Dear Forum, its been 2 months since my last update....50 cms vip red
- Thread starter henward
- Start date
Funny, that sort of comment demonstrates the arogance of many asian aro keepers. Let me explain.
Most asian aro keepers i have encountered believe that small tanks are ok for arowanas.
FALSE
Most asian aro keepers follow guidance from the 'old dogs' of asian aro keeping and follow advise with ABSOLUTELY NO SCIENCE BEHIND IT.
Its a cultural thing, you just follow, DONT THINK, just FOLLOW.
I like to think, people on this forum are thinkers, most of the people on this forum believe in science to keep fish, not heresay and 'old wives tales'.
A smart man told me - "Science always trumps old wives" - your welcome Shawn
This is very true, science cannot be defeated by baseless myth and practice. LIke eating tigers testes. Or eating rhino horn..... all baseless, just myth.
Your comment demonstrates the lack of understanding of the poeple on here.
Many asian aro keepers dont go on here, i agree. But just because they dont doesnt mean they are better keepers.
Most of the images i see on arofanatics.com are under red light, most are fake pictures either altered or under red light. Those that are real under white light are rare.
I am not saying my fish is better, although i love my fish, but i am saying, you cannot judge an arowana under red light.
Also, in this forum, the standard of tank size vs fish potential size and species tend to differ dramatically.
Here, people are encouraged and people are also frowned upon when THEIR TANK IS TOO SMALL!
in asian forums, it is OK and accepted that tanks can be small....
excuse is, lack of space. Well, if you dont have the space, you shouldnt keep it.
It is not at all a waste of time here.
IN fact, i think many ASIAN FISH KEEPERS can learn bucket loads from here.
And it is not a racial thing, IT IS A CULTURAL THING
I am born in philipines but my blood is chinese, but i was raised in New zealand so i have little asian culture.
So i have seen the difference wtih cultures.
With fish keeping, asians have this ELITIST attitude. Especially wiht arowana and Discus.
I used to be a member of A discus forum that was so snobby and arogant, they just put down your fish because its not from their farm or because its eyes were not a particular ratio to its forehead, INSANITY!
this forum is based more on science, and i think asian fish keepers can learn from that.
Many times OVER AND OVER, here are the most common topics in the asian arowana forums
1) my aro is sick
2) my aro is not eating
3) aro is dying
4) help, aro is dead, why?!?!
then you ask simple questions:
1) what is your water parameters
answer: NO ANSWER because they never had the kits to test the blooooody water!! they dont even know what amonia and nitrite and nitrate is!
2) what filtration do you have??
answer: sponge filter or internal, or some small obscure totally useless cheap filter unit that does no more than mechanical filtration
3) what size is your tank?
answer: tank size so small, even a baby arowana wont be comfortable in it
4) what filter media do you have?
answer: totally unaware of the nitrogen cycle and how a filter should and how it works!! totally clue less, no research done into the filtration at all.
any did all the above happen?
becauase, all they did was listen to some opportunistic fish retailer (not all are of course) and bought a fish, small tank, crappy filter.... 2 week slater, ish dead.
then that person probably goes to the shop and the shop owner goes.... Oh, you need this its better, here is another fish, try it.
I have seen almost full grown arowanas in 4 foot tanks.
I have seen silver aros in 4 foot tanks that have spinal curve cos of the tnak size.
ask here, the average size they recommend for an arowana, then ask asian forums... you will see, the size differs by 30% to 50% .....
some say that the old aros are traded in?
i dont think so, i believe many die.
Unless i get first hand evidence - i think many die, thats why when youask of lifespan, many asian forums will say average 6 to 8 years.
because most dont live past that. arownas in public aquariums, the same species can live over 20 to 25 years!
the small tanks and under filtration expose the fish to waste and the chronic exposure eventually shorten thier lives, just like humans if we expose ourselves to toxins constantly!! thnk, smokers and people who eat only junk food.
MYTHS I HAVE HEARD:
1) centipede makes arowana red.
Centipede has nothing special in it to make arowana red, just because the centipeded LOOKS RED doesnt mean it contains beta carotene or any astaxanthin
2) arowana cant be with other fish
clearly false
3) arowana msut have a quiet tank, no water sound
... ARE YOU FRIGGING KIDDING?
4) dont feed your aro too much, if it grows big, colour wont be nice.
...mmm so you purposely stunt your arowana ? interesting. this probably comes from the desire for smaller arowana cos of tank space lacking.
just a few myths that i have heard that are totally ridiculous.
I dont meant o personally attack you, i am not, but your comment actually offends me and im sure offends many people here. becuase this site, i th kn is if not the most, one of the most knowledgeable forums that exists about all types of fish.
I have heard some silly things said on asian forums, and OF COURSE some golden advice too!!!
I find that if you dont agree with the 'old boys' in those forums, specifically arofanatics, they tend to dislike you....
they think its their way, no doubt some keepers are good and can make arowanas red.
but red arowanas shouldnt just be about making it as red as possible, it should be about longevity, potential max size.
anyways, what a rant, but your comment i really didnt like.
also, why would you sell a brilliant looking arowna thats mature with great colours to trade it in for a small one?
i mean, the point is to have an arowana that is very red and mature isnt it?
