Chloramine in source water with Auto Drip System?

  • We are currently upgrading MFK. thanks! -neo
Agree with duanes duanes , it all boils down to exactly what he just posted, along with ones disinfectant residual levels. IMHO always best to drop a dime and speak to someone at your local facility so there are no surprises with regards to max/min levels of whatever disinfectant is being used.
 
  • Like
Reactions: wednesday13
Before u installed the injector pump what were your findings while dripping "tainted" water lol? Anything noticeably detrimental or did u just add it in for more of worry/precaution?

Sorry, I can't tell you - I wouldn't know. Lol.

I have never added untreated municipal tap water to my tanks. Drinking water disinfection is a serious business, chlorine or chloramine are added because they exert biological effects at the concentrations they are added: they kill. Why would I subject my aquatic biosphere to that? I invest too much in my tanks to negligently inflict harm by being careless. I don't want to kill my beneficial bacteria, I don't want to kill my plants, my shrimp, I don't want to kill my fishes' microbiomes, I don't want to harm my fish, I do not want to harm their fry.

There is a lot that was said by others that I simply don't agree with: Treating tapwater to remove disinfecting agents is fish keeping 101 IMHO.

Having said all of that, I am fortunate enough to live on my own private well now. No more treating water, just straight from the ground into my tanks.

Happy fishkeeping
HarleyK
 
I am fortunate enough to live on my own private well now. No more treating water, just straight from the ground into my tanks.
Congrats! Ain't it wonderful?

I haven't bought or used dechlorinator or any other water conditioner for use in my own tanks for over 30 years. Life is good. :)
 
  • Haha
Reactions: wednesday13
Sorry, I can't tell you - I wouldn't know. Lol.

I have never added untreated municipal tap water to my tanks. Drinking water disinfection is a serious business, chlorine or chloramine are added because they exert biological effects at the concentrations they are added: they kill. Why would I subject my aquatic biosphere to that? I invest too much in my tanks to negligently inflict harm by being careless. I don't want to kill my beneficial bacteria, I don't want to kill my plants, my shrimp, I don't want to kill my fishes' microbiomes, I don't want to harm my fish, I do not want to harm their fry.

There is a lot that was said by others that I simply don't agree with: Treating tapwater to remove disinfecting agents is fish keeping 101 IMHO.

Having said all of that, I am fortunate enough to live on my own private well now. No more treating water, just straight from the ground into my tanks.

Happy fishkeeping
HarleyK

Respect you opinions/insight 💀🤙… Thanks for the response. I’ll get everything dialed in eventually. Pre filter is in so its one step forward at the least lol. Happy ive been lucky with no “side effects” so far (knock on wood)…

Agree with duanes duanes , it all boils down to exactly what he just posted, along with ones disinfectant residual levels. IMHO always best to drop a dime and speak to someone at your local facility so there are no surprises with regards to max/min levels of whatever disinfectant is being used.
Agree with ya, im not satisfied with the 2024 report. Called my city today and also the water source that sells to the city. Both directed me to the other. I don’t mind visiting their buildings in person if i have too.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RD. and HarleyK
Congrats! Ain't it wonderful?

I haven't bought or used dechlorinator or any other water conditioner for use in my own tanks for over 30 years. Life is good. :)
Better fishing and better water… do u need a neighbor? I need a better place to raise my kid neway 😂💀
 
Unfortunately some of the manufacturers of water conditioners instructions over the years, haven’t helped.

A long read, but the past thread below explains something that has always puzzled me. The vast majority of consumers are using tap water sourced from their local city/town, and have no idea what or how that water has been treated. I’ve been on MFK along with other various fish keeping forums for a lot of years, and this has always struck me as tres bizarre. As HarleyK HarleyK stated, this is fish keeping 101.

