'Settle down racer, shes helping you. Just because you didnt ask for it doesnt mean you dont need it 
'
This is what I was trying to say
'This is what I was trying to say
ball python update #1
- Thread starter rxracer
- Start date
Well how 'bout that, Jess?
Rxracer, heres some excerpts from the Pro Exotics FAQ, what I consider one of the best online reptile care articles anywhere...
Should i feed my snake/lizard/gecko in a separate container?No. Nope. Nyet. Good grief, NO.
There are some pieces of "advice" that continually float around, and never go away. They are constantly recycled, often regurgitated without actual thought to new keepers struggling to separate good advice from bad.
There is no sensible or logical reason to feed your reptile in a separate container. The most common reasoning is that it "trains" the animal not to bite when you go in the cage.
There are two basic reasons your animal strikes when you go in the cage. Most likely it is a defensive strike, as you have startled the animal (perhaps woken it up), and it is defending itself. Learn how to approach your animal better, don't grab it by the head, or from in front of the nose. "Wake it up" before snatching it out.
The other common strike is due to the fact that you SMELL LIKE FOOD. Don't wear "rat cologne" and don't feed by hand. Use a hemostat for goodness sakes! Again, this is not the fault of the animal, this is due to the ignorance of the keeper, and it is easily remedied.
Feeding in a separate container does not "train" the animal to be tamer when you go in the cage (you still "go in the cage" to inititiate feeding). And in itself it does not prevent impactions of particulate substrates like soil or mulch.
You know what DOES prevent impactions? Proper husbandry! We have kept thousands of reptiles, snakes and lizards, on MANY different substrates, and feeding doesn't cause impactions. Bad choices do.
Impactions are most often caused by low hydration levels. When an animal is dehydrated, nothing is going flow as smoothly as it should. When an animal is kept too cool, metabolism is not going to run well enough to pass substrates and other non-digestibles.
I suppose if you kept your gecko on a substrate of crushed glass, then any glass consumed while feeding would cause a problem. But that is because you chose CRUSHED GLASS (or walnut shells, or some other poor substrate). Pick an appropriate substrate. Don't chronically dehydrate your animals (a SUPER common problem and misunderstanding in reptile husbandry) and give your animals the necessary range of temperatures to accomplish life events (like pooping!).
And stop feeding in a separate container. That is just dopey.
How can I switch my snake from MICE to RATS?The answer to this question is very similar to the FAQ on feeding thawed prey items (see that here.) It is all about the "primer". (your animal may take a rat with no hesitation at all. Be sure to try that first, before the technique below, so you don't waste your time)
A "primer" gets your reptile in the mood, raring to go, and as responsive as can be.
You can prime your snake by feeding two meals in one sitting. Go with feeders that are 50-60% of the regular weekly size, one mouse, and one rat. Feed your mouse meal first (you are feeding thawed, right?!?), and then pay attention. A smaller prey item should be consumed pretty quickly (that's the "prime"), and that is when you pounce. Immediately after the snake has swallowed the first item (allow for that full "get in the stomach" stretch), offer the rat to your snake. Snakes are instinctive feeders, and it is hard for the animal to shut off the triggered feeding response. Your animal should snap up the second item (the rat) with gusto. Anyone that has handled their snake too soon after feeding (sometimes an hour or two!) will be familiar with this instinctive strike. Your hand doesn't smell like food, but dagnabbit, that snake is ready to go, and any old target will do! Make that target your thawed rat, and you are good to go.
Follow the two in one primer plan for three or four weeks. For the fifth week, offer a full sized, high quality thawed rat, and watch your previously mouse addicted animal snap it up without a second thought. The slightly different smell, or flavor, of the thawed rat will be old news to your animal by now, switch made, problem solved.
This technique also works well for making the rat-to-rabbit switch. Follow the same gameplan.
BEWARE!! Once you have worked so hard to make the switch, DON'T LOOK BACK!! Once your animal is eating rats (or rabbits) you can reset the whole system by offering a mouse again.
