Absolute disaster. Each day another dead fish.

White Noise

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Feb 4, 2019
21
3
3
Australia
It was my childhood dream to have a proper fish tank, and I am pretty close to draining the whole thing and putting a couple of lizards or snakes in it atm. I could really use a little help in figuring out what is going on.

Tank Specs
850L ~ 200 gallons
Hardscape, 1cm gravel, 3 large rocks, 2 store bought driftwood.
Tank about 7 months old.
pH 7.0
Temp 26
Ammonia 0 - by the test, but I am trusting this less and less
Nitrates - 0
Nitrates 0 5ppm
Eheim 3 pro cannister filter

Fish
At the start
20 Cardinals
20 Rummy nose
6 Corys
3 Plecos
10 Cherry Barbs (5m/5f)
5 White tip tetra
4 Guppies

The first thing that went wrong was I was cleaning my substrate down to the glass each week, the entire tank. I then cleaned the filter out. I used tank water but I unbalanced the bacteria. I had white hazy water, then it went to green haze. I covered the tank and put some Pond One algae pellets in it, and didn't feed the fish for a couple day. This worked. Then (of the fish listed) I put in the white tips, 5 cardinals, and the guppies. The Cherry barbs killed the guppies instantly, within a couple day. Lesson learned, don't believe everything you read online about tank mates. Then one by one they started dying. I was doing 10% water changes, and dosing the entire tank with Seachem prime. The tests were showing 0 for the relative parameters, and the tank went into a mini-cycle. I lost about 5 cardinals, and a couple of my cories looked really sick. Over the next few days they died. The fish shop sold me formalin, and I dosed for 4 days. During that time a couple Rummy Nose died, and the shop told me that it was to be expected as tetras were sensitive to this stuff. I then did a 25% water change after the treatment as instructed, stopped gravel cleaning the entire tank and did 1/2 the tank deeply, and the other half just on the surface. Each day a couple more fish died. I ended up loosing another Cory, a pleco, 5 more cardinals, 2 more rummy nose and a white fin. The water parameters by the test were all fine (Its hard to say with the colour chart, but it certainly didn't look close to the second bar indicating toxins). Because the pleco died in a little hidy hole in the rocks, I moved the rocks and did a deep gravel clean. A LOT of crap came up, and I assumed that it was an ammonia pocket, that was killing them when they came into contact. The morning before I did a 10% water change after the dead fish, and I put the water in with conditioner, but I didn't check the pH as I was running late from work. I had previously checked the water pH from the tap and it was around 7.2, no ammonia or other things. We had a spike in the pH in the tap water and my pH shot up to 7.6. I put in a little pH down to move it down about 0.2 units. Then a couple more Rummy nose died, so I moved the other rock, which didn't have hidy holes in it and vacummed under that. A lot of crap came up from that as well. I pulled my filter apart, but didn't clean it to check that it was working fine. It was, and looked good. The filter inspection was this morning. I am still dosing with Seachem Prime, and am getting more and more frustrated by the day. I am doing proper feedings, once a day, it takes them about 30 seconds to eat all the food, and none ever hits the ground. Any thoughts? Do you move your rocks etc and clean under them regularly? What have I missed? Why are these fish still dying with what looks to be ammonia burns on their face, but the majority of fish are swimming happily around. Why are they dying 1-2 a day? If it was ammonia and my test was wrong would they not die in larger numbers?
 

Chefken

Redtail Catfish
MFK Member
Sep 17, 2010
1,552
875
150
Harwinton CT
Did you set up your tank and add all fish at once? Did you cycle the tank before adding all the fish? That filter is nice but a bit under filtered for 200 gallons perhaps though your fish are not messy feeders. If you carefully allow the tank to cycle and slowly add fish I do not see why you would need all the chemicals you are using!! Are you using individual tests for each parameter or a all in one test? i find the individual tests more accurate. Dont give up!!! Be patient!!!
 

KelberiFishLover19

Jack Dempsey
MFK Member
Aug 10, 2018
175
85
36
First, did you cycle? Second, did you quarantine? I would recommend trying to go bare bottom if the gravel is collecting too much crap. You can try putting some tiles on the bottom so it’s not just glass or acrylic. Try re-cycling, bare bottom tank with or without tiles, quarantine fish, and slowly add a few fish every week or so. Otherwise don’t get frustrated and keep trying. Don’t buy expensive fish at first. Buy cheep fish for a test at first and if they don’t die and you dont want them, bring them back to your LFS
 