Approx 3 yrs ago Seachem decided that due to customers not being able to add 1+1 and divide by 2, they would simplify their dosage instructions on Seachem Safe. This topic was brought up by pops pops , to which I added my 2 cents. https://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/threads/seachem-safe.651005/

If you read that thread, and the links that I posted in that discussion, you'll understand why I didn't agree of the change, and still don't today. Yesterday while attempting to help someone with a chlorine/chloramine situation I see that Seachem has done the same with Prime. I'm at a loss here, has the general public become so lazy and useless that they can't do a bit of research and calculation on their own? Does nobody see an issue here, but me? Seachem is telling you what you should treat your water with, without knowing anything about your local tap water. To me that seems ludicrous.

Seachem Prime instructions circa 2004

DIRECTIONS: Use 1 capful (5 mL) for each 200 L (50 gallons*) of new water. For smaller doses, please note each cap thread is approx. 1 mL). This dose removes approximately 0.6 mg/L ammonia, 3 mg/L chloramine, or 4 mg/L chlorine. May be added to aquarium directly, but better if added to new water first. If adding directly to aquarium, base dose on aquarium volume. Sulfur odor is normal. For exceptionally high chloramine concentrations, a double dose may be used safely. To detoxify nitrite in an emergency, up to 5 times normal dose may be used. If temperature is > 30 °C (86 °F) and chlorine or ammonia levels are low, use a half dose.

Seachem Safe instructions circa 2004

Chlorine: use 5 g (1 tsp.*) to each 1625 L (450 gallons*) of tap water (removes 4 ppm).
Chloramine: use 5 g (1 tsp.*) to each 1250 L (300 gallons*) of tap water (removes 4 ppm).
Ammonia: use 5 g (1 tsp.*) to each 400 L (100 gallons*) of tap water (removes 4 ppm). Do not overdose!



Seemed simple enough to me, and I'm not big on math. First one has to find out if they have chlorine or chloramine as a disinfectant, then find out what the max residual is (posted on annual water reports, many are posted online) and then treat accordingly. Better yet, buy a chlorine test kit and test at your taps, and then treat accordingly. If you have chloramine, buy a Seachem ammonia alert sensor to check for free ammonia (NH3) residual. https://www.seachem.com/ammonia-alert.php
This becomes critical for those that have chloramine treated tap water, and have high pH values out of their tap, as the higher the pH, the more toxic free ammonia becomes.


But I guess that was too difficult for the masses to figure out, so now the most important thing in this hobby (water quality) is left to a by guess or by golly set of instructions.


Seachem Prime instructions circa 2019

https://seachem.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115000125454-Info-Prime-dosing-instructions

Use 1 capful (5 mL) for each 200 L (50 US gallons) of new water. For smaller volumes, please note each cap thread is approximately 1 mL. May be added to aquarium directly, but better if added to new water first. If adding directly to aquarium, base dose on aquarium volume. Sulfur odor is normal. For exceptionally high chloramine concentrations, a double dose may be used safely. To detoxify nitrite in an emergency, up to 5 times normal dose may be used. If temperature is > 30 °C (86 °F) and chlorine or ammonia levels are low, use a half dose.


So I guess Seachem doesn't want to answer any more mathematical equations, or explain how to add 1+1 and divide by 2, so instead of the old ...…. This dose removes approximately 0.6 mg/L ammonia, 3 mg/L chloramine, or 4 mg/L chlorine, it's now become a one size fits all scenario, and if that doesn't work out then by all means double down. If this wasn't such a sad reflection on where todays world is at, I'd laugh. Consumers can figure out how to download & use a Seachem app, but to borrow a line from my dear old dad, they can't find their own ass from a hole in the ground.

I'm going to guess that the vast majority that read this thread, have no idea what their current disinfectant being used is (chlorine or chloramine) or what the ppm residual is at their taps. For those that do, well done!
 
I dunno, RD. RD. , there's very little about that which I find surprising. When electronic calculators became almost universally owned, maybe the end of the 1970's, there was an immediate and precipitous drop in the number of people who could still do even the simplest arithmetic, either in their heads or on paper. They didn't need to do it themselves, they had no time for wasteful extravagances such as "thinking", and so the average intelligence of the human race took a significant hit.

Today, nobody uses a calculator; they just ask AI the question they want answered. Nowadays, they don't even need to type it out, just ask their phones verbally and wait for the verbal response. So now, most people not only can't do the math themselves, but they can't even figure out exactly what math they need to have done for them! They just speak to their smart phones and then wait for a response.