I can't tell you how FRUSTRATING it is to work for weeks, or months, to get a big burm feeding on thawed rabbits, only to have an employee wander through with "extra" thawed rat feeders one day, and think he is doing us all a favor by feeding them off to our rabbit eating burms! Now we have to start the whole process over again (rats must taste better than rabbits), and if I wasn't so tired from switching four burms back to rabbits again, I would be whipping some employee tail!
Better to skip a week of feeding if you run out of rats (or rabbits) than to revert back to a previous feeder and ruin your whole program. Reptiles can be quite stubborn, and feeding is as much a game of strategy as anything else. Let it be YOUR strategy, and not the reptile's (this stubbornness goes for all reptiles, especially Monitors. Don't get punked out by your own pets!).
Why do you suggest FEEDING PREKILLED/THAWED rodents? How can I make the switch?Feeding live rodents is by most accounts an outdated husbandry practice, and in this day and age, should very rarely be necessary.
Live feeders are ticking timebombs waiting to explode on your animal. Mice and rats have extremely sharp teeth, and can do a lot of quick damage (not to mention rabbits, which are a whole nother level of switchblade). Leaving a live feeder rodent in the cage with your snake, even for a half an hour, can lead to serious damage to the animal. A snake that doesn't eat because of shed, sickness, or for whatever reason, is a sitting duck for a scared, desperate, aggressive rodent.
At the same time, even a snake with a quick feeding response can pay the price to a live rodent. One small slip in the strike of your animal can leave the rodent's head and teeth (or rabbit's kicking claws) exposed and ready for damage. It takes only one quick bite to puncture an eye, or chew through a throat, or back.
I can't tell you how many times I have seen a ball python constrict around a mouse's rear end, leaving the head completely free to move about. While the ball is occupied, and completely defenseless (coiling with all it's might), the mouse is free to fight back, using the best weapons that it has, it's teeth. Not even the quickest keeper is going to be able to jump in and prevent an accident everytime. If you insist on feeding live prey, over time the odds WILL catch up to you, and your snake is going to pay the price for your ignorance. There is a very dramatic picture that perfectly illustrates the live feeding problem, an instance of a mouse left overnight in the cage of a "feeding" Ball python. I hate the picture. It breaks my heart (this picture is NOT a PE animal, it has been floating around the internet for years). But it is certainly an effective deterrent, and one I think should be included here. If this FAQ is enough to convince you otherwise, don't look at the pic, and even then, don't look at the pic (this Ball python is still very much alive, but must be put down as soon as possible), but if you must see it to believe it, it is here.
I told you so.
There are instances when live feeders must be used. But 95% of the time, it is just not necessary. If I get 100 emails about stubborn animals that "won't eat", and the keeper wants to feed live, in 99 of those cases, there is a better choice, and live is not necessary. The anorexia of the reptile is almost always due to the inexperience of the keeper, and not the appetite of the reptile.
If you must use a live feeder to spark an appetite, you are courting disaster. But it is your responsibility to get your animal switched to either prekilled or thawed prey as soon as possible. Feeding live prey over the life of your reptile is simply ignorant and barbaric, we have come too far as a hobby to encourage such a practice.
So how do you switch? It really is not that difficult. Once again, failure is typically the fault of the keeper, and not related to the appetite of the reptile.
Most healthy snakes will take a thawed rodent without hesitation. Offered on a pair of hemostats, or feeder tongs, a fully thawed rodent of high quality, held in front of the snakes mouth will get a full blown strike and constriction (NEVER feed a snake from your hand! Now THAT is a novice technique!). Hold the mouse or rat by the back, below the neck, high on the spine. "Dangling" by the tail is less effective, and gives poor "aim". If the snake is puzzled by the stillness of the prey item, give it a little wiggle, a little movement, and it will become quite enticing.
Some snakes like a lot of movement. Some don't. Common boas will often strike a thawed mouse that "pops" them on the head a time or two. Ball pythons, on the other hand, are extremely head shy, and it is best not to touch the snake, but instead hold the mouse completely still in front of it's nose. A Ball python may take it's time, but it will strike (and often miss, they seem to have the WORST aim in the reptile kingdom). Using a high quality thawed feeder, hemostats, and a little patience, will usually give you success in making the transition.
