Alert: Potamotrygonidae under consideration for CITES listing.

[ShadowStryder]

It's a little judgemental to say people shouldn't be allowed to keep a certain fish based on your opinion, or that raising a price will "keep them from the bad people's hands". Why are the people who have more money better suited? Did the poor people kill one and the rich don't? Who here hasn't killed a fish?

At some point we have to stop the elitest crap. Trying to add morals in a hobby that really doesn't have many. It gets old. You've killed fish. I've killed fish. So it's a little hippocrytical to say what you said thinking higher prices will keep them out of the hands of people that "shouldn't have them".

It's a hobby. It's a fish. We all know there are bad keepers of every type of fish. For the most part they are in the lower percentage. But this could and would affect a crapload of people who love rays and take good care of them when they get them.

You are my new favorite Mod, temporarily.

 

[srikamaraja]

Oh my... I need to get an American Eel, and quickly. As for the FW stingrays, keep the captive breeding alive!

 

[Nic]

It's a little judgemental to say people shouldn't be allowed to keep a certain fish based on your opinion, or that raising a price will "keep them from the bad people's hands". Why are the people who have more money better suited? Did the poor people kill one and the rich don't? Who here hasn't killed a fish?

kevin im more putting that out for the people who go to a LFS and buy a ray with the idea it will live in there 55 gallon for life with there 3 oscars and kill it... your the one reading too far into it...

At some point we have to stop the elitest crap. Trying to add morals in a hobby that really doesn't have many. It gets old. You've killed fish. I've killed fish. So it's a little hippocrytical to say what you said thinking higher prices will keep them out of the hands of people that "shouldn't have them".

never said i havent killed fish... never said i was elite...


It's a hobby. It's a fish. We all know there are bad keepers of every type of fish. For the most part they are in the lower percentage. But this could and would affect a crapload of people who love rays and take good care of them when they get them.

again if that happened there price would go up and you would have to buy from breeders... so now people would be paying a higher price and it would push these animals to the people better suited to care for them and if the average joe wanted some rays they would put alot more research and time into there set up etc... as they are saving up for the ray....


Is that a better way to put it?

 

[ewurm]

I think the cost of stingrays is already prohibitive right now. You're never going to eliminate irresponsible pet ownership. We sell rays, and we don't sell many. If someone is interested, we educate them thoroughly on the necessary care of the animal. We already have a high markup on the fish to ensure that the animals are properly cared for. I wish we took the same approach with large catfish, or didn't carry them at all. Even with a high price tag, there are plenty of idiots with lots of money who want the "cool" fish but aren't willing to put in the time and effort. The responsibility falls on both the buyer and seller to ensure the success of a purchased animal.

 

[Zoodiver]

Personally, I think that it's good to have them listed. It protects the animals. Isn't that what we all want - keeping the animals around instead of wiping them all off of the face of the Earth?

 

[Nic]

I think the cost of stingrays is already prohibitive right now. You're never going to eliminate irresponsible pet ownership. We sell rays, and we don't sell many. If someone is interested, we educate them thoroughly on the necessary care of the animal. We already have a high markup on the fish to ensure that the animals are properly cared for. I wish we took the same approach with large catfish, or didn't carry them at all. Even with a high price tag, there are plenty of idiots with lots of money who want the "cool" fish but aren't willing to put in the time and effort. The responsibility falls on both the buyer and seller to ensure the success of a purchased animal.

that cats should not even be offered IMO... very few people can actually house them properly...

this is true...

but most stores dont care... they made there $$$ odds are guy will kill it and then come back and buy another...

Personally, I think that it's good to have them listed. It protects the animals. Isn't that what we all want - keeping the animals around instead of wiping them all off of the face of the Earth?

 

[ewurm]

Personally, I think that it's good to have them listed. It protects the animals. Isn't that what we all want - keeping the animals around instead of wiping them all off of the face of the Earth?

I absolutely agree as long as they use sound science to come to a conclusion on sustainable utilization for each species. I'm not informed enough about other CITES listings to know whether or not they have made sound empathetic decisions on other animals within the trade. As of right now, they definitely do not have enough information to make said decisions, and admitted it.

 

[skylineiz]

this would effect brazil/paru and columbia's exportation wouldnt it?

they can not chip wild rays at all, correct?
meaning only cb rays can be sold?

I think it is good.
If they breed in your home, big deal who is going to regulate it. I don't think they have enough money to check everyones tank.
It would probably have little effect over here in Australia since, there on the grey import list anyway....
Everything is bought and sold privately. Probably whats going to happen to allot of ray buyers in the US if this goes through.

Do they expect you to put down the extra pups? lol yea right...

 

[Zoodiver]

CITES has NO IMPACT on captive breeding of these things.
It's focused on regulation of trade (mostly over borders). To bring the animals into the country, you'll need to be granted the proper permit. It's not really THAT big of a deal if you follow the regulations.

The up side is that it allows better control of the animals by people who actually know what they are doing when it comes to animals. (Not just some gov't emplyee in a suit at a desk.) In the long run, this is a good thing for FW rays. CITES has helped many high risk species make strong come backs.

 

[ewurm]

CITES has NO IMPACT on captive breeding of these things.
It's focused on regulation of trade (mostly over borders). To bring the animals into the country, you'll need to be granted the proper permit. It's not really THAT big of a deal if you follow the regulations.

The up side is that it allows better control of the animals by people who actually know what they are doing when it comes to animals. (Not just some gov't emplyee in a suit at a desk.) In the long run, this is a good thing for FW rays. CITES has helped many high risk species make strong come backs.

I'll defer to your knowledge on the CITES listings. I really hope that captive breeding projects are expanded to meet the needs (wants) of aquarists so that the listing won't be an issue in the first place.