My thought on his comment: He's right though. If you look majority of MFKers are from the U.S, they can't keep Asian Aros. Usually you see U.S based members commenting on Asian Aros, when they probably never even had one. I said many, not all. I don't hate MFK or anything. It's a great site for monster fish and science like you said! I've learned a lot here.
Like you said, a lot of people have small tanks for the Aro. When they get too big, they trade to the farm to get smaller one to keep. Or sometimes they get bored and want to try something new. Just my guess. But, I've seen some knowledgable people on AF. They are science people too. They need more of those people. I'd say AF has gotten better than before. It used to be worse.
Like you said, a lot of people have small tanks for the Aro. When they get too big, they trade to the farm to get smaller one to keep. Or sometimes they get bored and want to try something new. Just my guess. But, I've seen some knowledgable people on AF. They are science people too. They need more of those people. I'd say AF has gotten better than before. It used to be worse.
My thought on his comment: He's right though. If you look majority of MFKers are from the U.S, they can't keep Asian Aros. Usually you see U.S based members commenting on Asian Aros, when they probably never even had one. I said many, not all. I don't hate MFK or anything. It's a great site for monster fish and science like you said! I've learned a lot here.
Like you said, a lot of people have small tanks for the Aro. When they get too big, they trade to the farm to get smaller one to keep. Or sometimes they get bored and want to try something new. Just my guess. But, I've seen some knowledgable people on AF. They are science people too. They need more of those people. I'd say AF has gotten better than before. It used to be worse.
haha, yes if its worse before, then thats scary! but fair enough
Agree, US has no asian arowanas, but there are canadians here too im sure, or other asians.
English people and europeans that have Arowanas.
I think that sometimes to say that jsut because something is more abandunt from asia doesnt mean they know best.
Most of the random stuff i see on AF are not science based, but yes, i have seen many people also using logic to teach others.
I think, keeping fish is generally similar, no matter what fish - google has many info too. if you apply the science in one species, you can generally appy the same logic to another just slightly different due to specific specimen need.
Are you taking your frustration from Af out on what I said? I said nothing about myths yes science does trump myths I do think MFK is a great site for filteration, tank builds, and monster fish that people have first hand experience with, But when it comes to Asian aro most and im saying most not all dont know what they're talking about and they are the ones that always have something to say. Where did your fishes come from? did they come from a farm in Europe, Canada, New Zealand I dont think so and where are most of the farms that breed Asian aros? I was not talking about any other fish than the Asian aro. Why is there no other farms other than the ones in Asia. Are you saying that there are hobbiest that would have more knowledge than a farmer I would like to meet this person and is he on MFK.
I agree that some of the guys in Asia would learn a lot from this site but not about Asian aros the people I know they're friends are the farmers here in Indo so who would you take advice from an MFK member or from someone who has been breeding Asian aro for longer than you have been alive. And I never said anything about selling my fish for a young one see you are going back to AF I dont support that site or any site I like to learn about all sorts of things when it come to my fish MFK has thought me a lot about filteration and tank builds. I bet you have been into Asian aro for no more than a few years am I right or wrong you seem like a smart guy so you do a lot reading and now you know more than the average person. Most of the members on AF are young guys and with young guys they all want to show up one another it's like with they're cars and stuff thats how it is in Asia. Sorry dont mean to go off but your rant had nothig to do with what I was saying.
Very handsome fish. Wish we could have them here. personally i like the " natural" colored fish over all the designer colors out there. still makes no sense why we keep them out.. but keeps the blackmarket for them strong i guess.
I Agree,
There is a DISTINCT different with a 'KEEPER' and 'FARMER'.
so that cannot be compared.
i would not doubt a farmers word, though i have heard some of it and it doesnt make sense, some farmers still believe in myths.
but farmers are experienced.
in saying that, farmers jobs are not to keep fish for as long as possible and old as possible.
generally speaking, a farmer of arowanas job is to have the highest yield to make their operation as economically viable and profitable.
Keepers how ever are different, they are not about profit, generally they are about the best looking fish.
i agree with you how ever, that farmers would have more legitimate knowledge about arowanas, but they keep their arowanas in giant ponds.
perhaps, if you ask some farmers about the details of tank filtration - i would , (i could be wrong) doubt they they would know. some may, but pond and tank is different.
a pond would be tens of thousands of litres or more. tank.... completely different.
also ponds get water topped up constantly from springs and rain collected, this automatically dilutes waste, in a pond may have a very high 'water to fish ratio' that cannot or almost impossible to achieve in a closed tank system.
but i agree for the most part, farmers im sure will have knowledge, but a different type.
Am i taking my frustrations about AF? probably lol
just got annoyed at the arogance and elitism, that really annoys me.
but, i found that many there give advice like it is gospel but it is somewhat wrong, especially when it comes to filtration and tank size.
of course there are exceptions.
also a lot of heresay on that forum, 'things passed down from old to young' that are well, lack of a better word....B*llS*IT
but anyways, no more atackign that.
i like that photo of the xb in natural light! that is a beauty!