But sometimes, the snakes will be more stubborn. A "primer" might be of use.
You can "prime" your snake by feeding two meals in one sitting. Go with feeders that are 50-60% of the regular weekly size, one live (ugh!) or fresh killed, and one thawed. Feed your regular meal first, and then pay attention. A smaller prey item should be consumed pretty quickly (that's the "prime"), and that is when you pounce. Immediately after the snake has swallowed the first item (allow for that full "get in the stomach" stretch), offer the thawed rodent to your snake. Snakes are instinctive feeders, and it is hard for the animal to shut off the triggered feeding response. Your animal should snap up the second item with gusto. Anyone that has handled their snake too soon after feeding (sometimes an hour or two!) will be familiar with this instinctive strike. Your hand doesn't smell like food, but dagnabbit, that snake is raring to go, and any old target will do! Make that target your thawed mouse, and you are good to go.
Follow the two in one primer plan for three or four weeks. For the fifth week, offer a full sized, high quality thawed feeder, and watch your previously stubborn animal snap it up without a second thought. The slightly different smell, or flavor, of the thawed feeder will be old news to your animal by now, switch made, problem solved.
I mention high quality frozen rodents for a reason. Years ago, frozen rodents were more difficult to find. I can remember receiving full size trash bags of frozen mice, various sizes, perhaps 1500 in the bag, and it certainly looked less than appetizing. Convincing our snakes to eat such ugly mice was not quite as simple, and the smell was terrible. "Feeder Suppliers" sold mice and rats that had been refrozen two or three times, or rodents that were wet when they were frozen, and the resulting thaw was one gooey, unusable mess.
Fortunately, those days are gone. Well, you can still get crappy feeders out there, but there are also a plethora of GREAT frozen rodent suppliers that sell Grade A, Prime Choice, fat, dry, healthy, meaty, vacuum sealed, wonderfully packed rodents, and those folks definitely deserve your business. Companies like SAS Feeders, Gourmet Rodent, or RodentPro.com (see our links section), offer great selection, service, and of course, the best part of feeding frozen, VALUE. Ordering mice in a 50 or 100 lot (or 5000 lot) can be 75% cheaper than buying live feeders at your local pet store, and it is a lot more convenient!
One last thing, a note on THAWING your feeders. Don't be a doofus. Thawing frozen mice in a cup of hot water only takes you back to the old days of rotten, slimy mice. Thaw your rodents on a plastic lid, or some newspaper, at room temperature, it doesn't take long at all. If you must use hot water for that "quick thaw" at least put the feeder in a Ziploc bag! Seal it up, thaw it out, and when you feed it, it is still dry! And appetizing! Ok, that's a relative term, but this whole paper is about your animal, not you, so do what is best for them! Feed smart, feed healthy, feed thawed prey!
And heres the coupe de grace, the picture you NEVER want to see in real life. And dude, I HAVE seen worse...
Rxracer, heres some excerpts from the Pro Exotics FAQ, what I consider one of the best online reptile care articles anywhere...
Should i feed my snake/lizard/gecko in a separate container?No. Nope. Nyet. Good grief, NO.
There are some pieces of "advice" that continually float around, and never go away. They are constantly recycled, often regurgitated without actual thought to new keepers struggling to separate good advice from bad.
There is no sensible or logical reason to feed your reptile in a separate container. The most common reasoning is that it "trains" the animal not to bite when you go in the cage.
There are two basic reasons your animal strikes when you go in the cage. Most likely it is a defensive strike, as you have startled the animal (perhaps woken it up), and it is defending itself. Learn how to approach your animal better, don't grab it by the head, or from in front of the nose. "Wake it up" before snatching it out.
The other common strike is due to the fact that you SMELL LIKE FOOD. Don't wear "rat cologne" and don't feed by hand. Use a hemostat for goodness sakes! Again, this is not the fault of the animal, this is due to the ignorance of the keeper, and it is easily remedied.
Feeding in a separate container does not "train" the animal to be tamer when you go in the cage (you still "go in the cage" to inititiate feeding). And in itself it does not prevent impactions of particulate substrates like soil or mulch.
