will flow 660 gph. This is the site i found it on http://flexpvc.com/WaterFlowBasedOnPipeSize.shtml