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White Noise

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Feb 4, 2019
21
3
3
Australia
Did you set up your tank and add all fish at once? Did you cycle the tank before adding all the fish? That filter is nice but a bit under filtered for 200 gallons perhaps though your fish are not messy feeders. If you carefully allow the tank to cycle and slowly add fish I do not see why you would need all the chemicals you are using!! Are you using individual tests for each parameter or a all in one test? i find the individual tests more accurate. Dont give up!!! Be patient!!!
Yes I did. I had the tank cycling for about 3 months before I added fish. I added the fish in 3 lots. Before that happened for the first 3 odd months everything was perfect. It was only after I over cleaned the filter did this start to occur.
I am using individual tests as per the master kit, the colours are still a little hard to distinuish, but they look zero to my eye. I have stopped using the Formalin, and am using the prime as it is also my dechlorinator, and I am doing pretty regular water changes ie every dead fish, so it is getting a dose then.
 

White Noise

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Feb 4, 2019
21
3
3
Australia
First, did you cycle? Second, did you quarantine? I would recommend trying to go bare bottom if the gravel is collecting too much crap. You can try putting some tiles on the bottom so it’s not just glass or acrylic. Try re-cycling, bare bottom tank with or without tiles, quarantine fish, and slowly add a few fish every week or so. Otherwise don’t get frustrated and keep trying. Don’t buy expensive fish at first. Buy cheep fish for a test at first and if they don’t die and you dont want them, bring them back to your LFS
I didn't quarantine as I don't have a place to do that. All the fish were bought from the same store, and they do a quarantine period. I have checked and they are very good at that part of things, no substitute for your own I know, but I don't have a spare tank. Thanks for the tip re the tiles, That's actually a pretty good idea. I have spare tiles as my house is new.
By all appearances my tank has re-cycled properly. I took samples of my water down to the store and they said I had 25ppm ammonia (thats how I knew it was a mini cycle). This went for a week, then I had a rise in the Nitrates and the tank cleared up, and everything seemed great.....that was about a week ago. I had 2 days of everything great, and no fish dying, then it all started again :(
 

KelberiFishLover19

Jack Dempsey
MFK Member
Aug 10, 2018
175
85
36
Sou
Yes I did. I had the tank cycling for about 3 months before I added fish. I added the fish in 3 lots. Before that happened for the first 3 odd months everything was perfect. It was only after I over cleaned the filter did this start to occur.
I am using individual tests as per the master kit, the colours are still a little hard to distinuish, but they look zero to my eye. I have stopped using the Formalin, and am using the prime as it is also my dechlorinator, and I am doing pretty regular water changes ie every dead fish, so it is getting a dose then.
sounds like to me that when you cleaned the rocks you may have stirred up some toxins or when you cleaned the filter too much you took too much beneficial bacteria out of the filter.
 

White Noise

Feeder Fish
MFK Member
Feb 4, 2019
21
3
3
Australia
Sou

sounds like to me that when you cleaned the rocks you may have stirred up some toxins or when you cleaned the filter too much you took too much beneficial bacteria out of the filter.
Your right on the second point. That's what started my mini cycle. I only cleaned the rocks yesterday and today, so thats not the right timeline for that. It's a possibility though I wont discount.
 

KelberiFishLover19

Jack Dempsey
MFK Member
Aug 10, 2018
175
85
36
I didn't quarantine as I don't have a place to do that. All the fish were bought from the same store, and they do a quarantine period. I have checked and they are very good at that part of things, no substitute for your own I know, but I don't have a spare tank. Thanks for the tip re the tiles, That's actually a pretty good idea. I have spare tiles as my house is new.
By all appearances my tank has re-cycled properly. I took samples of my water down to the store and they said I had 25ppm ammonia (thats how I knew it was a mini cycle). This went for a week, then I had a rise in the Nitrates and the tank cleared up, and everything seemed great.....that was about a week ago. I had 2 days of everything great, and no fish dying, then it all started again :(
Thanks, got to give the tile recommendation credit to @KingofDIY. If you don’t watch his videos you really should. He is an amazing fish keeper and is super inspirational.
 
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Sou

sounds like to me that when you cleaned the rocks you may have stirred up some toxins or when you cleaned the filter too much you took too much beneficial bacteria out of the filter.
This sounds right to me. Was this store-bought or DIY? If it was DIY I recommend washing the tank with vinegar and washing it with water before even cycling. A mistake a lot of people make is when you start cycling you have to add a large amount of ammonia. Otherwise there's no ammonia so nothing happens (I believe KelberiFishLover19 KelberiFishLover19 made a thread about this). Buy some rosy reds after you're done to see if anything happens.
 
Thanks, got to give the tile recommendation credit to @KingofDIY. If you don’t watch his videos you really should. He is an amazing fish keeper and is super inspirational.
I beg to differ. He got rid of Hook and Stein just because he wasn't getting views on them.
 
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