You know what DOES prevent impactions? Proper husbandry! We have kept thousands of reptiles, snakes and lizards, on MANY different substrates, and feeding doesn't cause impactions. Bad choices do.
Impactions are most often caused by low hydration levels. When an animal is dehydrated, nothing is going flow as smoothly as it should. When an animal is kept too cool, metabolism is not going to run well enough to pass substrates and other non-digestibles.
I suppose if you kept your gecko on a substrate of crushed glass, then any glass consumed while feeding would cause a problem. But that is because you chose CRUSHED GLASS (or walnut shells, or some other poor substrate). Pick an appropriate substrate. Don't chronically dehydrate your animals (a SUPER common problem and misunderstanding in reptile husbandry) and give your animals the necessary range of temperatures to accomplish life events (like pooping!).
And stop feeding in a separate container. That is just dopey.
How can I switch my snake from MICE to RATS?The answer to this question is very similar to the FAQ on feeding thawed prey items (see that here.) It is all about the "primer". (your animal may take a rat with no hesitation at all. Be sure to try that first, before the technique below, so you don't waste your time)
A "primer" gets your reptile in the mood, raring to go, and as responsive as can be.
You can prime your snake by feeding two meals in one sitting. Go with feeders that are 50-60% of the regular weekly size, one mouse, and one rat. Feed your mouse meal first (you are feeding thawed, right?!?), and then pay attention. A smaller prey item should be consumed pretty quickly (that's the "prime"), and that is when you pounce. Immediately after the snake has swallowed the first item (allow for that full "get in the stomach" stretch), offer the rat to your snake. Snakes are instinctive feeders, and it is hard for the animal to shut off the triggered feeding response. Your animal should snap up the second item (the rat) with gusto. Anyone that has handled their snake too soon after feeding (sometimes an hour or two!) will be familiar with this instinctive strike. Your hand doesn't smell like food, but dagnabbit, that snake is ready to go, and any old target will do! Make that target your thawed rat, and you are good to go.
Follow the two in one primer plan for three or four weeks. For the fifth week, offer a full sized, high quality thawed rat, and watch your previously mouse addicted animal snap it up without a second thought. The slightly different smell, or flavor, of the thawed rat will be old news to your animal by now, switch made, problem solved.
This technique also works well for making the rat-to-rabbit switch. Follow the same gameplan.
BEWARE!! Once you have worked so hard to make the switch, DON'T LOOK BACK!! Once your animal is eating rats (or rabbits) you can reset the whole system by offering a mouse again.
I can't tell you how FRUSTRATING it is to work for weeks, or months, to get a big burm feeding on thawed rabbits, only to have an employee wander through with "extra" thawed rat feeders one day, and think he is doing us all a favor by feeding them off to our rabbit eating burms! Now we have to start the whole process over again (rats must taste better than rabbits), and if I wasn't so tired from switching four burms back to rabbits again, I would be whipping some employee tail!
Better to skip a week of feeding if you run out of rats (or rabbits) than to revert back to a previous feeder and ruin your whole program. Reptiles can be quite stubborn, and feeding is as much a game of strategy as anything else. Let it be YOUR strategy, and not the reptile's (this stubbornness goes for all reptiles, especially Monitors. Don't get punked out by your own pets!).
Why do you suggest FEEDING PREKILLED/THAWED rodents? How can I make the switch?Feeding live rodents is by most accounts an outdated husbandry practice, and in this day and age, should very rarely be necessary.
Live feeders are ticking timebombs waiting to explode on your animal. Mice and rats have extremely sharp teeth, and can do a lot of quick damage (not to mention rabbits, which are a whole nother level of switchblade). Leaving a live feeder rodent in the cage with your snake, even for a half an hour, can lead to serious damage to the animal. A snake that doesn't eat because of shed, sickness, or for whatever reason, is a sitting duck for a scared, desperate, aggressive rodent.
At the same time, even a snake with a quick feeding response can pay the price to a live rodent. One small slip in the strike of your animal can leave the rodent's head and teeth (or rabbit's kicking claws) exposed and ready for damage. It takes only one quick bite to puncture an eye, or chew through a throat, or back.