Instructions like those earlier ones from SeaChem are just too complicated for the new breed of humanity. They had to be dumbed down to follow the downward trend of the lowest common denominator of their customer base.

Congratulations, people. We're turning into the Eloi from H.G.Wells' The Time Machine. We don't know what we need to know...we don't know what we don't know...but we diligently toil towards a future in which we don't need to know anything. Lots of us are already well-prepared for that!

No need to worry, though...the Morlocks of marketing will take care of us...
 
  • Like
  • Haha
Reactions: RD. and wednesday13
Unfortunately some of the manufacturers of water conditioners instructions over the years, haven’t helped.

A long read, but the past thread below explains something that has always puzzled me. The vast majority of consumers are using tap water sourced from their local city/town, and have no idea what or how that water has been treated. I’ve been on MFK along with other various fish keeping forums for a lot of years, and this has always struck me as tres bizarre. As HarleyK HarleyK stated, this is fish keeping 101.
Very good read RD 💀🤙… ive always been on the cusp of old and new… id go back and take old any day of the week lol.

Never dove into source water quality readings in the 16 yrs ive been in my current home but i have fish that are over 14 yrs old so ive figured some things out atleast in that time. 💯 not satisfied tho, if theres a problem im going to fix it. Always room for improvements.

I can highly relate to your sentiment as well. No 1 can read anymore or follow directions. Spent many years here helping with acrylic repairs and info. Some people dive right in and do amazing things beyond my own skill set some times ( cough cough Viktor 😂) and others need their hand held with the same information given 10x over. Like ur saying also, the info is out there u just have to research and find it. I didnt make up how to use specific materials. I scoured the internet 20 yrs ago at this point and READ 😂… the good old days before you tube or pictures etc…

Back on point… i used prime/safe 20 yrs ago as well. I found it inconsistent and unreliable. I lost alot of fish in that time. Makes sense now. Never knew i should b contacting the cities i lived in for water reports that correlated on how to use those products. (Lack of reading 😂) Their new directions seem to be a “fail safe”… design 101 is design for the stupidest person out there so that makes perfect sense as well 😂.

I cant jump either way without testing or seeing a problem. My systems are dialed in so much im already cycling out the bad water/chemicals and Duanes backed that up which I honestly didnt expect with him being a water chemist. My drips are highly calculated with certain psi, regulators, gph and redundancy with gauges etc to keep them consistent. Y they work/ed for so long trouble free.

Chlorine tests are on the way 💀🤞… if i cant get a straight answer from my city ill do it myself just like u said in ur last post. We already know my source is bad at 2.06-2.09 chlorine/chloramines. Super interested to see what chlorine level if any is in any number of tanks im dripping and if its consistent.

Im sure i may seem naive. I have to see it in front of me tho to change something. Being in the middle of old and new im stubborn and unwilling to change even tho i know it may b necessary 😂🤙… we’ll get er dialed in here for the better. Highly, highly appreciate the convo and info to read RD. Miss this place back when it was more light hearted and people just shared info/experiences for the better.

I did a 99% w/c for ya this morning on a pair of breeding angels with no water conditioner 😂… i use my “aged” 650g water on drips tho… always more than 1 way to skin the cat
 
  • Like
Reactions: RD. and jjohnwm
I’ve always been careful on how I answer these type of questions, because water quality and set ups can vary greatly from one member to another. No hard and fast rule beyond knowing what one is dealing with, before reacting. No point in adding 1 capful of Prime per 50 gallons of tap water, if your water comes from a well. Lol
 
jjohnwm jjohnwm I understand why Seachem dumbed things down, I simply didn’t understand why they removed the portion that offered more specific details on dosage rates, for those that can still read and write. Not sure if they ever added them back? Maybe they did after my rant, not sure?

Btw…… The CEO of Seachem only spoke so frank with me, as he thought I was someone else, someone that he had a professional relationship with. lol. Nice to know what he really thought of their customer base. Not that I disagreed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jjohnwm
MonsterFishKeepers.com