Cichlid Line Bred vs. Hybrid

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Markm0723;2451559; said:
Aquamojo,

I am not a member of the ACA, so I don't know the answer to this. Does the ACA allow the various "strains" of Oscars, Angels, Discus, and regional races, such as Herichthys carpintis "Escondido"? Because if they do, then they are already accepting line-breeding. Otherwise none of these varieties would exist in the aquarium trade.

Mark


Folks do show Oscars, Angels, Discus...line bred fish. I think the judging is skewed toward the more "wild...natural" appearance. But awards have been given and these fish have won classes and categories. Carpinte Escondio would be considered a tank strain of a geographical variant. Bred pure that doesn't change...bred through successive generations to develop a "super green" Escondido would be considered line bred.

I aware of the apparent double standard when it comes to Discus and Angels....thus my rationale for beginning the conversation within the club.
 
I think if you close your doors to these fish you are opening the door to the formation of the NCA (National Cichlid Association). Then you have two factions competing for much of the same membership base and instead of one large strong group you have two smaller ones.
 
Just thought I would chime in. I am not an ACA member, nor have I ever given thought to joining. It is nothing personal, as I have not educated myself on this organization beyond what I have learned through reading this thread. Though I am not a member, I consider myself a hobbiest and am very much interested in wildlife conservation. I agree that there is a growing need for the ACA to recognize both line bred and hybrids. I would believe that education should be the number one priority of any aquarium based club; There is a need for hybrid keepers, line bred keepers, conservationists, and all others interested in fishkeeping to work together for the purpose of education in all aspects of the hobby.
 
Danger_Chicken;2452206; said:
I think if you close your doors to these fish you are opening the door to the formation of the NCA (National Cichlid Association). Then you have two factions competing for much of the same membership base and instead of one large strong group you have two smaller ones.


Again...nothing in the charter...by-laws...says that the doors are "closed". We have ACA sanctioned shows that have contained Hybrid Classes in the fish show. I have personally seen hybrids in the national show...entered in species classes. The participant either did or didn't know. I believe one year a hybrid did win the class...proving that sometimes not even the judges can tell. (troubling if you think about it)

A National Cichlid Association? You mean as opposed to the American Cichlid Association? That would be tremendous. I would more than likely join that one as well. Contrary to what you might think, I'm not in it for the members. I'm involved in this club because of my passion for the hobby, the relationships I've developed, and because I truly believe that I can help make a difference. I would hope that more folks would feel the same and get involved as well.

I'll tell you two things....first is that the ACA will always be an existing entity. The funds that the club has received over the years is well invested and could go on making grants and helping conservation for as long as I can see. A lack of member would impact an annual show and probably the distribution of the outstanding journal of the ACA, the Buntbarshe. But shows across the country would continue with local clubs.

The second thing is that if by some remote chance another "national" organization would start up...and they had a clear set of goals...and I believed in what they were doing...I'd support it 100% and do whatever I could to help it thrive.

It's all about the hobby, pal. Period.

Andrew...I couldn't agree with you more. That's what this and the various threads are starting to do. Ask any of the folks that have been on this or other boards longer than five years. This same topic back then would have been closed on page 2. There's been some great imput.
 
One of the main reasons i keep fish is because i appreciate their natural beauty. I would love to be able to travel around the world and view the fish i keep in their natural habitats rather than house them in aquaria, but time, money, etc do not permit this, so i have to settle for aquariums. I attempt to keep mine as natural as possible, and only keep natural strains of fish. To me, the whole point of aquariums is to have a slice of nature in your home. (or slices if you have more than one tank, like me). None of my tanks are biotopic, but you wont find bright gravel, fake ornaments, etc. in any of my tanks.

What this all means is that i prefer wild fish and natural habitats. I support the conservation of fish in their natural habitat, but i also understand that hybrids and line bred fish are a significant part of our hobby, and excluding them would be wrong. If someone prefers man-made fish to natural ones, then let them keep them. Think about dogs and cats. Both of these are non-natural, line bred (effectively), probably even hybrids as well, yet most households have at least one of them, and i have NEVER heard someone reccomending the keeping of wolfs and wildcats as opposed to cats and dogs. Why should it be any different with fish? Yes, most cichlids don't have the potential to kill you, but neither do wildcats (the small ones that domestic cats came from, not lions and tigers, etc). So, i think we, as a hobby, need to recognize our differences, accept them, and move on.

However, there is one area where i feel differently: I do not support tbe line breeding and hybridization of any rare or endangered fish, as this kind of ruins it for the natural fish keepers. However, if a fish is common in the hobby, go ahead, hybridize and line breed away :)
 
You agree with Andrew and argue with me - we're saying the same thing. Since you seem to be taking my comments personal I'll stop giving feedback
 
Danger_Chicken;2454892; said:
You agree with Andrew and argue with me - we're saying the same thing. Since you seem to be taking my comments personal I'll stop giving feedback


Since you seem to be missing my point...I think that would be a good idea.
 
Aquamojo;2454985; said:
Since you seem to be missing my point...I think that would be a good idea.


You also missed several of his points... and most of them made a lot of sense... it's a shame you couldn't slow down and comprehend what he was saying to give the rest of us the benefit of hearing a logical conversation...

But you tend to do that...
 
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