I can't tell you how many times I have seen a ball python constrict around a mouse's rear end, leaving the head completely free to move about. While the ball is occupied, and completely defenseless (coiling with all it's might), the mouse is free to fight back, using the best weapons that it has, it's teeth. Not even the quickest keeper is going to be able to jump in and prevent an accident everytime. If you insist on feeding live prey, over time the odds WILL catch up to you, and your snake is going to pay the price for your ignorance. There is a very dramatic picture that perfectly illustrates the live feeding problem, an instance of a mouse left overnight in the cage of a "feeding" Ball python. I hate the picture. It breaks my heart (this picture is NOT a PE animal, it has been floating around the internet for years). But it is certainly an effective deterrent, and one I think should be included here. If this FAQ is enough to convince you otherwise, don't look at the pic, and even then, don't look at the pic (this Ball python is still very much alive, but must be put down as soon as possible), but if you must see it to believe it, it is here.
I told you so.
There are instances when live feeders must be used. But 95% of the time, it is just not necessary. If I get 100 emails about stubborn animals that "won't eat", and the keeper wants to feed live, in 99 of those cases, there is a better choice, and live is not necessary. The anorexia of the reptile is almost always due to the inexperience of the keeper, and not the appetite of the reptile.
If you must use a live feeder to spark an appetite, you are courting disaster. But it is your responsibility to get your animal switched to either prekilled or thawed prey as soon as possible. Feeding live prey over the life of your reptile is simply ignorant and barbaric, we have come too far as a hobby to encourage such a practice.
So how do you switch? It really is not that difficult. Once again, failure is typically the fault of the keeper, and not related to the appetite of the reptile.
Most healthy snakes will take a thawed rodent without hesitation. Offered on a pair of hemostats, or feeder tongs, a fully thawed rodent of high quality, held in front of the snakes mouth will get a full blown strike and constriction (NEVER feed a snake from your hand! Now THAT is a novice technique!). Hold the mouse or rat by the back, below the neck, high on the spine. "Dangling" by the tail is less effective, and gives poor "aim". If the snake is puzzled by the stillness of the prey item, give it a little wiggle, a little movement, and it will become quite enticing.
Some snakes like a lot of movement. Some don't. Common boas will often strike a thawed mouse that "pops" them on the head a time or two. Ball pythons, on the other hand, are extremely head shy, and it is best not to touch the snake, but instead hold the mouse completely still in front of it's nose. A Ball python may take it's time, but it will strike (and often miss, they seem to have the WORST aim in the reptile kingdom). Using a high quality thawed feeder, hemostats, and a little patience, will usually give you success in making the transition.
But sometimes, the snakes will be more stubborn. A "primer" might be of use.
You can "prime" your snake by feeding two meals in one sitting. Go with feeders that are 50-60% of the regular weekly size, one live (ugh!) or fresh killed, and one thawed. Feed your regular meal first, and then pay attention. A smaller prey item should be consumed pretty quickly (that's the "prime"), and that is when you pounce. Immediately after the snake has swallowed the first item (allow for that full "get in the stomach" stretch), offer the thawed rodent to your snake. Snakes are instinctive feeders, and it is hard for the animal to shut off the triggered feeding response. Your animal should snap up the second item with gusto. Anyone that has handled their snake too soon after feeding (sometimes an hour or two!) will be familiar with this instinctive strike. Your hand doesn't smell like food, but dagnabbit, that snake is raring to go, and any old target will do! Make that target your thawed mouse, and you are good to go.
Follow the two in one primer plan for three or four weeks. For the fifth week, offer a full sized, high quality thawed feeder, and watch your previously stubborn animal snap it up without a second thought. The slightly different smell, or flavor, of the thawed feeder will be old news to your animal by now, switch made, problem solved.
I mention high quality frozen rodents for a reason. Years ago, frozen rodents were more difficult to find. I can remember receiving full size trash bags of frozen mice, various sizes, perhaps 1500 in the bag, and it certainly looked less than appetizing. Convincing our snakes to eat such ugly mice was not quite as simple, and the smell was terrible. "Feeder Suppliers" sold mice and rats that had been refrozen two or three times, or rodents that were wet when they were frozen, and the resulting thaw was one gooey, unusable mess.
Fortunately, those days are gone. Well, you can still get crappy feeders out there, but there are also a plethora of GREAT frozen rodent suppliers that sell Grade A, Prime Choice, fat, dry, healthy, meaty, vacuum sealed, wonderfully packed rodents, and those folks definitely deserve your business. Companies like SAS Feeders, Gourmet Rodent, or RodentPro.com (see our links section), offer great selection, service, and of course, the best part of feeding frozen, VALUE. Ordering mice in a 50 or 100 lot (or 5000 lot) can be 75% cheaper than buying live feeders at your local pet store, and it is a lot more convenient!
One last thing, a note on THAWING your feeders. Don't be a doofus. Thawing frozen mice in a cup of hot water only takes you back to the old days of rotten, slimy mice. Thaw your rodents on a plastic lid, or some newspaper, at room temperature, it doesn't take long at all. If you must use hot water for that "quick thaw" at least put the feeder in a Ziploc bag! Seal it up, thaw it out, and when you feed it, it is still dry! And appetizing! Ok, that's a relative term, but this whole paper is about your animal, not you, so do what is best for them! Feed smart, feed healthy, feed thawed prey!
And heres the coupe de grace, the picture you NEVER want to see in real life. And dude, I HAVE seen worse...
Btw, heres the link to the whole thing.
http://www.proexotics.com/FAQ2.html
Thats an essential peice o' work right there. Its helpful to ANY herp keeper, no matter what you keep.
http://www.proexotics.com/FAQ2.html
Thats an essential peice o' work right there. Its helpful to ANY herp keeper, no matter what you keep.
loconorc;1313841; said:Jeez well now I know what it looks like when me and jess argue LOL!
Settle down racer, shes helping you. Just because you didnt ask for it doesnt mean you dont need it
Anyway on topic. Yes, its your choice to feed live or frozen. Aside from the fact frozen mice are cheaper, more convienent, and without the hassle, live mice can be dangerous.
Im sure if youve done a shred of research on snake feeding, youve probably seen one of the infamous pictures of a snake eaten up. It is NOT a pretty sight. I can get one and post it for you, Ill get it when im done with this post. In fact, I need to save that pic for future reference...
You dont need to starve a snake to get it to eat frozen. It just takes a little know-how.
yes i have doen research, a few more hours last night. they were all saying if you try a F/T and it doenst take it. try a live on see if it takes it than. i was trying different stuf to get it to eat, that was my goal. ill work with it to get it on f/t. i have like a whole lil tubr of F/T in my freezer right now. im not giving up on feedin them, i just wanted it to eat here, and to get a full stomach so i personally know he has eaten, instead of taking the word from some half ass pet shop. thats all. in my mind i feel as though i did the right thing, ill work to get it to eat frozens..
and BTW there is a big difference between me and LC. i dont exchange pets when im tired of them, i take care of them, and i dont lie. please don not put my name with his. thank you for you posts,
Seeing as your being decent now I won't carry on about you and LC'S uncanny similarity in attitudes.
You feel you did the right thing, but did you?
No.
This is where people with general experience (not heads up their ass, as it can sometimes seem I know..) should be listened to when they give advice. I am not here to flame, attack or have glee in saying your wrong. I'm here to pass on my experience and what works for me as have so many people kindly done for me. The difference is you just seem to ignore what is GENERALLY correct in the HOBBY, and correct in YOUR mind and morals.
If you research, a week without food is nothing for a snake, my snakes do that when they feel like it, and it is NOT cause for concern.I don't worry until 5-6 weeks down the line (and even this is nothing for royals) and I know my husbandry is spot on, I then get worried.
You needed to try brained, putting in a dark box with the food overnight..just so many things before live.
You researched but not enough if the answers you are getting are 'feed live straight after you try frozen/thawed. My opinion? You will be lucky to get this python feeding on t/f again.
Heres (unfortantely for you I guess) more advice. On forums, your gonna get told things you don't wanna, we all have (yes I have ALOT of times..this is how I got this far) and just because you have done something wrong and are getting corrected, don't bite them back for doing this. They are trying to get YOU to succeed SHORT-TERM & LONG TERM with your animal (live feeding not being successful long term..), you need to learn to accept and thank those that are trying their best and taking the time to help you succeed with your pet, not bite them or slap them with the advise in the face for it...you will have a very short term stay on many forums with that behaviour.
Good luck nontheless.
You feel you did the right thing, but did you?
No.
This is where people with general experience (not heads up their ass, as it can sometimes seem I know..) should be listened to when they give advice. I am not here to flame, attack or have glee in saying your wrong. I'm here to pass on my experience and what works for me as have so many people kindly done for me. The difference is you just seem to ignore what is GENERALLY correct in the HOBBY, and correct in YOUR mind and morals.
If you research, a week without food is nothing for a snake, my snakes do that when they feel like it, and it is NOT cause for concern.I don't worry until 5-6 weeks down the line (and even this is nothing for royals) and I know my husbandry is spot on, I then get worried.
You needed to try brained, putting in a dark box with the food overnight..just so many things before live.
You researched but not enough if the answers you are getting are 'feed live straight after you try frozen/thawed. My opinion? You will be lucky to get this python feeding on t/f again.
Heres (unfortantely for you I guess) more advice. On forums, your gonna get told things you don't wanna, we all have (yes I have ALOT of times..this is how I got this far) and just because you have done something wrong and are getting corrected, don't bite them back for doing this. They are trying to get YOU to succeed SHORT-TERM & LONG TERM with your animal (live feeding not being successful long term..), you need to learn to accept and thank those that are trying their best and taking the time to help you succeed with your pet, not bite them or slap them with the advise in the face for it...you will have a very short term stay on many forums with that behaviour.
Good luck nontheless.
I think you guys are beating up on a guy for no reason here. I feed only F/T but if I had a new royal that was stubborn and wouldnt bother with pre-killed I too would try live. Then after a few live feedings I would do the switch.
Yes his snake can be injured but if it is conditioned to eating live it may never take a pre-killed item without some 'practice'. Also as long as he has a watchful eye and doesnt leave the snake alone with the mouse he SHOULD be OK.
Racer, I for one am glad you got your royal to eat, it can be nerve wracking when they wont. But now for MY advice to you I would suggest you do NOT give up on pre-killed and work to that as your ultimate feeding goal. Because in the end it really is better for you and your snake.
Yes his snake can be injured but if it is conditioned to eating live it may never take a pre-killed item without some 'practice'. Also as long as he has a watchful eye and doesnt leave the snake alone with the mouse he SHOULD be OK.
Racer, I for one am glad you got your royal to eat, it can be nerve wracking when they wont. But now for MY advice to you I would suggest you do NOT give up on pre-killed and work to that as your ultimate feeding goal. Because in the end it really is better for you and your snake.
walls;1314183; said:
thanks, you see exactly what i was trying to do, i just wanted to get the inital feeding done. i appreciate your advice, and i am wanting to get the ball eating F/T. that is the ultimate goal. i can buy more than one, and store them longer with out the mess of live. the only thing is in the area i am, there are no F/T rats i can get. any advice there? place to get them off the net?
thanks for understanding
Rob
This is a decent place for frozen rats....http://www.bigappleherp.com/Rats
I dont remeber just how big your royal is but make sure you dont get too large a prey item. The prey should be no bigger than the fattest part of your snake.
My first royal (over 20 years ago) was an adult wild caught, pretty much all of them were back then. That damn snake would not eat for at least three month's but finally took a live gerbil. I remeber to this day how excited I was that it had finally ate.
Also dont panic if your snake goes off feed for a while, some tend to do that now and then.
I dont remeber just how big your royal is but make sure you dont get too large a prey item. The prey should be no bigger than the fattest part of your snake.
My first royal (over 20 years ago) was an adult wild caught, pretty much all of them were back then. That damn snake would not eat for at least three month's but finally took a live gerbil. I remeber to this day how excited I was that it had finally ate.
Also dont panic if your snake goes off feed for a while, some tend to do that now and then.
